How does Sola Fide survive Acts 14?

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How does the belief in Sola Fide survive the simplest scrutiny regarding Acts 14?

*In those days, some Jews from Antioch and Iconium
arrived and won over the crowds.
They stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city,
supposing that he was dead.
But when the disciples gathered around him,
he got up and entered the city.
On the following day he left with Barnabas for Derbe.

After they had proclaimed the good news to that city
and made a considerable number of disciples,
they returned to Lystra and to Iconium and to Antioch.
They strengthened the spirits of the disciples
and exhorted them to persevere in the faith, saying,
“It is necessary for us to undergo many hardships
to enter the Kingdom of God.”
They appointed presbyters for them in each Church and,
with prayer and fasting, commended them to the Lord
in whom they had put their faith.
Then they traveled through Pisidia and reached Pamphylia.
After proclaiming the word at Perga they went down to Attalia.
From there they sailed to Antioch,
where they had been commended to the grace of God
for the work they had now accomplished.
And when they arrived, they called the Church together
and reported what God had done with them
and how he had opened the door of faith to the Gentiles.
Then they spent no little time with the disciples.
*

These are the Apostles, and first disciples of Christ. And they MUST undergo hardships to enter the Kingdom of God. So they MUST perform works as part of their salvation.

How does Faith Alone stand against this? It can’t be spelled out more clearly. They have true faith, but they STILL must do these works, or they WILL NOT enter God’s Kingdom.
 
How does Sola Fide survive the title of the book; Acts of the Apostles - as in “acts” of the Apostles?

Faith in Jesus - and actions which prove it.
 
zz912 said:
These are the Apostles, and first disciples of Christ. And they MUST undergo hardships to enter the Kingdom of God. So they MUST perform works as part of their salvation.
Click to expand...
I think I agree with you, but can you explain how you go from 1) undergoing hardships to 2) performing works? How are they connected?
 
zz912 said:
How does the belief in Sola Fide survive the simplest scrutiny regarding Acts 14?

*In those days, some Jews from Antioch and Iconium
arrived and won over the crowds.
They stoned Paul and dragged him out of the city,
supposing that he was dead.
But when the disciples gathered around him,
he got up and entered the city.
On the following day he left with Barnabas for Derbe.

After they had proclaimed the good news to that city
and made a considerable number of disciples,
they returned to Lystra and to Iconium and to Antioch.
They strengthened the spirits of the disciples
and exhorted them to persevere in the faith, saying,
“It is necessary for us to undergo many hardships
to enter the Kingdom of God.”*
They appointed presbyters for them in each Church and,
with prayer and fasting, commended them to the Lord
in whom they had put their faith.
Then they traveled through Pisidia and reached Pamphylia.
After proclaiming the word at Perga they went down to Attalia.
From there they sailed to Antioch,
where they had been commended to the grace of God
for the work they had now accomplished.
And when they arrived, they called the Church together
and reported what God had done with them
and how he had opened the door of faith to the Gentiles.
Then they spent no little time with the disciples.

These are the Apostles, and first disciples of Christ. And they MUST undergo hardships to enter the Kingdom of God. So they MUST perform works as part of their salvation.

How does Faith Alone stand against this? It can’t be spelled out more clearly. They have true faith, but they STILL must do these works, or they WILL NOT enter God’s Kingdom.
Click to expand...
Sola fide doesn’t teach against this. All sole fide states is that we access justification by grace alone through faith alone. Faith alone in no way excludes the necessity of good work, as they are God’s command, that we care for the least of His children. But those good works do not merit us salvation.

Luther, in his preface to Galatians 5:6 says:
“Faith must of course be sincere. It must be a faith that performs good works through love. If faith lacks love it is not true faith. Thus the Apostle bars the way of hypocrites to the kingdom of Christ on all sides. He declares on the one hand, “In Christ Jesus circumcision availeth nothing,” i.e., works avail nothing, but faith alone, and that without any merit whatever, avails before God. On the other hand, the Apostle declares that without fruits faith serves no purpose. To think, “If faith justifies without works, let us work nothing,” is to despise the grace of God. Idle faith is not justifying faith. In this terse manner Paul presents the whole life of a Christian. Inwardly it consists in faith towards God, outwardly in love towards our fellow-men.”

Jon
 
Paul is pretty clear about how we are justified in Ephesians, too.

Ephesians 2:8-9 “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.”
 
Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.
 
ConsciousCoward said:
Paul is pretty clear about how we are justified in Ephesians, too.

Ephesians 2:8-9 “For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.”
Click to expand...
It seems the Gospel (and Paul) is pretty clear about Sola Fide.

