How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization

[SeanF1989]

I am currently reading this book (Thomas E. Woods) and am on the chaper The Church and Science and I am shocked at how our schools and media been able to get away with re-writing history for so long. http:////www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/images/0895260387/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=266239&s=books

 

[Monte_RCMS]

Yup!!

 

[karaleigh]

I am currently reading this book (Thomas E. Woods) and am on the chaper The Church and Science and I am shocked at how our schools and media been able to get away with re-writing history for so long. http:////www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/images/0895260387/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=266239&s=books

A recent science article tells more on the subject of The Church and Science and who’s getting the credit. Early clergyman reports and essays are being left out, and it’s wrong in doing so. This is the link to a article I’m referring to.

 

[Rascalking]

The church has done more for the sake of good then any other orginization in history, so it doesn’t surprise me that they helped build western civilization! In fairness, I don’t think any one group did ALL of it.

Thanks for the book idea, I’ll put it on my list.

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Great book.

For anyone interested in learning more about how the Church advanced scientific and technological development, check out the “Catholic Laboratory” podcast.

 

[Curious_Seed]

I am currently reading this book (Thomas E. Woods) and am on the chaper The Church and Science and I am shocked at how our schools and media been able to get away with re-writing history for so long. http:////www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/images/0895260387/ref=dp_image_0?ie=UTF8&n=266239&s=books

What does it say about the role of Greek Civilization and the Roman Empire, in construction of Western Civilization?

What does it say about the Catholic Church’s intial position on Copernicus and Galileo and Darwin?

Western Civilization built by the Catholic Church, not just contributing member?

Interesting.

 

[Darryl1958]

Rene Girard has an interesting thesis on how the crucifixion of Christ generated the need for science.

The idea that people could kill God himself , could kill the Christ, the Son of Man, and free the criminal, Barabbas(the son of God) engendered doubt into all subsequent decisions.
In all other ritual murders before this, the victim was understood to be guilty, but with the crucifixion of the Innocent one, no longer was such an assumption possible for the Christian.
Doubt created a desire to know.
And this need to know led to the searching for methods to know.
Ergo science.
cbc.ca/ideas/episodes/2011/02/28/the-scapgoat-rene-girards-anthropology-of-violence-and-religion/

 

[manualman]

What does it say about the role of Greek Civilization and the Roman Empire, in construction of Western Civilization?

What does it say about the Catholic Church’s intial position on Copernicus and Galileo and Darwin?

Western Civilization built by the Catholic Church, not just contributing member?

Haven’t read it yet, but have heard the author interviewed on the radio.

1. He does a great job of pointing out how the Church approaches truth and is able to sort the true from the false from other and prior cultures and civilizations, such as the Greeks and Romans (and later the rediscovered treasures lost for a time when the muslims conquered most of eastern Christendom.
2. Read and be surprised. What you learned in history class in an English speaking country is surprisingly tainted by Reformation era English bias even to this day. Galileo never got in trouble for his scientific theories, he got in trouble for attempting to leverage scientific findings into theological assertions contrary to doctrine (i.e. Scripture seems to imply earth as center, observations demonstrate sun center, therefore Scripture isn’t a reliable source of revelation)
3. Yes and no. More like the foundation and keystone that provided the durability lacking in the other great civilizations. It IS an audacious claim, but one worth checking out.

 

[Curious_Seed]

Haven’t read it yet, but have heard the author interviewed on the radio.

1. He does a great job of pointing out how the Church approaches truth and is able to sort the true from the false from other and prior cultures and civilizations, such as the Greeks and Romans (and later the rediscovered treasures lost for a time when the muslims conquered most of eastern Christendom.
2. Read and be surprised. What you learned in history class in an English speaking country is surprisingly tainted by Reformation era English bias even to this day. Galileo never got in trouble for his scientific theories, he got in trouble for attempting to leverage scientific findings into theological assertions contrary to doctrine (i.e. Scripture seems to imply earth as center, observations demonstrate sun center, therefore Scripture isn’t a reliable source of revelation)
3. Yes and no. More like the foundation and keystone that provided the durability lacking in the other great civilizations. It IS an audacious claim, but one worth checking out.

Galileo “got into trouble” not for his scientific theories, but for introducing theology into science?

Really?

Are you referring to his letter to Duchess Christina explaining that a literal interpretation of Genesis in untenable?

Because he was not condemned for that.

He was condemned for continuing to support Copernicus.

1616
Galileo writes that Aristotle is wrong and Copernicus is right.

Pope Paul V orders a review of Galileo’s position.
The Cardinals find the Copernican view incorrect, and, forbid Galileo from supporting the Copernican view.

1632
With a new Pope elected, Pope Urban VIII, Galileo is invited to present again his views and he does so - holding the same views, as 1616.

1633
Galileo is found guilty of violating the condition of 1616, by supporting Copernicus, and he is condemned [not just in trouble] to lifelong imprisonment, by the Roman Catholic Church.

Please, the influence of the Roman Empire and Greek Thinking is the bedrock of Western Civilization, not the Roman Catholic Church - and that influence is still durable, to this day - unlike that, of the Roman Catholic Church.

I have no doubt education, in “English speaking” countries, is tainted; but, it is not blind, either.

 

[John21652]

Please, the influence of the Roman Empire and Greek Thinking is the bedrock of Western Civilization, not the Roman Catholic Church - and that influence is still durable, to this day - unlike that, of the Roman Catholic Church.

Wrong.

