How sacred is the Altar?

[cesmit2]

This may not be the correct area of the forums but I wanted to find out about an issue…

When Mass is not being celebrated, what items are allowed on the altar?

Here is an example of something that recently happened at my parish and I felt that this was wrong but could not cite anything other than God not being happy with what was taking place.

We had a concert this past Friday evening in our sanctuary. The performer set up lights, keyboards, sound monitors, and other musical items on the altar - well not on the altar table itself but on the elevated area around the altar. I call the entire area the altar but anyway…

The concert was actually considered a “Spiritual Experience” by some including our pastor. For this reason, the items were allowed to be placed on the altar according to others that spoke with our pastor. I told these people that you can have a spiritual experience smoking payote but we do not allow that on the altar. The concert or “Spiritual Experience” told the story of Jesus’s passion and walk to Calvary. This event also took the place of Stations of the Cross on this particular Friday.

When I first walked in and saw this whole set up I almost got sick to my stomach. Aaron’s two sons were killed by God when they approached the Ark of the Covenant unworthily so why would this be any different?

So my question is - is this wrong or is this treating the altar with a lack of respect? Oh yeah, someone told me that the performer bowed to the altar before walking up on the altar and beginning the concert. Even Satan and his demons cower to Jesus Christ!

 

[mwscott]

The sanctuary (the elevated area around the altar) is a holy place. You are right to feel this way. Although I don’t have the documents at hand the Church prohibits concerts in the Sanctuary. In fact, only people assisting in the liturgy of the Church should be in the sanctuary.

I am sure someone will come along with a quote of Church documents for you. Have a great night. God bless.

 

[MarkThompson]

Oh yeah, someone told me that the performer bowed to the altar before walking up on the altar and beginning the concert. Even Satan and his demons cower to Jesus Christ!

A little overblown in describing this event – sounds like a Passion play – isn’t this? Also, the altar ≠ the sanctuary.

In fact, only people assisting in the liturgy of the Church should be in the sanctuary.

Right – during the liturgy. That doesn’t mean that the floors have to be swept by an ordained minister.

 

[ChurchTorch]

This may not be the correct area of the forums but I wanted to find out about an issue…

When Mass is not being celebrated, what items are allowed on the altar?

Here is an example of something that recently happened at my parish and I felt that this was wrong but could not cite anything other than God not being happy with what was taking place.

We had a concert this past Friday evening in our sanctuary. The performer set up lights, keyboards, sound monitors, and other musical items on the altar - well not on the altar table itself but on the elevated area around the altar. I call the entire area the altar but anyway…

The concert was actually considered a “Spiritual Experience” by some including our pastor. For this reason, the items were allowed to be placed on the altar according to others that spoke with our pastor. I told these people that you can have a spiritual experience smoking payote but we do not allow that on the altar. The concert or “Spiritual Experience” told the story of Jesus’s passion and walk to Calvary. This event also took the place of Stations of the Cross on this particular Friday.

When I first walked in and saw this whole set up I almost got sick to my stomach. Aaron’s two sons were killed by God when they approached the Ark of the Covenant unworthily so why would this be any different?

So my question is - is this wrong or is this treating the altar with a lack of respect? Oh yeah, someone told me that the performer bowed to the altar before walking up on the altar and beginning the concert. Even Satan and his demons cower to Jesus Christ!

The altar is a table comprised of a tabletop (the mensa which sometimes looks like a shelf against the rear reredos/retablo) and a base (the stipes.) That elevated area is the sanctuary. The altar is a powerful icon of Jesus Christ, so even outside of Mass the altar should not be used to hold things including flowers except for the exposed Blessed Sacrament and perhaps and some candles.

I would hope the Blessed Sacrament was removed to a separate chapel if your church was used to host a Christian concert. Otherwise I would leave things up to your pastor. It’s his call and his responsibility.