“You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.”
- James 2:24

“For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead.”
- James 2:26

And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing.
- 1 Corinthians 13:2

It is Catholic teaching that grace through faith is a wondrous gift from God. However, also it is the teaching of the Church and Paul for faith to be of any avail, it must work through charity, as outlined in Galatians 5:6 of Paul’s epistle.

“For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but* only faith working through love*.”
- Galatians 5:6
 
It has to do with what grace literally is. Grace is a completely free gift from God. It’s impossible to earn grace, or dispense grace, or anything of the sort. Faith is even a completely free gift of this sort. Salvation is a completely free gift of this sort.

From the Oxford English Dictionary:
3 (in Christian belief) the free and unmerited favour of God, as manifested in the salvation of sinners and the bestowal of blessings.

Grace is impossible to earn by acts, or else it would not be grace. And we are saved through grace. We even have faith through grace.
 
The difference between Catholics and Protestants on this is basically an exercise in equivocation.

Catholics define faith as one of the three theological virtues, along with hope and love.

In this view faith is the beginning of Christian life and is its foundation. Hope and love flow from this faith and further solidify it. All three are necessary for salvation and Christian life hence Jame’s letter).

Proetstant theology says that faith is defined as the individual turning his entire life over to God. This assumes faith and also necessarily includes hope and love. Hope and love are faith’s “fruits” but they insist(just like the Catholic Church) that faith is the prime mover of the Christian.

Therefore, according to their definitions, Catholics rightly deny, and Protestants rightly affirm that we are saved by Faith Alone.

You would think that since both sides accept the same data(the Bible) that we would agree on this simple point and be a little further to reconciliation.

Yet the debate over a definition goes on and on…
 
The_GreyPilgrim said:
The difference between Catholics and Protestants on this is basically an exercise in equivocation.
Click to expand...
This assertion downplays the degree of difference and mischaracterizes it as mere sophistry. Rather go on at length, I’ll boil it down to relatively straightforward concepts. At the heart of the division are the concepts of monergism and synergism.

A monergist approach to salvation would state Holy Spirit brings about salvation through spiritual regeneration without participation from the individual, presuming they possess faith. It subsumes there is no holiness in an individual and it is completely regenerated by an act of the Holy Spirit. It depicted as an event or single regenerative act of God. Salvation is thought to be lost once faith is lost.

A synergist approach to salvation would state Holy Spirit brings about salvation through spiritual regeneration with participation from the individual. It subsumes there is some holiness in an individual that can cultivated through collaborative effort. It depicted as an ongoing regenerative process brought about by God’s grace combined with our faith and charity. By sinning mortally, salvation is thought to be lost.

Admittedly, this is an oversimplification of the debate but for the purposes of this thread, it demonstrates the matter is not mere equivocation.
 
Barbkw said:
How does Sola Fide survive the title of the book; Acts of the Apostles - as in “acts” of the Apostles?

Faith in Jesus - and actions which prove it.
Click to expand...
Protestants are afraid to say that they have any part in salvation. they let everything to God alone. Even if Jesus Himself has said that we must cooperate. those who reject Christ’s teaching have not cooperated with God in their salvation and wll lose salvation.

Jesus has said who would be saved. you must work.

I can see how some protestants are coming around closer to agree wiht what the CC has been teaching for 2000 yrs.

I often wonder if protestants do understand what the Church teach on this. Being outside the church is already a grieveous sin against God.
 
Barbkw said:
How does Sola Fide survive the title of the book; Acts of the Apostles - as in “acts” of the Apostles?

Faith in Jesus - and actions which prove it.
Click to expand...
I agree with this and think you have it right. However, not that you need the help, I would add a wrinkle or more nuanced understanding of the relationship between faith and works. Yes, it is our faith that provides us with the Grace of Salvation. However, our faith, if heartfelt, should motivate us to do good works. These good works become the evidence of our faith, or as Barb put it the “proof” for our faith. This is where I get out on a limb. A person who claims to have faith and yet can provide no proof (to God not humans) of their faith through good works could be judged ( by God not humans) to be lacking in faith or to have a false faith.

Conversely, a person, such as an atheist, could run around doing plenty of good works. I think this is great. However, we can’t say that that person will gain the grace of salvation. I truly and sincerely hope that God, in his infinte wisdom and mercy, may grant them some avenue to reconciliation before their souls are finally condemmed to eternal seperation, but I can’t see how. Thankfully, it is not for me to judge.

Please don’t misunderstand, I am not condeming anyone nor passing judgment as to what may constitute good works or the quality or quantity of good works that may be needed to provide ample evidence of a true faith. This is something that each individual has to work out between themselves and God. And, I have no doubt that we will each be brought to task on the final day. Let us hope that we are worthy.
 
