How to evangelize/correct others

[DMC12]

i have this problem, i found it very difficult to teach what God says to others, for example a friend of mine who is sexually active and says he is Catholic besides as far as I remember he accepts the usage of the morning-after-pill. how could i tell them that some stuff they do is wrong, specially when they are not someone who are under my charge (like children). and also to avoid that they leave the Church due to some me teaching them in the wrong way (in the pill case i fear that if i say that its punishment its excommunication he might leave the Church). I’ve read here that we should correct others, but sometimes it is not our duty and could end up doing more damage.

 

[oldgraymare2]

HI DMC12,

Sometimes we have to look at how well we know someone, and how receptive we think that they might be to our advice. Some people would not take well to our advice.

Sometimes the best thing that we can do is lead by example, by the life that we live, in general.

You have to think about how well you know this person, and what kind of relationship you have with him–if you are able to talk to him. It seems like you might be afraid that just by mentioning this situation that concerns you, he may want to leave the church.

If we want to be true Catholics, we are not supposed to “pick and choose” what we believe, but we are to follow all that the church teaches us about our faith.

 

[sousley]

Correction without love is not something we should engage in; Pope Francis recently spoke on this ideological type of Christianity. On the other hand, we should not ignore a perpetual sin of our brethren either as it causes scandal within the Body of Christ. Both of these are not only admonished in the Bible, but consider the Confiteor-- In my thoughts, in my words, in what I have done, in what I have failed to do.

So ask yourself, why correct them? Because I want to feel like SuperCatholic! (is there pride, contempt, or other vices that drive you?) If so, the only person you should be speaking to is God.

Or is it for love of your brother’s soul–not wanting them to be in mortal sin–not wanting them to scandalize their brothers with a sinful witness. If so, you motives are right and you should say something–after you pray.

Birth Control? Read Humanae Vitae first; Persona Humana and the Catechism aren’t bad either. We have a treasure trove of Holy Spirit guidance at our fingertips. So pray…read…pray…read, etc.–and when you do speak, remember to listen to your brother, and let the Holy Spirit guide your words, in love, and you’ll be fine.

 

[DMC12]

well, it’s not a valid reason i think, i do it mainly because I fear I have to answer for their sins, altough when I think about it, their well being is important also, specially when thinking about my close ones.

funny, it is fear what motivates me but it’s also fear which stops me, so any advice is well received, also I guess I should ask you people on CAF to pray for me so i can overcome this cowardice.

 

[KrazyKat]

well, it’s not a valid reason i think, i do it mainly because I fear I have to answer for their sins, altough when I think about it, their well being is important also, specially when thinking about my close ones.

funny, it is fear what motivates me but it’s also fear which stops me, so any advice is well received, also I guess I should ask you people on CAF to pray for me so i can overcome this cowardice.

We do not answer to God for the sins of others.

 

[sousley]

well, it’s not a valid reason i think, i do it mainly because I fear I have to answer for their sins, altough when I think about it, their well being is important also, specially when thinking about my close ones.

funny, it is fear what motivates me but it’s also fear which stops me, so any advice is well received, also I guess I should ask you people on CAF to pray for me so i can overcome this cowardice.

I will definitely remember you in my prayers tonight God Bless.

 

[fred_conty]

well, it’s not a valid reason i think, i do it mainly because I fear I have to answer for their sins, altough when I think about it, their well being is important also, specially when thinking about my close ones.

funny, it is fear what motivates me but it’s also fear which stops me, so any advice is well received, also I guess I should ask you people on CAF to pray for me so i can overcome this cowardice.

You may be thinking of “don’t put out the smoldering wick”, and that is a consideration. But then again “God chastises those whom he loves.”
A person could well play tennis with themselves hitting these ideas back and forth.

It is the right moment in the right situation, like a spider siezing the fly.
Just be patient and take the right opportunity when you see it.

There are times when all of us need a good cop and a bad cop. Those who love the most clean up other people’s messes.

May God our Father give you grace and peace.

 

[ClearWater]

We do not answer to God for the sins of others.

There is a passage in scripture, but I couldn’t locate it, where it says if we don’t warn our brother that what he is doing is sinful, we are likewise held responsible. However, if we warn him and he continues, only he will be held responsible.

The main question then would be when this would apply. I don’t think it applies to all contexts.

