How important is it to be Catholic?

[Ernie07]

Hello,

I’m a devout Catholic, some who know me may say too much so from a doctrine standpoint (the truth is the truth and everything else is wrong…haha!) and that is at the heart of my question. When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church? For instance, is it OK for me to use Protestant materials and beliefs (e.g. Protestant Bible and books, church is just a collection of people worshipping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship…) as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus? The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus. That we need to keep it simple and non-threatening and thus generic. Kind of a, “so what if I’m leaving out some truth or even potentially leading people down a Protestant path as long as they have a personal encounter with Jesus”. My belief is that I’m called to evangelize people becoming a Catholic and not just a Christian. That the Church and Jesus are inseparable and must and can be communicated effectively. But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message? I’m really confused and would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

-Ernie-

 

[Brassring]

When I was protestant, my view evolved from “it’s important to NOT be Catholic” to “it’s not important to be Catholic”. Now that I’m Catholic, it’s the most important thing in the world.

 

[St_Francis]

When it was proposed (or rumored to be proposed, as some contend), that Catholics kinda … de-emphasize some aspects of the Faith in order to attract converts, the Pope took the time to write a letter explaining what a bad idea that is.

 

[PaulfromIowa]

When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church?

There is really only one version of Gospel truth.

church is just a collection of people worshiping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship… as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus?

The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus.

But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message?

I would disagree with those assumptions that Protestant ideas are somehow simpler and easier to grasp. The great majority of converts to Christianity in the last two thousand years have been Catholic/Orthodox, not Protestant.

 

[Reuben_J]

Hello,

I’m a devout Catholic, some who know me may say too much so from a doctrine standpoint (the truth is the truth and everything else is wrong…haha!) and that is at the heart of my question. When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church? For instance, is it OK for me to use Protestant materials and beliefs (e.g. Protestant Bible and books, church is just a collection of people worshipping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship…) as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus? The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus. That we need to keep it simple and non-threatening and thus generic. Kind of a, “so what if I’m leaving out some truth or even potentially leading people down a Protestant path as long as they have a personal encounter with Jesus”. My belief is that I’m called to evangelize people becoming a Catholic and not just a Christian. That the Church and Jesus are inseparable and must and can be communicated effectively. But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message? I’m really confused and would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

-Ernie-

If you want to get converts to Catholicism, use your wisdom, not inflexible blind theoritical ideal which may just turn off a potential convert. Then that would be of no use to you and the Church.

I know a priest who does missionary work in China where open evangelism is banned. He simply does non-governmental work of mercy without revealing his true identity as a Catholic priest. No public mass and no preaching of the Catholic doctrine.

There are people who are fiercely anti-Catholics perhaps due to their upbringing but nevertheless may be open to friendship with Catholics. How would you introduce such people to the Church without scaring them away? If you’re unable to bring them to your church it will be more difficult for you to drill all the truth about Catholicism into their heads. You need a listener, and you cannot force that in a free democracy.

 

[Anglewannabe]

There is really only one version of Gospel truth.

Exactly, how can you preach the truth unless you are using Catholic doctorine

.

As well, I think it is VERY important to be upfront with people. I remember doing and Alpha course (bad idea but that is a different thread). And they did not want to scare people off so for the first 3 meetings they purposely did NOT say grace for fear of making new comers run awayI found that to be manipulative. A big part of being Catholic is to pray before meals and if they were intending on doing it eventually, why wait until the 4th meal?

 

[Reuben_J]

As well, I think it is VERY important to be upfront with people. I remember doing and Alpha course (bad idea but that is a different thread). And they did not want to scare people off so for the first 3 meetings they purposely did NOT say grace for fear of making new comers run awayI found that to be manipulative. A big part of being Catholic is to pray before meals and if they were intending on doing it eventually, why wait until the 4th meal?

I do not understand. If you are Catholic, how does it stop you from saying grace before a meal?

But surely, do you expect a non-Catholic to say grace? I think it is all in the common sense.

There are a few things that can be done in the situation, mindful of the fact that non-Catholics are among the group:

• Say grace for everybody because it is a Catholic function. The non-Catholics can take or leave it.
• Announce to everybody, since the organizers are Catholics that they are saying grace but non-Catholic can do their own prayers or not at all.
• Since you have not known them well enough, say your own grace privately.

