How I know the one and only true Church

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Fr. Karl Rahner said that the “True Church” was the one that best meets the needs of the individual believer.
 
JosephofIrving said:
Fr. Karl Rahner said that the “True Church” was the one that best meets the needs of the individual believer.
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If that Church has one hundred forty-four thousand virgin’s priests in it, I’ll say he’s right. 😃
 
Hi, and good day to you.
I noticed this thread, and being familiar with the book of Revelation, thought I would add to the thought process here.
The number 144,000 isn’t a head count, I would think. It means countless numbers of people.
Those “not defiled with women” seems to mean those who haven’t been defiled with following the mother of harlots, Babylon, which is spiritual wickedness. See Revelation 17.
Rev. 14:5 “in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.”
Rev. 14:4 “These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.”

The comparison to virgins reminds me of the wonderful parable of the ten virgins in Matthew 25. “Five of them were wise, and five were foolish.” May we all be watching and be ready for the return of the Bridegroom.
 
ParkerD said:
Hi, and good day to you.
I noticed this thread, and being familiar with the book of Revelation, thought I would add to the thought process here.
The number 144,000 isn’t a head count, I would think. It means countless numbers of people.
Those “not defiled with women” seems to mean those who haven’t been defiled with following the mother of harlots, Babylon, which is spiritual wickedness. See Revelation 17.
Rev. 14:5 “in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.”
Rev. 14:4 “These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.”

The comparison to virgins reminds me of the wonderful parable of the ten virgins in Matthew 25. “Five of them were wise, and five were foolish.” May we all be watching and be ready for the return of the Bridegroom.
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Tell me, what church you will fine one hundred forty-four thousand virgins. (Apocalypse 14:4)
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Hello, I agree that 144,000 may mean countless numbers. I don’t agree that “defiled with women” means the harlot of Babylon, if it said “defiled with the women” maybe.

If you plan to compare the parable of the ten virgins to this passage you will note that indeed the virgins where virgins.
 
Chellow said:
Tell me, what church you will fine one hundred forty-four thousand virgins. (Apocalypse 14:4)
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I do not remember seeing that, back in my bible reading days, as a chapter of the bible, maybe it’s one of the chapters that is used in the Catholic Bible. Anyways.

I guess thats a good reason for you, to see a church as the true church. Good luck with that.
 
BareKnuckler said:
I do not remember seeing that, back in my bible reading days, as a chapter of the bible, maybe it’s one of the chapters that is used in the Catholic Bible. Anyways.

I guess thats a good reason for you, to see a church as the true church. Good luck with that.
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Revelation 14:4 (King James Version)

4These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (American Standard Version)

4 These are they that were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they that follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were purchased from among men, to be the firstfruits unto God and unto the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New International Version)

4These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New American Standard Bible)

4(A)These are the ones who have not been defiled with women, for they [a]have kept themselves chaste These are the ones who (B)follow the Lamb wherever He goes These have been (C)purchased from among men (D)as first fruits to God and to the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (Amplified Bible)

4These are they who have not defiled themselves by relations with women, for they are [a]pure as] virgins. These are they who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These are they who have been ransomed (purchased, redeemed) from among men as the firstfruits for God and the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New Living Translation)

4 They have kept themselves as pure as virgins,[a] following the Lamb wherever he goes. They have been purchased from among the people on the earth as a special offering** to God and to the Lamb.**
 
Chellow said:
Revelation 14:4 (King James Version)

4These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (American Standard Version)

4 These are they that were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they that follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were purchased from among men, to be the firstfruits unto God and unto the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New International Version)

4These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New American Standard Bible)

4(A)These are the ones who have not been defiled with women, for they [a]have kept themselves chaste These are the ones who (B)follow the Lamb wherever He goes These have been (C)purchased from among men (D)as first fruits to God and to the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (Amplified Bible)

4These are they who have not defiled themselves by relations with women, for they are [a]pure as] virgins. These are they who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These are they who have been ransomed (purchased, redeemed) from among men as the firstfruits for God and the Lamb.

Revelation 14:4 (New Living Translation)

4 They have kept themselves as pure as virgins,[a] following the Lamb wherever he goes. They have been purchased from among the people on the earth as a special offering** to God and to the Lamb.**

I guess this was a reply to my statement, although I fail to see how.
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Chellow said:
Hello, I agree that 144,000 may mean countless numbers. I don’t agree that “defiled with women” means the harlot of Babylon, if it said “defiled with the women” maybe.

If you plan to compare the parable of the ten virgins to this passage you will note that indeed the virgins were virgins.
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Chellow,
Indeed they were virgins, but verse one says “Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.” It is teaching a general lesson using a specific example. It is symbolic of something larger than just ten virgins waiting for a wedding.

My point is that the book of Revelation is most often also symbolic of something larger than the depiction described in a particular passage.

Thanks for having shared your point of view.
 
BareKnuckler said:
I guess this was a reply to my statement, although I fail to see how.
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BareKnuckler,
I noticed your interest in your ancestors and that they affect your life. I think you are quite correct, as noted in Malachi 4:5-6. I hope you will look up those verses. I think your ancestors are more interested in you than you may realize.
 
ParkerD said:
BareKnuckler,
I noticed your interest in your ancestors and that they affect your life. I think you are quite correct, as noted in Malachi 4:5-6. I hope you will look up those verses. I think your ancestors are more interested in you than you may realize.
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I think you are assuming I do not think their interested in my life as much as I do. I never said how much I think they affect my life. I do not believen God, or any god. I believe my ancestors affect me more then anything spiritual, except maybe a Enlightened one.
 
BareKnuckler said:
I do not remember seeing that, back in my bible reading days, as a chapter of the bible, maybe it’s one of the chapters that is used in the Catholic Bible. Anyways.

I guess thats a good reason for you, to see a church as the true church. Good luck with that.
Click to expand...
BareKnuckler said:
I guess this was a reply to my statement, although I fail to see how.
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I’m sorry I understood you where inferring that the verse was only in a Catholic bible so I obtain and posted the same verses from bibles that where not Catholic quote unquote. My misunderstanding.
ParkerD said:
Chellow,
Indeed they were virgins, but verse one says “Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom.” It is teaching a general lesson using a specific example. It is symbolic of something larger than just ten virgins waiting for a wedding.

My point is that the book of Revelation is most often also symbolic of something larger than the depiction described in a particular passage.

Thanks for having shared your point of view.
Click to expand...
Your right but we must not forget in the basic tenant of a parable or story there maybe truth in the basic story and as well in the deeper meaning.
 
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