 

[ChurchTorch]

The sanctuary (the elevated area around the altar) is a holy place. You are right to feel this way. Although I don’t have the documents at hand the Church prohibits concerts in the Sanctuary. In fact, only people assisting in the liturgy of the Church should be in the sanctuary.

I am sure someone will come along with a quote of Church documents for you. Have a great night. God bless.

The Church does not prohibit the sanctuary to be used during a concert. But not just any old concert can be held in a Catholic Church and it’s important to take steps like removing the Blessed Sacrament to a separate chapel.

 

[puzzleannie]

it was not a concert if it was a passion play or in some other way a dramatic rendering or meditation on the scriptural account of the passion. No nothing should EVER be placed on the altar itself (the table) besides the items used for celebration of the Eucharist. If this was a prayer experience there would be no need to remove the Blessed Sacrament either. The musicians should have set up in the area normally used by the choir and other musicians for Mass.

 

[cesmit2]

It may help if you all knew what the performance was. Here is a link to the artist’s website:

idobelieve.com/home.shtml

“I THIRST - the Crucifixion Story” presents the way of the Cross through powerfully moving music. Tajci brings up poignant thoughts on Christ’s sacrifice, and draws the audience on an emotional journey.

This program is performed by Tajci, backed up by Denny Bouchard on Keyboards and Janel Leppin on Cello (Western and Indian) and is performed during the season of Lent.

In any case it just seems that liberalism is creeping into the Church little by little with pastor’s allowing Extraordinary Ministers to come up onto the alter prior to the priest receiving communion, the tabernacle being set off to the left hand side of the church and not a part of the altar, concerts/passion plays being set up and performed on the altar, etc… I guess I am just really old fashioned but I have a deep down respect for God and believe that the altar and church should be revered at ALL TIMES!

Back in the Old Testament, high priests would have a rope tied to their leg when they entered behind the veil of the sanctuary (the holy of all holies) in case they entered unworthily and were struck dead upon entering. How has this changed? Just because Jesus came down does not mean that we can live how we want and act how we want in church. Reverence is still expected.

Peace All!

 

[rayne89]

I guess I am just really old fashioned but I have a deep down respect for God and believe that the altar and church should be revered at ALL TIMES!

Because we are Catholic our personal beliefs or feelings do not dictate what is or not allowable -or what is or is not considered reverent. If the Church allows a Passion play in the sanctuary than it is allowed. I don’t understand thinking oneself to be wiser or holier than the magisterium of the Church. You don’t have to like it or attend it. Only Mass is obligatory.

 

[sharmin]

Oh yeah, someone told me that the performer bowed to the altar before walking up on the altar and beginning the concert. Even Satan and his demons cower to Jesus Christ!

Your last sentence here confused me. Are you comparing this performer, who performed songs about Christ and his final days as a spiritual encounter, satan’s demon?

 

[malphono]

it was not a concert if it was a passion play or in some other way a dramatic rendering or meditation on the scriptural account of the passion. No nothing should EVER be placed on the altar itself (the table) besides the items used for celebration of the Eucharist.

Yes, and I would add that, in the case of a consecrated altar (or at least a consecrated stone), the altar should be completely stripped. Personally, I would suggest using an old-fashioned coverlet over the bare mensa. Admittedly the use of a coverlet is no longer very common, but it does protect from dust and debris, and helps maintain a sense of dignity and propriety.

If this was a prayer experience there would be no need to remove the Blessed Sacrament either. The musicians should have set up in the area normally used by the choir and other musicians for Mass.

A “passion play” or concert or whatever, even if is a “prayer experience,” is purely aliturgical and, IMHO, the Sacrament should be reserved elsewhere.

 

[japhy]

The Church does not prohibit the sanctuary to be used during a concert.

There is an instruction from the Church (from 1987) about the holding of concerts in the body of a church building. Part of that instruction says:
10. When the proposal is made that there should be a concert in a church, the Ordinary is to grant the permission per modum actus. These concerts should be occasional events. This excludes permission for a series of concerts, for example in the case of a festival or a cycle of concerts.

