How has the Pennsylvania scandal affected you personally?

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As a new convert… I just don’t understand. I have never viewed priests as above me. I was taught they are servants. But perhaps by the time I was brought in, the mentality was already shifting.

PS: Having witnessed a priest be accused and what happened after… I can say the response was swift, the priest was removed from service. There was no cover up or shifting to a new parish.
 
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I wonder how many Catholics will give up on their faith because of this. How many will say the Church can’t be considered a moral authority?
 
I do not believe when asking a question of what is Truth or what are the Truths of the Church handed down by Jesus, the bishops or priests ever say just “trust us”. They are willing to teach and have provided us with many, many ways to learn the Truth.
We are an apostolic Church. Our faith was handed down to us by the apostles. We follow the Tradition that the Church has preserved all these years.
It is also our individual responsibility to read and study, to read the catechisms, the Bible (a Catholic bible), the encyclicals, the doctors of the Church and other saints writings and also to ask questions. There are good bishops and priests out there.

An excellent person, I think, to watch on EWTN, is Father Pacwa. He has a question and answer show and explains things very well and have never heard him just say “trust us”.
EWTN radio has many question and answer shows.

As far as Fridays and eating meat this is from the 1983 Code of Canon Law:
Canon 1250. The penitential days and times in the universal Church are every Friday of the whole year and the season of Lent.

— Canon 1251. Abstinence from eating meat or another food according to the prescriptions of the conference of bishops is to be observed on Fridays throughout the year unless ( nisi ) they are solemnities; abstinence and fast are to be observed on Ash Wednesday and on the Friday of the Passion and Death of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

*****— Canon 1253. The conference of bishops can determine more precisely the observance of fast and abstinence as well as substitute other forms of penance, especially works of charity and exercises of piety, in whole or in part, for abstinence and fast.

As someone else said, it is a discipline, not a doctrine and the conference of bishops decide.

God bless
 
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Yes, with children.
But as we see by the McCarrick scandal, and now the scandal at St. John’s seminary in Boston, not to mention what is happening in seminaries around the world and with sisters who are also coming out with allegations of abuse at the hands of priests and Bishops, I can’t say that it has been “dealt with”.
 
I believe the Church is handling all of this. We have to put our trust in God and that He is the one leading the Church.
 
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But how do we know what is truth? We are required, as Catholics, to rely on the bishops for truth.
Now, you know better. They’re just people, not divine beings.
When we question, we’re admonished with “Trust us.”
Politicians say the same thing. I don’t trust anyone and never will.
Politicians are accountable to their constituents on election day. Church leadership is not accountable to the laity because there is no election day. We can’t vote them out despite being told to follow their shepherding.
We’re taught that the Holy Spirit guides the Magesterium, that the Holy Spirit won’t let them get it wrong.
Isn’t that only in matters of the Faith? Once again, they’re just people.
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Isn’t it Faith AND Morals? They’ve dropped the ball on the morals part.
 
If that is the case, then explain how we got to where we are today.
I trust God, it’s the men who are supposed to serve him I am having trouble trusting.

I am sorry, but the time for hoping the clergy can clean up their own house is gone.
 
I’ve heard Catholics from the generation before me talk about priests who everyone knew they should stay away from. As a child I had no idea what molestation was about. Fortunately, it wasn’t part of my growing up. I wonder what it must have like back then? Where were the parents? In one of the most notorious cases in my diocese a young, hip and popular priest was driving around in a sports car and having regular sleep overs with boys. Today this would send up red flags all over the place.

We’ve cleaned up in our diocese. I think there have just been two credible accusations over the past 15 years and that has been by church employees. I could be wrong, but I do know at my parish we’re vigilant had have a safe environment for our children.
 
I am not and will not give up on the Church.
However, calling for men to be held accountable for their evil acts and bad decisions, is what we need to clean up our Church. And it needs to be loud and we, the laity, need to DEMAND accountability.
 
Here is probably the best summation of the situation that I have come across so far.


An interesting paragraph that I feel is easy to miss.
But meaningful lay involvement in personnel matters is a difficult thing for the Church to mandate, beyond the existing requirement for diocesan review boards, because of the Church’s theological understanding of the governance ministry of bishops, and because lay professional Church administrators can become as institutionalized as clerical collaborators, and can be, for reasons of job security, reticent to blow the whistle when bishops act negligently.
 
I posted before…but I’m still reacting. The Pope finally made a statement, which I think is not strong enough. This latest scandal publicity cost me a night of sleep and a day of missed activities and sullied the feast of the Assumption. I am still sickened by it and trying not to let it affect me any further. …but it is.
Someone said these priests were ‘only human’ and ‘fallible’. They are not ‘only human’ …they are monsters.
 
I am not attempting to excuse anything… but I think it helps to understand the culture of that time.

This is just how people were. You didn’t speak about abuse. You swept it under the rug. Often you blamed the victim.