 

[ClearWater]

i have this problem, i found it very difficult to teach what God says to others, for example a friend of mine who is sexually active and says he is Catholic besides as far as I remember he accepts the usage of the morning-after-pill. how could i tell them that some stuff they do is wrong, specially when they are not someone who are under my charge (like children). and also to avoid that they leave the Church due to some me teaching them in the wrong way (in the pill case i fear that if i say that its punishment its excommunication he might leave the Church). I’ve read here that we should correct others, but sometimes it is not our duty and could end up doing more damage.

If he’s a fellow Catholic friend, you could just say, once, when the issue is raised, that the morning after pill is against the Catholic faith and leave it at that, not nag, just state it flatly, briefly. If he decides to leave the Church due to its policies, that’s not your responsibility. That’s a risk we all take.

Christ went out and was rejected by a lot of people, probably most! Christ said that, in the end, his sheep would listen to his voice.

 

[KrazyKat]

If you feel you need to point out his sins the morning after pill is not the main one, without the sin of Fornication the other would not come into the picture.

 

[powerofk]

There is a passage in scripture, but I couldn’t locate it, where it says if we don’t warn our brother that what he is doing is sinful, we are likewise held responsible. However, if we warn him and he continues, only he will be held responsible.

The main question then would be when this would apply. I don’t think it applies to all contexts.

I believe that’s the famous “Watchman” passage (I believe it’s from Isaiah, but possibly Jeremiah): “The LORD said to me: I have appointed you watchman over Israel. If a man sins, and you do not correct him, and he dies for his sin, I will hold you accountable for that man’s death. If you try to correct him but he continues in his sin and dies, you are free from accountability” (or something to that extent - it’s paraphrased). In other words, it’s saying that if we keep silent, we tacitly are approving the sin. But - at times, it is difficult to find the right words to say to chastise with love, and so we are silent - not because we approve, but because we don’t know how to say how we feel in a way that shows concern.

 

[Cathoholic]

I assume you are well catechized.

Try just talking about the last things (death, judgment, Heaven, and Hell) or the authority of the Church issue.

Then possibly he will eventually ask you about specific sins or something in the conversation can take you there easier.

The Roman Catechism (RC) teaches us why we should teach about eternal condemnation or “hell”. The RC states . . .

ROMAN CATECHISM (concerning teachings about “hell”) “the truth. . . will, if accepted with faithful dispositions, be most powerful in bridling the evil inclinations of the heart and in withdrawing men from sin. Hence we read in Ecclesiasticus : ‘In all thy works remember thy last end, and thou shalt never sin.’ And indeed there is scarcely anyone so given over to vice as not to be recalled to virtue by the thought that he must one day render an account before an all-just Judge, not only of all his words and actions, but even of his most secret thoughts, and must suffer punishment according to his deserts.

On the other hand, the just man will be more and more encouraged to lead a good life. Even though his days be passed in poverty, ignominy and suffering, he must be gladdened exceedingly when he looks forward to that day when, the conflicts of this wretched life being over, he shall be declared victorious in the hearing of all men, and shall be admitted into his heavenly country to be crowned with divine honours that shall never fade.”

Admonishing your fellow sinner is an act of mercy (see “Spiritual Works of Mercy”) and will be a channel of grace for your friend . . . . and . . . for you too.

JAMES 5:19-20 19 My brethren, if any one among you wanders from the truth and some one brings him back, 20 let him know that whoever brings back a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

“In your face religion,” will drive a non-believer further away than draw him toward Christ, especially in today’s world where after sex abuse scandal in the Church, people, especially young people have no trust in religion.

Remember, the faith we have was given to us, it was not of our own doing, Christ revealed himself to us in various ways where we became his disciples.

So, in order to help a non-believer to come to Christ, they must see in us, something that is trusting and better than what they have.

Without a doubt, love and compassion are these virtues which will allow a non-believer to lend an ear and hear what you have to say.

Condemnation and threats of hell-fire, will send them packing and they’ll avoid you at all cost.

A friend of mine does this and has driven every member of his family away from the Church.

Pope Francis is drawing people to Christ through his words of hope and compassion. Follow his lead.

Jim

 

[Cathoholic]

JimR-OCDS. You said:

“In your face religion,” will drive a non-believer further away than draw him toward Christ

If you meant be pastoral when giving fraternal correction I concur.

If you meant “don’t admonish the sinner at all” I disagree.

You said:

Condemnation and threats of hell-fire, will send them packing and they’ll avoid you at all cost.

But nobody here is suggesting “condemnation and threats”.

We cannot judge souls so why give threats? Who are we to judge (souls)?