When the Ordinary considers it to be necessary, he can, in the conditions foreseen in the Code of Canon Law (can. 1222, para. 2) designate a church that is no longer used for divine service, to be an “auditorium” for the performance of sacred or religious music, and also of music not specifically religious but in keeping with the character of the place.

In this task the bishop should be assisted by the diocesan commission for Liturgy and sacred music.

In order that the sacred character of a church be conserved in the matter of concerts, the Ordinary can specify that:

a. Requests are to be made in writing, in good time, indicating the date and time of the proposed concert, the program, giving the works and the names of the composers.
b. After having received the authorization of the Ordinary, the rectors and parish priests of the churches should arranged details with the choir and orchestra so that the requisite norms are observed.
c. Entrance to the church must be without payment and open to all.
d. The performers and the audience must be dressed in a manner which is fitting to the sacred character of the place.
e. The musicians and the singers should not be placed in the sanctuary. The greatest respect is to be shown to the altar, the president’s chair and the ambo.
f. The Blessed Sacrament should be, as far as possible, reserved in a side chapel or in another safe and suitably adorned place (Cf. C.I.C., can 928, par. 4).
g. The concert should be presented or introduced not only with historical or technical details, but also in a way that fosters a deeper understanding and an interior participation on the part of the listeners.
h. The organizer of the concert will declare in writing that he accepts legal responsibilities for expenses involved, for leaving the church in order and for any possible damage incurred.

 

[puzzleannie]

OPs description makes the event sound devotional like a via crucis with added music & meditation, if it really is a concert, with performers and spectators, not a devotional exercise, then the rules for concerts pertain, and the Blessed Sacrament should be moved. If OP wants a helpful answer fuller details would be helpful up front also proper use of terminology would also help in providing assistance.

 

[cesmit2]

Because we are Catholic our personal beliefs or feelings do not dictate what is or not allowable -or what is or is not considered reverent. If the Church allows a Passion play in the sanctuary than it is allowed. I don’t understand thinking oneself to be wiser or holier than the magisterium of the Church. You don’t have to like it or attend it. Only Mass is obligatory.

Maybe I should have stated this a little more clearly…It is not my personal belief but it is a belief in the Old Testament as well a having reverence for God. This has nothing to do with the magisterium of the Church.

If someone walks into church chewing gum, it is irreverent - The Magisterium does not say much about this but this is a personally held belief.

I do not feel that I am wiser or holier than the magisterium. How about going and burying your head in the sand if you have nothing constructive to say in response to my inquiry!

 

[cesmit2]

OPs description makes the event sound devotional like a via crucis with added music & meditation, if it really is a concert, with performers and spectators, not a devotional exercise, then the rules for concerts pertain, and the Blessed Sacrament should be moved. If OP wants a helpful answer fuller details would be helpful up front also proper use of terminology would also help in providing assistance.

Would “OP” stand for Original Poster? If so, I am not sure what other proper terminology I could use and how else I could have stated the situation. My initial inquiry was not about the Blessed Sacrament, it was about people putting keyboards, microphones, and lighting gear up on the altar. I could draw a picture and annotate it to include positions of the instrumentation but did not deem it necessary.

It really doesn’t matter I guess. I know the way to heaven (John 14:6) and I follow the commandments of Jesus - other than that - it really doesn’t matter to me any longer.

It is a pity that people monitor these forums and the only answers that are given are rude, disrespectful, or just plain patronizing, however I do appreciate and respect the answers given by those who are trying to help answer my initial question.

 

[puzzleannie]

forgive me if I was rude, but you initially asked about the altar in your title, but your description made it sound as if the equipment was set up in the sanctuary, you also called the event a concert, and if it was billed that way I guess it was, but described it as a devotional exercise. All I had to go one in offering an answer was what you said in your OP. If in trying to be accurate and helpful I offended, please accept my apology, but you will find the forums much more fun and helpful if you are not so quick to see offense where none is intended, or mistake accuracy and clarity for rudeness.