LongJohnSilver said:
I think I agree with you, but can you explain how you go from 1) undergoing hardships to 2) performing works? How are they connected?
Click to expand...
Undergoing a hardship is a work. You make the choice to stand and deliver the Gospel message.
 
JonNC said:
Sola fide doesn’t teach against this. All sole fide states is that we access justification by grace alone through faith alone. Faith alone in no way excludes the necessity of good work, as they are God’s command, that we care for the least of His children. But those good works do not merit us salvation.

Jon
Click to expand...
This may be the Lutheran position, but for many who believe in Sola Fide, this is not the case. Many see works as an outcropping of faith, but are not required for salvation. They believe you can have faith, be saved, and refuse to do good works.

You are so close to Catholicism it is tough to tell your theology from ours. You would make a strong and devout Catholic. I pray someday you will earnestly ponder over coming into the Church.
 
Fisher said:
Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.
Click to expand...
How about Matthew 25: 31-46 "When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit upon his glorious throne, and all the nations will be assembled before him.

And he will separate them one from another, as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.

He will place the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

Then the king will say to those on his right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father. Inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world.

For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, a stranger and you welcomed me, naked and you clothed me, ill and you cared for me, in prison and you visited me.’

Then the righteous will answer him and say, 'Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you drink?

When did we see you a stranger and welcome you, or naked and clothe you?

When did we see you ill or in prison, and visit you?’

And the king will say to them in reply, ‘Amen, I say to you, whatever you did for one of these least brothers of mine, you did for me.’

Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.

For I was hungry and you gave me no food, I was thirsty and you gave me no drink, a stranger and you gave me no welcome, naked and you gave me no clothing, ill and in prison, and you did not care for me.’

Then they will answer and say, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or ill or in prison, and not minister to your needs?’

He will answer them, ‘Amen, I say to you, what you did not do for one of these least ones, you did not do for me.’

And these will go off to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life."

We can go back and forth all day cherry picking the Bible, but waht it really boils down to is what is faith if you do nothing with it. The above is a classic example of those who have faith and do nothing with it and those who do.
 
Everyone had very good points and arguments on this. I look forward to reading more of this forum.

Going to the heart of the matter, zz912 pointed out:

“We must go through many hardships to enter the kingdom of God,” they said.

My take from what I’ve learned from reading the Bible and other Christian studies:

To enter is infinitive and has the same meaning as present participle. So it can say even:

“We must go through many hardships (upon, while) entering the kingdom of God”

These hardships are not necessarily equal even to “good works”. Sometimes we go through hardships as Christians and we still don’t do the things we really should do or do them the way we’re supposed to. It may in fact be better to look at hardships as God’s own chastening.

Prov 3:11-12 (NIV) “My son, do not despise the Lord’s discipline and do not resent his rebuke, because the Lord disciplines those he loves, as a father the son he delights in.”

and…

Romans 8:28 Or that all things work together for good to those who love God, who; or that in all things God works together with those who love him to bring about what is good—with those who

No sincere Protestant I know of discounts works as not being important. They are rather the evidence of our faith. And even that faith is a gift from God. In that way, none of us can ever boast by saying we saved ourself.
 
Soldier_Of_God said:
This assertion downplays the degree of difference and mischaracterizes it as mere sophistry. Rather go on at length, I’ll boil it down to relatively straightforward concepts. At the heart of the division are the concepts of monergism and synergism.

A monergist approach to salvation would state Holy Spirit brings about salvation through spiritual regeneration without participation from the individual, presuming they possess faith. It subsumes there is no holiness in an individual and it is completely regenerated by an act of the Holy Spirit. It depicted as an event or single regenerative act of God. Salvation is thought to be lost once faith is lost.

A synergist approach to salvation would state Holy Spirit brings about salvation through spiritual regeneration with participation from the individual. It subsumes there is some holiness in an individual that can cultivated through collaborative effort. It depicted as an ongoing regenerative process brought about by God’s grace combined with our faith and charity. By sinning mortally, salvation is thought to be lost.

Admittedly, this is an oversimplification of the debate but for the purposes of this thread, it demonstrates the matter is not mere equivocation.
Click to expand...
My summery was essentially JPII’s position in his “Joint Declaration on Justification” that was applauded by German Lutherans. Did you read it?
 
LongJohnSilver said:
I think I agree with you, but can you explain how you go from 1) undergoing hardships to 2) performing works? How are they connected?
Click to expand...
The hardships they were undergoing were directly related to their attempt to spread the gospel. They are basically saying we have to press on to enter the kingdom of God. They are talking about their works.
 
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