How to deal with shame?

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Fast forward about 35 years. Yep, life was fun away from religion and rules. Had it made, just thought when I get old I will waltz right back into the Church, then it would be easier to follow religious rules.

Then one night about nine years ago “boom!” An authentic demon attack, twice in one night. Watching your wife almost die, feeling and seeing that glimpse of hell, oh boy, that will change your perception in an instant! So much for all the fun, we just wanted to survive! Needless to say, I begged God, really begged, as in Lord I will change my ways just please make this go away! He did when He put Psalm 23 in my mouth.

The next day with no hesitation we threw out everything rated R or X, we had a different point of view! We didn’t just clean out house, we cleaned our internal house as well. Holy and unholy was then real easy to see. Heaven and hell were front and center, not an afterthought.

My purpose in telling all this is to say I was once stubborn, blind and ignorant. What I perceived as religion and rules was false! They are not rules… They are Christ’s teachings! They are not restraints… They are freedom! ALL of Christ’s teachings are too free us from the bondage of sin and to lead us to the Kingdom of God, eternal life.

I pray you will not see the Church as just religion and a set of boring stringent rules, but will see Her for what She is, THE LIVING BODY OF CHRIST, not a hotel for Saints but a hospital for sinners like me!

Yep, I still fall some, but I have seen the other side up close and personal, I would rather be in the hospital (the Church) than in the morgue (you know where). Christ’s medicine is much better than Satan’s poison.

Rule #1 - there are no rules! Just Christ’s love for us, His hand reaching out as a good Shepard does!
 
I think we are working off different definition of shame. Usually when someone says someone is a shameless whatever, it’s a bad thing. Shame is the nudge of one’s conscience or better sense. If someone never felt shame over doing anything wrong, then something is wrong with them.

I’d say a lack of shame is one of the main things wrong with society. It keeps people content with low standards of conduct.
 
Conscience is conscience. Shame is just feeling lousy about yourself. The dictionary defines “shame” as “a painful feeling of humiliation or distress caused by the consciousness of wrong or foolish behavior.”

Shame and guilt are often used as tools by the manipulative who want to control others whom they perceive as sinful in some way. They are often also associated with sexual behavior. They are particularly unhelpful there because the bad feelings of shame and guilt can become entangled with the sexual feelings and pervert your entire experience of sexuality.

Shame is just useless for productively changing anyone’s behavior; we should toss it in the trash. Just my opinion.
 
Why would humans have evolved to feel an emotion that is 100% useless? Also, a manipulative person can take pretty much anything good or neutral and turn it against you.
 
While sin is real, and there are things we should and shouldn’t do, we have to remember that our religion is first and foremost a relationship with a loving God who doesn’t want you to run into harm.
If you fall, He will pick you up.
You don’t need to feel pain and shame, just walk with the Lord 🙂
 
Humans feel all sorts of useless emotions daily. Many of them serve no purpose except to lead us into sin.
We feel these emotions because of our animal nature.

If you think shame is helpful, feel free to feel it all you want, yourself.
Just refrain from imposing it on others.

We need more actual, GOOD Catholics, not the “Recovering Catholic” kind, to advocate against the use of shame and guilt and appeal more to people’s reason and their positive emotions.
You should want to do the right thing because a) it pleases God and b) it has positive effects.
Not because if you don’t do the right thing you’re a low-down, dirty, shameful worm.
 
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Like I said before, shame is for actions, not people. Shame can work if you interpret it as a “you are better than that,” not a “you can’t do better.” Healthy people can utilize even unpleasant emotions to benefit themselves. A lot of people don’t know how to do that nowadays because we’ve been told to run from our unpleasant emotions. We need both.
 
In my era, shame was overused on both children and women. A lot of us suffered bad effects. My personal reaction to other people trying to “shame” me was to just go out and do whatever the questionable behavior was, twice as much, as an “in your face” gesture. From what I have seen, this is still a very common reaction.

That is part of why we have the whole “avoid bad emotions” concept today. People suffered greatly from being made to feel bad about themselves. Usually when shame and guilt were imposed in the past, it was being done by someone who was angry and/or in authority. It was not a “you’re better than that” constructive criticism. It was “How could you do this bad thing? You’re no good.” And in many cases, the shame was inappropriately imposed (example: telling a rape victim it was her fault she was raped because she went out in a short skirt and made a man get too excited).

This is my last word on the subject because I am repeating myself, but I truly have zero use for anyone who imposes shame on another person as a tool for improvement. It does. not. work. and the risks of it are great.

Encouraging someone to do better is not really shaming them. It is encouraging them to do better. There is a difference.

It is also possible to have conscience without shame. And that’s the goal we should ALL be striving for in my opinion.
 
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jtwp5 said:
See, I have gotten the idea that lust is one of the worst things I can do and I always seem to feel the most shame with it.
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It might help if you looked at the people around you differently. Rather than objectifying them, for example, you might consciously look at them and think, “What a (beautiful) (handsome) (whatever) person you made, God.” Or, “That’s a child of God. He gave them so many beautiful gifts.” Or, “Jesus loved them enough to die for them. I don’t want to do/think anything that would harm their souls.” Or, “That person used to be someone’s little (boy) (girl) (whatever)… I wonder how they were when they were small and innocent.” Or things like that. You rephrase the way that you perceive the people around you, so that you don’t see them as objects to lust after, but as fellow-creatures who exist to know/serve/love God as you do, and we’re all on this path together. So you pray for them, in the back of your mind, that God gives them the graces he most wants to give them, and you move your thoughts onwards to the next thing in life, rather than dwelling too long on them.
 
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You stated you tried a Catholic Courage group but it didn’t help you. You might consider trying another such group, just to be with people who are facing similar problems to your own. As they say, the meeting of minds can be helpful. Talk honestly with some of your straight friends as well whom you can confide in. I would also suggest seeing an empathic psychotherapist so that you have a professional to talk to who is not judging you. Further, a trusted priest might be able to help you feel somewhat better about your sexual orientation as well. At the same time, try to pay a little more attention to the needs and problems of others instead of focusing exclusively on the shame you are feeling. In other words, redirect some of your energy toward helping other people, even in small ways. Finally, concentrate on the good aspects of your life, such as your job, as well as of your faith, rather than only the bad. None of this is easy, but if you want to feel better about yourself, you must find the inner strength to take steps and make changes in your life to lessen your feelings of shame.
 
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Funny, my generation had the opposite problem. And I’m seeing the negative consequences of that.
 
I have heard that the Church has developed successful programs to reverse same-sex attraction. I can’t confirm that, but it might be something you want to look into.
 
Shame is all about valuation - or “self worth”. We feel - or are made to feel - shame when we see ourselves as worthless. “Shame on you!!” - really means “You are worth less because of what you’ve done”.

The business definition of value is: the price at which a transaction occurs between a willing buyer and a willing seller, neither being under duress (i.e. no “fire sale”).

Paul says this in 1 Corinthians 6 about our value:

“Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.”

You were bought with a great price. Our great King bought and paid for you on a hill 2,000 years ago. On that Friday, He bore all our shame - and there was plenty of it to go around.

The question is - do you believe what he did. Do you really, no kidding, believe that He paid for you - and what you’re worth as a result of the deal. Do you believe in whose you are? Do you believe in your value? If you do - if you really believe and know what was done for you - and what your value is - there is no place for “worthlessness” - only joy. And then we respond - we go and with His help, sin no more.
 
I’ve heard about it. It sounds like a good app, I’ll have to try it out. I’m pretty much desperate to get over my addiction.
 
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