I think there is no standard procedure in what to do in such situation. What’s important is you say your grace.

 

[Ernie07]

When it was proposed (or rumored to be proposed, as some contend), that Catholics kinda … de-emphasize some aspects of the Faith in order to attract converts, the Pope took the time to write a letter explaining what a bad idea that is.

Thank you very much for providing this link as I had no idea a pope spoke about this topic! It seems quite clear from what he wrote that we are not to water down or be afraid of speaking the fullness of truth in order to evangelize. There are valid discussions as to what method is effective and what topics to convey at what appropriate time, but to side step Catholic beliefs or condone/ignore any errors for the good of converting is not acceptable. That is at least how I read the letter from the pope. Thanks again!

-Ernie-

 

[po18guy]

Our Lord Jesus Christ present to us in the most Blessed Sacrament. To leave the Catholic Church, I would have to deny Christ and I am not willing to do that.

 

[CyrilSebastian]

Being Catholic is important.
www.catholicleague.org/why-Catholicism-matters

 

[Ernie07]

Being Catholic is important.
www.catholicleague.org/why-Catholicism-matters

Cool, thanks for sharing this. I’ll get Father Donahue’s book and read it. There is a weird, almost cult-like quality toward evangelization in my parish where unity and focusing on giving people an encounter with Jesus is coming at the expense of truth. Truth is being cast aside and every time I focus on it I’m told I’m missing the big picture. That people need to develop a relationship and if we can provide that to them even with a Protestant based program that’s a good thing. “The good outweighs the bad” is what I’ve been told. I feel like I’m an arrogant son-of-a-gun (and made to feel that way) every time I ask, “why can’t we bring people to Christ by telling the truth?” We’re introducing people to Christianity using a program that involves Protestants leading the messaging, written and video materials that have numerous non-Catholic points of view, references to Protestant Bibles and books, and a website that people can go to in order to find more Protestant based material. This program is earning the trust of people who are at early stages of their faith. My Why wouldn’t they then trust that program for a deeper knowledge? But, no one seems to care because people are evangelizing like never before. I feel like my head is going to explode!!! LOL!

 

[1ke]

The kerygma is 100% Catholic and you therefore have no need to preach a version of it that isn’t Catholic. If you don’t know what the kerygma is, the book Forming Intentional Disciples by Sherry Weddell might be a good next step for you.

 

[PDXSeeker_1975]

Cool, thanks for sharing this. I’ll get Father Donahue’s book and read it. There is a weird, almost cult-like quality toward evangelization in my parish where unity and focusing on giving people an encounter with Jesus is coming at the expense of truth. Truth is being cast aside and every time I focus on it I’m told I’m missing the big picture. That people need to develop a relationship and if we can provide that to them even with a Protestant based program that’s a good thing. “The good outweighs the bad” is what I’ve been told. I feel like I’m an arrogant son-of-a-gun (and made to feel that way) every time I ask, “why can’t we bring people to Christ by telling the truth?” We’re introducing people to Christianity using a program that involves Protestants leading the messaging, written and video materials that have numerous non-Catholic points of view, references to Protestant Bibles and books, and a website that people can go to in order to find more Protestant based material. This program is earning the trust of people who are at early stages of their faith. My Why wouldn’t they then trust that program for a deeper knowledge? But, no one seems to care because people are evangelizing like never before. I feel like my head is going to explode!!! LOL!

This stuff drives me nuts. I like to tell people when I get the chance “I didn’t come into the Catholic Church so I could be a Protestant”. This false “ecumenism” makes me nauseous.

 

[Hope_Philomena]

The great majority of converts to Christianity in the last two thousand years have been Catholic/Orthodox, not Protestant.

Well, that’s because Protestantism has only existed for about 1/4 of those 2000 years, so that is not exactly a solid argument.