 

[Bluegoat]

The performer set up lights, keyboards, sound monitors, and other musical items on the altar - well not on the altar table itself but on the elevated area around the altar. I call the entire area the altar but anyway…

This area is called the sanctuary, OP. It is considered to be an important place but is not the same as the altar, which has specific rules of its own.

 

[cesmit2]

This area is called the sanctuary, OP. It is considered to be an important place but is not the same as the altar, which has specific rules of its own.

OK. So nothing was set up on the “altar”. All of the items were set up on/in the “sanctuary”. So if this area is referred to as the sanctuary then what is the main area called where the congregation (oops…my Southern Baptist roots coming out) parishioners sit?

This was not a Passion Play. It was a musical story/concert (our sign outside of the church read Tajci Concert). It took the place of Stations of the Cross.

So, now that we have all of that out of the way…

Was this bad form to do this? That is really all I want to know and it is really for my benefit.

Thanks and Peace!

 

[malphono]

OK. So nothing was set up on the “altar”. All of the items were set up on/in the “sanctuary”. So if this area is referred to as the sanctuary then what is the main area called where the congregation (oops…my Southern Baptist roots coming out) parishioners sit?

It’s generally referred to as the nave.

This was not a Passion Play. It was a musical story/concert (our sign outside of the church read Tajci Concert). It took the place of Stations of the Cross. …

Was this bad form to do this? That is really all I want to know and it is really for my benefit.

Whether it was a “passion play” or a concert or whatever, it was aliturgical (meaning not liturgical at all), as opposed to the Stations of the Cross which are considered para-liturgical (i.e. celebrations and forms of worship inspired by the liturgy but which do not form part of official liturgical texts).

As [post=6380613]japhy [/post] said earlier in this thread, aliturgical events such are permitted but there are some rules.

 

[Catholicben]

De Musica Sacra:

Chapter III-2

1. The type of music which inspires its hearers with religious sentiments, and even devotion, and yet, because of its special character cannot be used in liturgical functions, is nevertheless worthy of high esteem, and ought to be cultivated in its proper time. This music justly merits, therefore, the title “religious music”.
2. The proper places for the performance of such music are concert halls, theaters, or auditoriums, but not the church, which is consecrated to the worship of God.

However, if none of these places are available, and the local Ordinary judges that a concert of religious music might be advantageous for the spiritual welfare of the faithful, he may permit a concert of this kind to be held in a church, provided the following provisions are observed:

a) The local Ordinary must give his permission for each concert in writing.
b) Requests for such permissions must also be in writing, stating the date of the concert, the compositions to be performed, the names of the directors (organist, and choral director), and the performers.
c) The local Ordinary is not to give this permission without first consulting the diocesan commission of sacred music, and perhaps other authorities upon whose judgment he may rely, and then only if he knows that the music is not only outstanding for its true artistic value, but also for its sincere Christian spirit; he must also be assured that the performers possess the qualities to be mentioned below in paragraphs 97, and 98.
d) Before the concert, the Blessed Sacrament should be removed from the church, and reserved in one of the chapels, or even in the sacristy, is a respectful way. If this cannot be done, the audience should be told that the Blessed Sacrament is present in the church, and the pastor should see to it that there is no danger of irreverence.
e) The main body of the church is not to be used for selling admission tickets or distributing programs of the concert.
f) The musicians, singers, and audience should conduct themselves, and dress in a manner befitting the seriousness, and holiness of the sacred edifice in which they are present.
g) If circumstances permit, the concert should be concluded by some private devotion, or better still, with benediction of the Blessed Sacrament. In this way the devotion, and edification of the faithful, which was the purpose of the concert, will be crowned by a religious service.

 

[Cathryn]

Canon 1239 Sacred Use

§1 An altar, whether fixed or movable, is to be reserved for divine worship alone, to the exclusion of any secular usage.