I was not abused by priests but that was the mentality my aunts and uncles had, and why abuse flourished in my family for so long.
 
the time for hoping the clergy can clean up their own house is gone
I’ll agree with that but we do not rely on man’s efforts. It is God who will clean His house and He will choose just the right men and the right way to do it. It is up to us, to cling firmly to Him and you aren’t going to find Him in any other religion, denomination, or secular environment. He is still in His Holy Church and just like the women who stood by Him at the cross, I think we need to be there for Him.
 
You in the general sense, not you personally.
As in all the people, clergy and lay, who don’t want to admit this is a systemic problem and that we all must be diligent in rooting out this evil that has taken hold in our Church
Yes. We also have to realize that once we set the precedent that not even Catholic clergy are above suspicion or above consequences for these grave offenses, there will be far less room for anyone else to claim an “out.”

As a Church, we have to realize that the policies and attitudes of the institutional Church also set the model for the Domestic Church, where this kind of offense is far more prevalent and yet sometimes also covered up out of shame or a feeling that no “decent” family could ever have someone in it who could do such a thing.

Yes, I mean the pastors and bishops have to be a model for wives and mothers and aunts and other family members who have the duty and authority to protect children who have been the victims of sexual abuse. What the bishops do not have the courage to do, the wives and mothers (or husbands and fathers, if it is not the head of the household who is the offender) will have more difficulty finding the courage to do. When the bishops can love the sinner and yet show no tolerance for the sin nor any lack of protection for the victims of the sin, then the families confronted with this problem will be better-able to confront it and deal with it immediately upon becoming aware of it.

Likewise, if churches of every denomination do their jobs with regards to protecting children and young people from sexual and even emotional predators, other organizations that cater to children and young people, such as special-interest clubs and sports leagues, will have a model to follow.

That is what victims need. We need to keep protection of the vulnerable, especially the vulnerable yet developmentally innocent and naive, at the forefront. While the premise that everyone is innocent until found guilty is very important, it is secondary to an abundance of care for those who cannot defend themselves. These situations must be dealt with charitably and with justice, always, but nevertheless they must always be dealt with and never ignored.
I’ll agree with that but we do not rely on man’s efforts. It is God who will clean His house and He will choose just the right men and the right way to do it. It is up to us, to cling firmly to Him and you aren’t going to find Him in any other religion, denomination, or secular environment. He is still in His Holy Church and just like the women who stood by Him at the cross, I think we need to be there for Him.
Yes. We ought to look at staying as being here to do our part to defend the Church in Her hour of need. This is an assault on the Church. The right response is not to freeze nor to scatter. It is to join together in one mind and to act.
 
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Yes. We ought to look at staying as being here to do our part to defend the Church in Her hour of need. This is an assault on the Church. The right response is not to freeze nor to scatter. It is to join together in one mind and to act.
Yes, definitely.
 
I posted before…but I’m still reacting. The Pope finally made a statement, which I think is not strong enough. This latest scandal publicity cost me a night of sleep and a day of missed activities and sullied the feast of the Assumption. I am still sickened by it and trying not to let it affect me any further. …but it is.
Someone said these priests were ‘only human’ and ‘fallible’. They are not ‘only human’ …they are monsters.
Yes. The dioceses (or archdioceses) of Louisville, Boston, Portland, Tuscon and Spokane might have been “surprised” about the gravity of this and how it must be handled. There was maybe some shred of “we didn’t know it was this bad” or “we were taking the advice of mental health professionals” possible.

That was back in the early 2000s, though. It has been over 15 years since the first version of the Charter for the Protection of Children and Young People was put out by the USCCB. There is no excuse for any diocese or bishop not to have this cleaned up by now. It needed to have been the number one priority from the time the bishops admitted the disastrous consequences and betrayal that “handling things in a discrete manner” caused.

This matter is not just at the forefront in the Archdiocese of Portland in Oregon. It is just the way things are done. People still complain about having to take the training and follow the rules, though. It just floors me.

When a priest who offends is caught and turned over to the authorities and pays the consequences for his crime by loss of ministry and prison time, it is extremely sad that it happened and yet if the signs are that he was turned over and dealt with at the first sign of this kind of behavior it is also a good sign. It means someone is being vigilant, someone is taking these dangers seriously, someone has the courage to act.

Let us take the example of Angel Perez, however:
Perez, a pastor at St. Luke Catholic Church in Woodburn since 2008, was arrested Aug. 13, 2012, after the boy spent the previous night at his home. The priest had asked the boy’s parents whether he could take the boy on a trip to the mountains, court documents said.


In the ideal world, if a priest ever proposes an overnight trip without other chaperones, the parents immediately see the problem with that and not only refuse the proposal but report the incident to the vicar of clergy. This was a well-liked priest, as I understand it. That shouldn’t matter. Sexual predators are often charming and personable, rather than obviously “creepy.” It does not matter if they are sociopaths with no conscience or tormented souls who are prone to grievous sin in spite of their best efforts. That is a matter for their spiritual directors, not the faithful as a whole. What matters is never letting the duty to think the best of others get in the way of protecting the most vulnerable among us from wolves in sheep’s clothing–or shepherd’s clothing, either.
 
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So, not sure if you realize but these are not new cases. Some of this goes back to the 1940’s. Most of the priests are deceased. I also believe not all were priests, some were deacons and some were lay people
 
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