 

[James248]

Hello,

I’m a devout Catholic, some who know me may say too much so from a doctrine standpoint (the truth is the truth and everything else is wrong…haha!) and that is at the heart of my question. When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church? For instance, is it OK for me to use Protestant materials and beliefs (e.g. Protestant Bible and books, church is just a collection of people worshipping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship…) as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus? The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus. That we need to keep it simple and non-threatening and thus generic. Kind of a, “so what if I’m leaving out some truth or even potentially leading people down a Protestant path as long as they have a personal encounter with Jesus”. My belief is that I’m called to evangelize people becoming a Catholic and not just a Christian. That the Church and Jesus are inseparable and must and can be communicated effectively. But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message? I’m really confused and would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

-Ernie-

Short answer. Very.

From the words of one notable figure of the Catholic Church himself: “I would pray to God that sooner or later not only you but all who listen to me today might become as I am except for these chains.”

 

[TK421]

Catholic doctrine getting in the way of Jesus’ message is a misnomer, unless the Catholic Church were to be false. Recognizing the dignity and life of each person, from conception until death (and the treatment of the body after death), for example, cannot possibly get in the way of Jesus’ message. Nor can any other doctrine. Doctrines should not be understood as academic concepts but as pillars of truth which have a very tangible impact - a healing impact - on the soul, mind, heart ,and body of society. They either bind wounds, or they prevent them from occurring .They steer us towards our eternal home.

 

[fhansen]

Hello,

I’m a devout Catholic, some who know me may say too much so from a doctrine standpoint (the truth is the truth and everything else is wrong…haha!) and that is at the heart of my question. When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church? For instance, is it OK for me to use Protestant materials and beliefs (e.g. Protestant Bible and books, church is just a collection of people worshipping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship…) as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus? The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus. That we need to keep it simple and non-threatening and thus generic. Kind of a, “so what if I’m leaving out some truth or even potentially leading people down a Protestant path as long as they have a personal encounter with Jesus”. My belief is that I’m called to evangelize people becoming a Catholic and not just a Christian. That the Church and Jesus are inseparable and must and can be communicated effectively. But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message? I’m really confused and would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

-Ernie-

I think it also depends on how grounded we are in the Catholic faith to begin with. We can teach the essentials in ways that others might relate to better without compromising the truth… St Paul says this in 1 Cor 9:

19Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible. 20To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. 21To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law. 22To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some. 23I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.

 

[peter26]

I think its the essentials that are important. The essentials are enough to bring people to Jesus. That is what is important. A lot of Catholic doctrines really are not essential to people’s salvation.

 

[Ernie07]

I think its the essentials that are important. The essentials are enough to bring people to Jesus. That is what is important. A lot of Catholic doctrines really are not essential to people’s salvation.

That brings up a few interesting questions, “what is essential?” and then “who decides what is essential?” Is essential just believing in a core set of beliefs regarding Jesus (Fully man fully God, Son of God, 2nd person in Trinity, died for our sins, rose from the dead…)? Is essential believing how you get into heaven (faith alone, state of grace…)? Some would argue that the Eucharist is essential (“unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood you have no life within you”). In addition, some would argue that unconfessed mortal sins will exclude you from heaven while others would say that sins really don’t matter from a justification/salvation perspective.

“Essentials” can be a tricky item and that’s why I think the truth is so important. So to answer my own question that started this thread, “Yes, to be Catholic is important because it contains the fullness of truth”. To me, that is what is “essential”. Just because the Catholic Church says that those who don’t believe in the Catholic faith can get into heaven as long as it is of no fault of their own doesn’t make it any less true or “essential”.

Just one man’s opinion.

-Ernie-

 

[PJM]

Hello,

Hello,

I’m a devout Catholic, some who know me may say too much so from a doctrine standpoint (the truth is the truth and everything else is wrong…haha!) and that is at the heart of my question. When we as Catholics evangelize how important is it that we preach the Catholic version of truth about Jesus and His Church? For instance, is it OK for me to use Protestant materials and beliefs (e.g. Protestant Bible and books, church is just a collection of people worshipping together, say a prayer and become a child of God and enter into personal relationship…) as a first step because it is a more simple and effective way of getting people to have a personal relationship with Jesus? The thought is that most people, even Catholics, won’t get excited about Catholic doctrine (e.g. Eucharist, One True Church, etc.) until they have a personal encounter with Jesus. That we need to keep it simple and non-threatening and thus generic. Kind of a, “so what if I’m leaving out some truth or even potentially leading people down a Protestant path as long as they have a personal encounter with Jesus”. My belief is that I’m called to evangelize people becoming a Catholic and not just a Christian. That the Church and Jesus are inseparable and must and can be communicated effectively. But, what if Catholic doctrine gets in the way of the Jesus message? I’m really confused and would appreciate your thoughts on this. Thanks!

