How Many Here Would Attend The Traditional Latin Mass If It Were Available ?

[JMJ_coder]

I agree they are not the most important thing but they are indeed important. How you worship is directly correlated to how you believe. The surveys pre and post V2 prove a simplified liturgy has resulted in a simplified faith among those who actually bother to attend Mass anymore.

I, of course, disagree completely. But, I’m sure you already knew that.

 

[Ockham]

for various reasons, it is important to a lot of people

speaking for myself, i want to be involved in it. i want my attention to be in the prayers and whats going on, at the same time reflecting on the words of the priest. hard for me to do that if you add one layer of trying to translate everything through a Missal.

If you really want to participate in the Mass you can do so better in an EF than OF. If you get yourself a missal then you know exactly what prayers the priest will recite. The OF has many options so the congregation doesn’t really know what will be said. Many OF priests have a tendency to skip or ad lib parts of the Mass. Plus, there are more prayers in the EF. If the Mass is a prayer then participating at the EF is the better way to pray.

 

[JMJ_coder]

If you really want to participate in the Mass you can do so better in an EF than OF.

So you claim.

If you get yourself a missal then you know exactly what prayers the priest will recite.

Same in both forms.

The OF has many options so the congregation doesn’t really know what will be said.

There aren’t that many options for the text.

Many OF priests have a tendency to skip or ad lib parts of the Mass.

That is a gross generalization that has no basis in fact. Most Priests are faithful to the Missal and do not alter text that does cannot licitly be altered (which is a grave liturgical abuse).

Plus, there are more prayers in the EF.

So, what’s wrong with conciseness?

If the Mass is a prayer then participating at the EF is the better way to pray.

Again, so you claim.

 

[Ockham]

I also think that the Catholic Church would not take a step that would drive away so many nominal/cafeteria/liberal (whatever you want to label them) Catholics and thus put them in grave danger of hell. As long as a Christian is at Mass, they are receiving graces. But when they stop attending Mass, it becomes very difficult for a Christian to grow in faith and avoid sin.

I sometimes sense on this board that some Catholics would prefer that all the “non-committed” Catholics leave the Church and allow all the traditional, committed Catholics to have the Church to themselves. But I don’t think this is what the Lord prefers.
.

Financially, it may be best for all the ‘cafeteria Catholic’ parishes to leave the Church. Maybe your church is profitable but most OF parishes I know are in the red.

If by 'cafeteria Catholics" you mean people who practice contraception, IVF, abortion, pre-marital sex, etc, then they are most likely heading to Hell anyway. If you know the Catechsim then you should know these are mortal sins. If you die with a mortal sin on your soul you go to Hell. If you attend Mass with a mortal sin on your soul you may receive some grace but if you receive Holy Communion outside of a state of grace you commit a further sin and disrespect the Blessed Sacrament.

Catholicism isn’t some version of Protestantism. There are rules. As Carla said in an episode of ‘Cheers’ “it isn’t a religion for wimps”. The role of the Church is to help us get to Heaven, not offer some form of spiritual Oprah sofa where no judgement is applied.

It’s dangerous to assume you know what the Lord thinks. However, if you follow the Magisterium then you can rest assured non-committed Catholics are in for an eternal rude awakening.

 

[ProVobis]

It stands to reason that if one travels to a foreign land that they be able to converse in the native language of said land (whether they are Catholic or not, whether they go to a Mass or not).

Then the world must be full of so many talented and brilliant multi-lingual people who have no problem picking up one or two languages every time they need to take short trips to new foreign countries. No need for interpreters either.

Sorry, my dad was stationed all over the world, including international waters, throughout his military career, and fought in two major wars; he thanked God for the Latin Mass, because at least that was familiar to him.

 

[choy]

Funny, I thought it had to do with it being practically suppressed for forty years.

its not suppressed
its just not the norm
why would the extraordinary form be celebrated more than the ordinary form?

 

[Ockham]

and the reason TLM is not widely available? because fact is, the OF works for most people)

Actually, the facts suggest the OF doesn’t work for most people.