The bedrock of Western Civilisation is the Natural Law based system of Morality and Law as codified and handed down all the way from the Byzantine Emperor Justinian. It is Catholic. Yes, it includes Greek and Roman influences, but only as adopted by the Church. The Catholic Church was Western Civilisation all the way up to the reformation. After the reformation it was still Christendom. The Catholic legal and moral framework which is the bedrock of Western Civilisation is only recently being pulled apart by secularism.

 

[MartyrForJesus]

I really want to get that book. I watched the series (well some of it) on Youtube.

 

[ESMDHokie77]

Sean, it’s a fantastic book!

Galileo got in trouble because he insisted on a theory without substantial proof. He belittled anyone who criticized him for such. Both bad practices.

 

[MartyrForJesus]

Galileo “got into trouble” not for his scientific theories, but for introducing theology into science?

Really?

Are you referring to his letter to Duchess Christina explaining that a literal interpretation of Genesis in untenable?

Because he was not condemned for that.

He was condemned for continuing to support Copernicus.

1616
Galileo writes that Aristotle is wrong and Copernicus is right.

Pope Paul V orders a review of Galileo’s position.
The Cardinals find the Copernican view incorrect, and, forbid Galileo from supporting the Copernican view.

1632
With a new Pope elected, Pope Urban VIII, Galileo is invited to present again his views and he does so - holding the same views, as 1616.

1633
Galileo is found guilty of violating the condition of 1616, by supporting Copernicus, and he is condemned [not just in trouble] to lifelong imprisonment, by the Roman Catholic Church.

Please, the influence of the Roman Empire and Greek Thinking is the bedrock of Western Civilization, not the Roman Catholic Church - and that influence is still durable, to this day - unlike that, of the Roman Catholic Church.

I have no doubt education, in “English speaking” countries, is tainted; but, it is not blind, either.

Galileo did not have sufficient evidence to prove his theory over the one that was held by the scientists (mostly Jesuits) of the day. The Church had no problem with him publishing his work as theories, it became a problem when he refused to accept them as theories, and taught them as fact.

Also, he was put under house arrest in a 5 star building. That’s a bit different than being ‘imprisoned’.

 

[GratefulFred]

Curious Seed: Read the Book to properly critique it points. I am half way through it.

Most of what we know about ancient times, Aristole et al, is a direct result of monks who labored to copy the few remaining ancient texts.

Just one example of the Church building the West: The first Universities were established by the Church.

The group who plants and nurtures trees that grow to fullness and whose seeds creates thousands of other trees that provide much good for society should not easily be dismissed becasue at rare times they did not quite plant correctly.

In the discovery of Truth, there will always be misunderstandings and those who just don’t get it. However, in time, the Truth does become known and accepted.

Church and science? Just how many craters on the moon are names after Catholic Churchmen? And why?

Read the book.

 

[manualman]

Galileo “got into trouble” not for his scientific theories, but for introducing theology into science?

Really?

Are you referring to his letter to Duchess Christina explaining that a literal interpretation of Genesis in untenable?

I’m no referring to anything but a vaguely recalle radio interview. Read the book and check its sources, THEN come back and critique it.

 

[Curious_Seed]

Wrong.

The bedrock of Western Civilisation is the Natural Law based system of Morality and Law as codified and handed down all the way from the Byzantine Emperor Justinian. It is Catholic. Yes, it includes Greek and Roman influences, but only as adopted by the Church. The Catholic Church was Western Civilisation all the way up to the reformation. After the reformation it was still Christendom. The Catholic legal and moral framework which is the bedrock of Western Civilisation is only recently being pulled apart by secularism.

Wrong, for you, is right.

 

[karaleigh]

1633
Galileo is found guilty of violating the condition of 1616, by supporting Copernicus, and he is condemned [not just in trouble] to lifelong imprisonment, by the Roman Catholic Church.


Galileo was sentenced to prison and his book was banned. He was allowed to serve his time in house arrest, where he remained until his death in 1641. to Galileo commentary also says he was allowed to go home shortly after his trial. Keyfigures

 

[Curious_Seed]

Galileo did not have sufficient evidence to prove his theory over the one that was held by the scientists (mostly Jesuits) of the day. The Church had no problem with him publishing his work as theories, it became a problem when he refused to accept them as theories, and taught them as fact.

Also, he was put under house arrest in a 5 star building. That’s a bit different than being ‘imprisoned’.

Galileo did not have sufficient proof, in 1616: correct. But, there was no proof of the Aristotelian view, either: the view adopted by the Church. The Church had huge issues with him publishing the Copernican view and banned him from publishing.

With the newly elected Pope, he was invited back to explain his views. Once again he supported Copernicus, but, unfortunately misapplied Kepler’s math, as proof. The Church charged him not with failure to convince the second time, but violating their 1616 ruling against supporting Copernicus.

Interesting that if you were told not to leave your house, you would not consider that imprisonment. For those of us who value liberty, none of us would dare to mitigate the meaning of prison.

He was arrested, convicted, and imprisoned, by the Roman Catholic Church, for believing his truth, not the Church’s truth - but, as we all know, he got it right, and the Church failed to do so.

 

[Curious_Seed]

I’m no referring to anything but a vaguely recalle radio interview. Read the book and check its sources, THEN come back and critique it.

I am not critiquing the book’s thoughts; I am critiquing your thoughts.

 

[KathleenGee]

The problem with Galileo is overstepping his jurisdiction and making theological deductions.

Only the Apostolic Church…meaning that which gives the fullness of Christ through the witness of the Apostles … is the only authorized source for Christian theology…illuminating the truth of Jesus Christ.

The whole world, not just members of the Catholic Church, thought the world was flat…faith and reason go hand in hand…

And likewise, it is not reasonable and objective to categorically deny all the good the Church has done. St. Athanasius in his time exhorted the Church to yoke with solid education with faith.