-Ernie

WOW! I [Me here] see this as a frightening question, being a Catholic Catechist myself
.
Father Hardon had this to say about Truth

“TRUTH is the CONDITION of grace; it is the SOURCE of grace; it is the CHANNEL of grace; it is the DIVINELY ORDAINED requirement of grace”

TRUTH can only be singular per defined issue; it logically & morally can be nothing else.
So NO! We neither may, nor should we compromise GODS Truths; such would be duplicitous and demonstrating a lack of FAITH. WHY?

Because the bible is replete with EVIDENCE that what GOD desired and did accomplish was with complete consistency; teach:

Believe in:

]One True God: the 1st Commandment & Lev. 26:12
“I will walk among you, and will be your God, and you shall be my people

& John 10:30 “I and the Father are one”

That One True God [Triune] has only one set of faith beliefs:

Duet. 11:1 “Therefore love the Lord thy God and observe his precepts and ceremonies, his judgments and commandments at all times.

**Mt 10: 1-2 “And having called his twelve disciples together, he gave THEM power over unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of diseases, and all manner of infirmities. And the names of the twelve apostles are these: The FIRST Simon who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother… & 5: **THESE TWELVE Jesus sent: commanding THEM, saying: Go YOU”

Mt 28: 19-20 “[19] Going therefore, teach YOU all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. TEACHING THEM to observe ALL THINGS whatsoever I have commanded [HERE MEANS BOTH TAUGHT & COMMANDED] YOU: and behold I am with YOU all days, even to the consummation of the world.

**Eph.4: 2-7 “**With all humility and mildness, with patience, supporting one another in charity. CAREFUL TO keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. One body [MEANS JUST ONE TRUE CHURCH] and one Spirit; as you are called in one hope of your calling. One Lord, ONE FAITH [MEANS PRECISELY THAT AS EVEN GOD CAN ONLY HAVE ONE SET OF DEFINED FAITH BELIEFS], one baptism. One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in us all. [WRITTEN BY AND FOR THE RCC]

[7] **But to every one of us is given grace, according to the measure of the giving of Christ. **

And Just One True Church
No “Church” can be separated from its own freely chosen set of Faith beliefs; indeed, it the beliefs of that church which gives it its exclusive identification

Mt 16:18-19 “ And I say to THEE: That thou art Peter; and upon [YOU PETER] this rock I will build MY CHURCH [SINGULAR], and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give to YOU [PETER] [ALL OF THEM IMPLIED] the keys of the kingdom of heaven. And whatsoever YOU shalt BIND [HERE MEANS TEACH OR COMMAND] upon earth, it shall be bound also IN HEAVEN: and whatsoever YOU shalt Loose [HERE MEANS TO MAKE VOID OT TO FORGIVE] upon earth, it shall be loosed also IN HEAVEN”

Because we Catholics have the entire TRIUNE Godhead, and God’s TRUTH warranted by the HS and Jesus Himself:

John 14:26 “But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you.”

John 17: 17-20 “ Sanctify THEM IN TRUTH Thy word is truth. As thou hast SENT ME into the world, I ALSO SEND THEM into the world. AND FOR THEM DO I SANCIFY MYSELFf, that they also may be sanctified IN MY TRUTH And not for them only do I pray, but for them also who through their word shall believe in me

**ALL of the above are direct, precise and EXCLUSIVE to only the Apostles and their successors. [Compare Mt 10: 5-8 to Mt 28:19-20]

Also Only God can cause a conversion. God may, and God does use us, but the success of ALL of our effores are Holy Spirit controlled. Amen

BECAUSE God; God’s TRUE Faith and the Holy Spirit ARE on our side; stick to the FACTS with clarity and charity. AMEN**

Be gentle, be factual, be TRUTHFUL and be charitable; BUT REMAIN IN GOD"S TRUTHS:thumbsup:

GBY!
Patrick