I merely talked about the salutary influences of meditating on the four last things and quoted the Roman Catechism as to WHY this is helpful concerning the condemnation issue (do you think the Church is wrong on this?).

You stated:

So, in order to help a non-believer to come to Christ, they must see in us, something that is trusting and better than what they have.

I concur with this “Good example” motif too.

But if you are saying what I think you are saying (don’t correct someone), I disagree.

We don’t inject a false dichotomy of “live by example” versus “pastoral fraternal correction”. We do both.

We also judge actions not souls.

You also said:

Pope Francis is drawing people to Christ through his words of hope and compassion. Follow his lead.

But recently when an Australian Catholic Priest was preaching gay “marriage” and possibly giving the Eucharist to a dog, I guarantee that Pope Francis didn’t merely say to himself:

So, in order to help this wayward Priest to come to Christ, they must see, me giving the Eucharist to people and NOT preaching gay “marriage”.

Pope Francis DID do those things to be sure, but he also excommunicated this Priest (see here).

Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict likewise drew “people to Christ through his words of hope and compassion.”

But they (like Pope Francis) have corrected us. Fr. Barron talks about some of this here (drawing comparisons between Popes John Paul II, Benedict, and Francis of a doctrinal nature).

When St. Paul heard of the man living in a possibly incestuous relationship (in 1st Corinthians 5) I am sure he would have had no problem with setting a good example. But he also said: “Let him who has done this be removed from among you.”

DMC12 suggested this guy is sexually promiscuous (“sexually active”) and said, “he accepts the usage of the morning-after-pill”. DMC12 HAS the ministry of friendship with this guy.

Would you love your friend enough to try to warn him of his error as DMC12 is doing?

DMC12 is being a good friend to him.

You don’t have to be “in your face”. That would be another mischaracterization of what I said (if I am reading what you said correctly).

That’s exactly WHY I suggested to DMC12 to take a non-direct approach.

Instead of saying something like: “Quit being promiscuous and cut out the abortion-pill support routine or you are going to hell,” I merely suggested talking about the four last things or the authority of the Church issues–and I stand by that.

Four Last Things
“Hey so and so. What do you think about where we come from and where we are going? What do you think our judgments will be like? What do you think will happen? Why do you think that? Have you ever thought about it?”

Authority of the Church
Or something like: “What if we could sit down to a cup of coffee with Jesus? What do you think He would tell me and what do you think He would tell you? Do you know the Church teaches they actually have the authority of and from Jesus on matters of faith and morals?

An admonition does NOT have to be “in your face”.

DMC12. I would suggest BOTH an exemplary approach and a pastoral admonition.

Don’t fall into the phony false dichotomy of failing to give a spiritual work of mercy. God may have put you into this man’s life for this purpose (among others).

It may lead your friend to just come out and ask you something to the effect of:

“Do you think my fornicating could have long-term spiritual effects? What about me receiving the Eucharist? Do you think that is OK while I am carrying on like this without repentance?

Sometimes (and I am NOT saying this of you JimR-OCDS as I looked over some of your posts and I thought, “what a fine Catholic!”) people’s issue with admonishing the sinner, has more to do with their own slothful opposition to the Church’s teaching to admonish the sinner.

Yes admonish the sinner pastorally to be sure and when the occasion arises to be sure (don’t force it). But when we remove the log from our own eye, we THEN go tell our brother his fault.

 

[Sirach2]

Here are the conditions for fraternal correction as found in Third Spiritual Alphabet by Francisco de Osuna, pg. 588. It is the best one I have found on this subject. I pray it will help you.

The first is certain knowledge of the sin; do not correct on the basis of mere suspicion.

The second is meekness in correcting; if we threaten angrily, we will provoke the person we discipline and cause him to commit further sin.

The third condition is that there be no one else more suitable for correcting. If some who are as good or better than I see the sinner or if they are his superiors or are more familiar with them, I can probably assume and believe that one of them will discipline him. However if it were certain they would not, then I would be bound to correct him, provided the other five conditions were simultaneously present.

The fourth is that there must be hope that my counsel will correct him. If this hope is not present, I should not discipline him.

The fifth condition is that his sin be mortal, not venial.

The sixth is that there does not appear to be a better time or place for discipline than when I see him sin or when I choose to correct him.

Though it is difficult to meet any one of the six conditions, the most troublesome is that of discerning whether or not the sin is mortal. If we cannot determine the seriousness of the sin, let us place our finger to the mouth, sealing our lips, so we will not admit evil in our effort to do good or destroy instead of building up.