Prior to the Novus Ordo the majority of Catholics attended Mass weekly. Today the majority stay away. This thread proves the vast majority of Catholics would attend the EF if made available on Sunday mornings. There are several surveys which confirm this result throughout the world.

 

[JMJ_coder]

Then the world must be full of so many talented and brilliant multi-lingual people who have no problem picking up one or two languages every time they need to take short trips to new foreign countries. No need for interpreters either.

I hope they don’t need to eat, shop, get a hotel room, etc. and expect not to communicate in the native tongue.

 

[choy]

If you really want to participate in the Mass you can do so better in an EF than OF. If you get yourself a missal then you know exactly what prayers the priest will recite. The OF has many options so the congregation doesn’t really know what will be said. Many OF priests have a tendency to skip or ad lib parts of the Mass. Plus, there are more prayers in the EF. If the Mass is a prayer then participating at the EF is the better way to pray.

sorry, but reciting for the sake or reciting also doesn’t hold value to me. i’ve done it for many years in the OF being a lukewarm Catholic. now that i’ve become more devout, doing the same thing but with more understanding and faith has brought out more reverence in me.

 

[Ockham]

It stands to reason that if one travels to a foreign land that they be able to converse in the native language of said land (whether they are Catholic or not, whether they go to a Mass or not).

By your logic it is unreasonable for anyone to visit a country whose language they don’t speak fluently. That is one of the most absurd things I’ve seen in defence of the OF. I guess I better cancel my flight to Germany this summer then.

 

[JMJ_coder]

Financially, it may be best for all the ‘cafeteria Catholic’ parishes to leave the Church. Maybe your church is profitable but most OF parishes I know are in the red.

The reason is that a very good number of those parishes are in the areas settled by immigrants coming from the Old World. But, the population is shifting from the urban centers to the suburbs. Suburban parishes are booming while urban parishes are shrinking and rural parishes are as poor as always.

 

[Ockham]

How is it not charitable? It is a fact that a good many persons prayed the Rosary during the Mass and doing so makes it hard to read a Missal. Therefore, putting two and two together, the historical fact negates the claim that everyone was following along in their Missals all the time.

There is nothing wrong with praying the Rosary, it is a superb devotion and I recommend everyone to pray the Rosary everyday. But, when we go to Mass we are there to participate in the Liturgy and not to pray the Rosary (though doing so before or after Mass would be laudable).

My point is better to pray the Rosary then mindlessly go through the motions.

 

[JMJ_coder]

By your logic it is unreasonable for anyone to visit a country whose language they don’t speak fluently. That is one of the most absurd things I’ve seen in defence of the OF. I guess I better cancel my flight to Germany this summer then.

Fluent, not necessarily. But yes, it is stupid and foolhardy to go to a land where you cannot communicate with anyone.

 

[Ockham]

its not suppressed
its just not the norm
why would the extraordinary form be celebrated more than the ordinary form?

Oh please. The EF was practically locked in a closet for forty years. To suggest otherwise is extremely faulty. However, there is a theory that hiding the EF was the prudent thing given the tumultuous and narsistic generation we’ve endured.

 

[JMJ_coder]

My point is better to pray the Rosary then mindlessly go through the motions.

We are not at Mass to pray the Rosary, but to participate in the Liturgy!

 

[Ockham]

I, of course, disagree completely. But, I’m sure you already knew that.

I always hope for a different result but not surprised when NO progressives ignore facts.

 

[bcra]

sorry no i and my children would not attend due to the fact we do not understand latin. my children said they would noit go to church if they cannot understand

 

[Ockham]

Same in both forms.

There aren’t that many options for the text.

.

There are four Eucharistic Prayers in the OF. Maybe your parish priest says a consistent OF but from my experience and exchanges via forums like this it is certain many take liberties.

 

[JMJ_coder]

I always hope for a different result but not surprised when NO progressives ignore facts.

Whatever.

 

[Ockham]

sorry, but reciting for the sake or reciting also doesn’t hold value to me. i’ve done it for many years in the OF being a lukewarm Catholic. now that i’ve become more devout, doing the same thing but with more understanding and faith has brought out more reverence in me.

Awesome! Continue your journey. There are EFs available in Vancouver.