How has Vatican II helped the Church

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Since I got into the Latin Mass about a year and half or so, I have done research about the modern history of it and how Vatican II has effected it.Through my research I have discoverd several different things where Vatican II has had an impact and some of it may not be so good.

So I got this question then:In what ways has Vatican II had a positive impact on the modern church? Cause to be honest I’m not sure what the answer to that question is.
 
I believe that there is a renewed understanding of the role of the laity in the Church. That we are to be active in our faith, and not just observers, or merely present as the priest does what he does. I believe that this applies to both inside and outside the liturgical functions (ie. Mass)
 
Well, it really kick-started that whole “understand the faith” movement.

Catechesis is better than ever

Vocations to the Priesthood are skyrocketed to the point I don’t know if the seminaries will be able to handle all these men

Reverence is supreme

The governments world-wide recognize the truth of Catholic teaching

The understanding of other religions is such that the RCC now claims over 3/4 of the population of the globe

The Real Presence is 100% unquestioned across the board

And the Jesuits are starting a long-range shooting team to compete in the world F-Class championships.

It’s been super!👍
 
BlindManWalking said:
Well, it really kick-started that whole “understand the faith” movement.

Catechesis is better than ever

Vocations to the Priesthood are skyrocketed to the point I don’t know if the seminaries will be able to handle all these men

Reverence is supreme

The governments world-wide recognize the truth of Catholic teaching

The understanding of other religions is such that the RCC now claims over 3/4 of the population of the globe

The Real Presence is 100% unquestioned across the board

And the Jesuits are starting a long-range shooting team to compete in the world F-Class championships.

It’s been super!👍
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Sarcasm is VERY uncharitable.
 
Big_Feet said:
I believe that there is a renewed understanding of the role of the laity in the Church. That we are to be active in our faith, and not just observers, or merely present as the priest does what he does.
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This was addressed by Pope Pius XII directly and explicitly in his encyclical Mediator Dei (which predated the council by 15 years), and was already being addressed by the Church (at least implicitly) at the beginning of the 20th century. What we’ve got at the moment - it seems to me - is a false understanding of participation which is coupled with a confusion between the clergy and the laity - a confusion whose solution often patronizes both laity and clergy to the point where it’s insulting and denies the ontological change that comes about at ordination. Just my silly thoughts on the matter 🙂

Off the top of my head I can think of two positives:
  1. A greater appreciation for true, authentic liturgical practice. While I don’t hold to the myth so often repeated that before Vatican II the liturgy was awful and full of abuses - I affirm the positive fact that since the council we’ve come to a greater appreciation of the role that liturgy plays in our lives as Catholics (in the West, anyway). However, this is a positive that comes from a negative (namely, liturgical disorientation and destruction) so it’s a bit of a stretch.
  2. One real positive is that as far as I know from what people have said to me (I’m only 21) it’s true that certain devotional practices were in fact quite ‘mechanical’ prior to the council to the point where it became silly and/or Pharisaical. We’ve been given more responsibility and guidance and a greater emphasis has been placed on the interior observances of which the exterior is only a manifestation (but we’ve also sometimes gone too far and totally forgotten the interior life).
Just my quick thoughts.
 
Big_Feet said:
Sarcasm is VERY uncharitable.
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Personally, I think coming in this section and baiting people is uncharitable.

Here’s a “real” answer:

It’s separated the wheat from the chaff.

The modernist from the traditionalist.

It’s allowed the ability for Catholics to point out their perversity and lack of fidelity to the faith and true social justice and the common good with vague language that results in:

religious indifferentism, lack of structured roles in gender, lack of belief in the necessity of evangelizing, etc.

And funnily enough, I can still see everything I know of Catholicism in the documents without adopting the viewpoint of the liberal.

So, basically, I don’t think it accomplished anything but a bunch of in-fighting.
 
jasonjessica09 said:
Since I got into the Latin Mass about a year and half or so, I have done research about the modern history of it and how Vatican II has effected it.Through my research I have discoverd several different things where Vatican II has had an impact and some of it may not be so good.

So I got this question then:In what ways has Vatican II had a positive impact on the modern church? Cause to be honest I’m not sure what the answer to that question is.
Click to expand...
Honestly, the number of good things I attributed the council have failed to hold up under scrutiny one after another. I’d welcome any suggestions because I can’t think of anything, either. I see good things, but the more I learn the more I find they were better yet, before.
 
The true, true efforts of Vatican II have yet to come upon the Church. We are seeing slight sparks here and there, but we have yet to truly implement and understand the Council. We have absolutely been called, as lay Catholics, to engage the world. But we have not been called, nor will we ever be, to be “mini clerics.” The priest’s environment is the clerical duties. The lay person’s environment is the world. It is the priest’s duty to offer sacrifice. It is the lay person’s duty to bring the world to the Church.
 
Rich_C said:
Honestly, the number of good things I attributed the council have failed to hold up under scrutiny one after another. I’d welcome any suggestions because I can’t think of anything, either. I see good things, but the more I learn the more I find they were better yet, before.
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Hindsight is always 20-20, and, as humans, we all have the tendency to look at the past through the proverbial rose-colored glasses.

As far as I am concerned, the Second Vatican Councl was a good thing.
It shows that the Church, like the world she is part of, is fluid and able of growth.
Times change, and how we understand and teach truths changes. That does not mean that the Truth has changed.

