How to Explain...like Miss Manners

[graceandglory]

My conversion is going slowly due to transportation and scheduling issues, but I attend Divine Liturgy at least three out of four weekends / month.

The Director of Liturgy and Music at my former parish (we used to be close friends, separate issue) has made many heartfelt comments along the lines of, “I wish you would be Catholic again,” or, “Divine Liturgy, that’s not Mass,” or any number of misconceptions. A

The pastor understands as my Mission priest used to be one of the pastor’s professors in seminary, and the monsignor who used to be at our parish grew up Ruthenian so when I approached them with my needs, they readily supported me.

The music director isn’t as well versed in a lot of “church stuff,” and would call me with questions, sometimes looking for a reference on behalf of the pastor, so I need a way to explain that Eastern Catholics are fully Catholic without a history lesson.

Any ideas?

How exciting that you get to teach people more about the beauty and universality of the Catholic faith. It’s just a teaching opportunity. Just explain that you are in communion with the Pope and faithful to the Magisterium. Who’s to say I wouldn’t be Ruthenian or Maronite, given a local Eastern Catholic church in my area?

 

[Miserissima]

Vico, may I PM you? I love the flyer you linked; I just have a bunch of ‘stunted
in development’ questions to ask.

Grace, you’re right. It’s just that there is a personal element in there that I find … Highly challenging.

 

[CDB1718]

Sorry, CDB. I got so happy I posted the first thing in my head…!

Can you make one up that explains Eastern Catholics are fully Catholic and that Divine Liturgy counts as Mass? That type of pamphlet is perfect.

Is that hosted on your parish site? It’s a great site.

Yes, it is and yes I can! I started a new thread to discuss it.
What do Roman Catholics want or need to know about Eastern Catholicism?

Ukrainian Catholic Church handout:
stmarysbc.com/faith.html

Roman Catholics who know their faith seem to be almost universally ticked off by these infographics. Use with caution.

 

[Miserissima]

Yes, it is and yes I can! I started a new thread to discuss it.
What do Roman Catholics want or need to know about Eastern Catholicism?

Roman Catholics who know their faith seem to be almost universally ticked off by these infographics. Use with caution.

I can personally see how it would be offensive to more…traditional Latin Catholics. But that’s what I’m going to print out for tomorrow.

May I PM you? I have a bunch of offbeat questions that pop up from time to time.

 

[CDB1718]

I can personally see how it would be offensive to more…traditional Latin Catholics. But that’s what I’m going to print out for tomorrow.

May I PM you? I have a bunch of offbeat questions that pop up from time to time.

Sure!
Good luck tomorrow!

 

[Peter_J]

I really love the posts here today. I’d like to add: the roots of the problem run pretty deep. If you think about it, how many Latin Catholics are even aware of how much centralization took place in the Latin Church, in the last several centuries, or how much diversity was cut down? Non-Roman western rites (Mozarabic Rite, Ambrosian Rite, etc) are all close to extinction, in large part due to the decisions of Trent, and most modern Latin Catholics don’t even know that they exist.

I don’t want to go on and on, but in light of all that it isn’t entirely surprising that so many Latin Catholics also misunderstand the East.

 

[Vico]

Vico, may I PM you? I love the flyer you linked; I just have a bunch of ‘stunted
in development’ questions to ask.

Grace, you’re right. It’s just that there is a personal element in there that I find … Highly challenging.

yes.

 

[josie_L]

I really love the posts here today. I’d like to add: the roots of the problem run pretty deep. If you think about it, how many Latin Catholics are even aware of how much centralization took place in the Latin Church, in the last several centuries, or how much diversity was cut down? Non-Roman western rites (Mozarabic Rite, Ambrosian Rite, etc) are all close to extinction, in large part due to the decisions of Trent, and most modern Latin Catholics don’t even know that they exist.

I don’t want to go on and on, but in light of all that it isn’t entirely surprising that so many Latin Catholics also misunderstand the East.

You have to start somewhere! Who knows how much good individual Catholics such as yourself or others can do to bring greater awareness and diversity within the CC.

 

[Peter_J]

You have to start somewhere! Who knows how much good individual Catholics such as yourself or others can do to bring greater awareness and diversity within the CC.

Thanks!

 

[dvdjs]

…how many Latin Catholics are even aware of how much centralization took place in the Latin Church, in the last several centuries, or how much diversity was cut down?

What was cut down in the last several centuries?

Non-Roman western rites (Mozarabic Rite, Ambrosian Rite, etc) are all close to extinction, in large part due to the decisions of Trent

Both the Mozarabic and Ambrosian rites were preserved at Trent; pressure to adopt the Roman Rite had been present for centuries in the areas that had these Rites at the time of Trent.

Not sure what you have in mind with “etc.”

The key decision at Trent was to put to rest Rites that had been abandoned for centuries, with no continuing use. Integral organic authenticity - a complete and coherent spiritual patrimony is crucial to any proper use of a Rite.

 

[Aramis]

What was cut down in the last several centuries?

Both the Mozarabic and Ambrosian rites were preserved at Trent; pressure to adopt the Roman Rite had been present for centuries in the areas that had these Rites at the time of Trent.

Not sure what you have in mind with “etc.”

A dozen or so Western Rites Survived Trent. Aside from Rome’s, 4 of Them were regional (Ambrosian, Bragan, Mozarabic, Dalmatian) and the rest belong to religious Communities. of these, Only the Ambrosian, Mozarabic, & Dominican haveknown Current frequent use. The Dalmatian became irrelevant after Vatican II.

No one really Knows about Cloistered rites… Nor are we supposed to inquire, supposedly.

 

[malphono]

A dozen or so Western Rites Survived Trent. Aside from Rome’s, 4 of Them were regional (Ambrosian, Bragan, Mozarabic, Dalmatian) and the rest belong to religious Communities. of these, Only the Ambrosian, Mozarabic, & Dominican haveknown Current frequent use. The Dalmatian became irrelevant after Vatican II.

The Dalmatian wasn’t exactly a “rite” but rather an accommodation wherein the Roman Missal was used in OCS/Glagolitic. I’m not sure, but I believe this may have survived or at least been revived with Summorum Pontificum.

The Carmelite Rite (aka Rite of the Holy Sepulcher) still exists and is used by the Wyoming Carmelites and a silimar group in Brazil. It is also used (only with explicit permission) within the O.Carm from time-to-time, and by provision of Summorum Pontificum may be used privately by O.Carm. It was never used by the OCD.

The Praemonstratentian Rite (aka Norbertine) survived Trent but was abandoned shortly thereafter by vote of the General Chapter. Certain aspects (primarily in chant and the Office), however, were retained.

The Cistercian Rite also survived Trent and has been re-adopted by certain abbeys. The Carthusian Rite (at least as revised in the 1980s) remains in use in all Charterhouses.

The Lyonais Rite, (a derivative of the Gallican), also survived Trent and was used in the Archdiocese of Lyon until the mid-1960s. It has, apparently, experienced something of a revival in the wake of SP, but I’m unsure of the extent of that.