50 years out of 2000 is not a very long time. I am confident that the pendulum will settle soon, but it moves hard left & hard right before finally settles in the middle.
 
Big_Feet said:
I believe that there is a renewed understanding of the role of the laity in the Church. That we are to be active in our faith, and not just observers, or merely present as the priest does what he does. I believe that this applies to both inside and outside the liturgical functions (ie. Mass)/QUOTE Both my parents grew up pre Vatican II and they participated and were active in their Faith a lot.

Vatican II called for “actuosa participatio which in reality is more of internal active participation, not an external"business”.

In the pre Vatican II days there was a lot of partipatio, not only with internal prayer and offering oneself in the Sacrifice, but all the signs of the Cross, all the genuflections and kneeling, etc.
I adore God now exclusively at the Traditional Latin Mass, and participate a lot more now than I did in 38 years of going to the ordinary form.
Not pitting the two forms against just my observations.
Lex Orandi Lex Credendi.
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YoungTradCath said:
The true, true efforts of Vatican II have yet to come upon the Church. We are seeing slight sparks here and there, but we have yet to truly implement and understand the Council. We have absolutely been called, as lay Catholics, to engage the world. But we have not been called, nor will we ever be, to be “mini clerics.” The priest’s environment is the clerical duties. The lay person’s environment is the world. It is the priest’s duty to offer sacrifice. It is the lay person’s duty to bring the world to the Church.
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I agree to this statement whole heartedly!
 
I would’ve never even looked to the Church if it never changed the Mass–I would’ve thought it was unbiblical and/or stupid that I would have to go to a Church service where I didn’t understand anything. It opened up the gates to make it easier for Protestants to understand what the true Church is. 🙂
 
BlindManWalking said:
Well, it really kick-started that whole “understand the faith” movement.

Catechesis is better than ever

Vocations to the Priesthood are skyrocketed to the point I don’t know if the seminaries will be able to handle all these men

Reverence is supreme

The governments world-wide recognize the truth of Catholic teaching

The understanding of other religions is such that the RCC now claims over 3/4 of the population of the globe

The Real Presence is 100% unquestioned across the board

And the Jesuits are starting a long-range shooting team to compete in the world F-Class championships.

It’s been super!👍
Click to expand...
Are you serious!???
Catechesis is better!!!???
 
YoungTradCath said:
The true, true efforts of Vatican II have yet to come upon the Church. We are seeing slight sparks here and there, but we have yet to truly implement and understand the Council. We have absolutely been called, as lay Catholics, to engage the world. But we have not been called, nor will we ever be, to be “mini clerics.” The priest’s environment is the clerical duties. The lay person’s environment is the world. It is the priest’s duty to offer sacrifice. It is the lay person’s duty to bring the world to the Church.
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This.

The real results have not yet been fully seen. But there are many groups throughout the world working to implement Vatican II as it was really meant to be implemented. It is these groups etc that are working towards better catecheses, an emphasis on the importance of the interior life, as well as the necessity for reverent worship and faithfullness to the Magisterium to the Church. And many of these groups use the NO mass, not all, but many. I have been to many NO masses that have been extremely reverant, both in Latin and English, and, to be honest, the fact that the mass is available in English is, to me, a huge plus from Vatican II. I love going to the Latin NO, but there are so many people who do not know latin, and it is very unrealistic to expect everyone to learn it. Yes it is the language of the Church, and yes, it is a very good thing to learn latin and try to get in touch with the roots of the Catholic Church as much as possible, but not everyone is called to be a scholastic. Some people have a lot of trouble learning new languages etc. So Mass being available in the Vernacular is one that I would point out!
 
BlindManWalking said:
Well, it really kick-started that whole “understand the faith” movement.

Catechesis is better than ever

Vocations to the Priesthood are skyrocketed to the point I don’t know if the seminaries will be able to handle all these men

Reverence is supreme

The governments world-wide recognize the truth of Catholic teaching

The understanding of other religions is such that the RCC now claims over 3/4 of the population of the globe

The Real Presence is 100% unquestioned across the board

And the Jesuits are starting a long-range shooting team to compete in the world F-Class championships.

It’s been super!👍
Click to expand...
I blame this on relativism and not VII.
 
Swiss_Guy said:
I would’ve never even looked to the Church if it never changed the Mass–I would’ve thought it was unbiblical and/or stupid that I would have to go to a Church service where I didn’t understand anything. It opened up the gates to make it easier for Protestants to understand what the true Church is. 🙂
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But I can’t tell if this is sarcasm.
 
I would say its quite likely serious, there are many people for whom having the mass in the vernacular is a huge bonus.
 
BlindManWalking said:
Well, it really kick-started that whole “understand the faith” movement.

Catechesis is better than ever

Vocations to the Priesthood are skyrocketed to the point I don’t know if the seminaries will be able to handle all these men

Reverence is supreme

The governments world-wide recognize the truth of Catholic teaching

The understanding of other religions is such that the RCC now claims over 3/4 of the population of the globe

The Real Presence is 100% unquestioned across the board

And the Jesuits are starting a long-range shooting team to compete in the world F-Class championships.

It’s been super!👍
Click to expand...
Zing!
 
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