How to pray to Saints?

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Nice scripture love it, but nothing there says pray to saints or Mary. As God rebuked those who prayed to saints in Revelations. Timothy 2:5 is also validation.

We have a mediator named Jesus Christ. I just have a honest disagreement about why pray to Saints when we have a direct relationship with Christ and God. I think its more biblical and respectful of true deity.
Catholic theology supports praying to saints. I hear a lot of protestant wording in your post. That mediator is “the man” Jesus Christ, and needs to be read read in proper context.
catholic.com/tracts/praying-to-the-saints
 
r u sure your Catholic?

The Church teaches we can ask for the Saints prayers
js
God bless
I agree with what you say and understand that as well about Catholicism. I am just independent minded on some secondary issues as the topic.

Just biblically and from respect to deity not sure it makes sense when intercession is not needed and we have a direct relationship with God and Christ. I teach my kids to direct prayers to Trinity exclusively.
 
I agree with what you say and understand that as well about Catholicism. I am just independent minded on some secondary issues as the topic.

Just biblically and from respect to deity not sure it makes sense when intercession is not needed and we have a direct relationship with God and Christ. I teach my kids to direct prayers to Trinity exclusively.
The church fathers supported praying to saints, and they were quite wise. I understand your independence but embracing the council of the historic Christian faith is quite educational. In addition the bible directs us to to pray to saints.

Hermas

“[The Shepherd said:] ‘But those who are weak and slothful in prayer, hesitate to ask anything from the Lord; but the Lord is full of compassion, and gives without fail to all who ask him. But you, [Hermas,] having been strengthened by the holy angel [you saw], and having obtained from him such intercession, and not being slothful, why do not you ask of the Lord understanding, and receive it from him?’” (The Shepherd 3:5:4 [A.D. 80]).

Clement of Alexandria

“In this way is he [the true Christian] always pure for prayer. He also prays in the society of angels, as being already of angelic rank, and he is never out of their holy keeping; and though he pray alone, he has the choir of the saints standing with him [in prayer]” (Miscellanies 7:12 [A.D. 208]).

Origen

“But not the high priest [Christ] alone prays for those who pray sincerely, but also the angels . . . as also the souls of the saints who have already fallen asleep” (Prayer 11 [A.D. 233]).

Cyprian of Carthage

“Let us remember one another in concord and unanimity. Let us on both sides [of death] always pray for one another. Let us relieve burdens and afflictions by mutual love, that if one of us, by the swiftness of divine condescension, shall go hence first, our love may continue in the presence of the Lord, and our prayers for our brethren and sisters not cease in the presence of the Father’s mercy” (Letters 56[60]:5 [A.D. 253]).

Methodius

“Hail to you for ever, Virgin Mother of God, our unceasing joy, for to you do I turn again. You are the beginning of our feast; you are its middle and end; the pearl of great price that belongs to the kingdom; the fat of every victim, the living altar of the Bread of Life [Jesus]. Hail, you treasure of the love of God. Hail, you fount of the Son’s love for man. . . . You gleamed, sweet gift-bestowing Mother, with the light of the sun; you gleamed with the insupportable fires of a most fervent charity, bringing forth in the end that which was conceived of you . . . making manifest the mystery hidden and unspeakable, the invisible Son of the Father—the Prince of Peace, who in a marvelous manner showed himself as less than all littleness” (Oration on Simeon and Anna 14 [A.D. 305]).

“Therefore, we pray [ask] you, the most excellent among women, who glories in the confidence of your maternal honors, that you would unceasingly keep us in remembrance. O holy Mother of God, remember us, I say, who make our boast in you, and who in august hymns celebrate the memory, which will ever live, and never fade away” (ibid.).

“And you also, O honored and venerable Simeon, you earliest host of our holy religion, and teacher of the resurrection of the faithful, do be our patron and advocate with that Savior God, whom you were deemed worthy to receive into your arms. We, together with you, sing our praises to Christ, who has the power of life and death, saying, ‘You are the true Light, proceeding from the true Light; the true God, begotten of the true God’” (ibid.).

Hilary of Poitiers

“To those who wish to stand [in God’s grace], neither the guardianship of saints nor the defenses of angels are wanting” (Commentary on the Psalms 124:5:6 [A.D. 365]).

Ephraim the Syrian

“You victorious martyrs who endured torments gladly for the sake of the God and Savior, you who have boldness of speech toward the Lord himself, you saints, intercede for us who are timid and sinful men, full of sloth, that the grace of Christ may come upon us, and enlighten the hearts of all of us so that we may love him” (Commentary on Mark [A.D. 370]).

“Remember me, you heirs of God, you brethren of Christ; supplicate the Savior earnestly for me, that I may be freed through Christ from him that fights against me day by day” (The Fear at the End of Life [A.D. 370]).

The Liturgy of St. Basil

“By the command of your only-begotten Son we communicate with the memory of your saints . . . by whose prayers and supplications have mercy upon us all, and deliver us for the sake of your holy name” (Liturgy of St. Basil [A.D. 373]).

Gregory of Nazianz

“May you [Cyprian] look down from above propitiously upon us, and guide our word and life; and shepherd this sacred flock . . . gladden the Holy Trinity, before which you stand” (Orations 17[24] [A.D. 380]).

"Yes, I am well assured that [my father’s] intercession is of more avail now than was his instruction in former days, since he is closer to God, now that he has shaken off his bodily fetters, and freed his mind from the clay that obscured it, and holds conversation naked with the nakedness of the prime and purest mind . . . " (ibid., 18:4).

John Chrysostom

“He that wears the purple * . . . stands begging of the saints to be his patrons with God, and he that wears a diadem begs the tentmaker [Paul] and the fisherman [Peter] as patrons, even though they be dead” (Homilies on Second Corinthians 26 [A.D. 392]).

“When you perceive that God is chastening you, fly not to his enemies . . . but to his friends, the martyrs, the saints, and those who were pleasing to him, and who have great power [in God]” (Orations 8:6 [A.D. 396]).*
 
There is no scripture that states pray to Saints, contrary to the opposite… I accept the doctrination by Catholic leaders to pray to saints. That is my understanding as well.

Thanks
The church fathers supported praying to saints, and they were quite wise. I understand your independence but embracing the council of the historic Christian faith is quite educational. In addition the bible directs us to to pray to saints.

Hermas

“[The Shepherd said:] ‘But those who are weak and slothful in prayer, hesitate to ask anything from the Lord; but the Lord is full of compassion, and gives without fail to all who ask him. But you, [Hermas,] having been strengthened by the holy angel [you saw], and having obtained from him such intercession, and not being slothful, why do not you ask of the Lord understanding, and receive it from him?’” (The Shepherd 3:5:4 [A.D. 80]).

Clement of Alexandria

“In this way is he [the true Christian] always pure for prayer. He also prays in the society of angels, as being already of angelic rank, and he is never out of their holy keeping; and though he pray alone, he has the choir of the saints standing with him [in prayer]” (Miscellanies 7:12 [A.D. 208]).

Origen

“But not the high priest [Christ] alone prays for those who pray sincerely, but also the angels . . . as also the souls of the saints who have already fallen asleep” (Prayer 11 [A.D. 233]).

Cyprian of Carthage

“Let us remember one another in concord and unanimity. Let us on both sides [of death] always pray for one another. Let us relieve burdens and afflictions by mutual love, that if one of us, by the swiftness of divine condescension, shall go hence first, our love may continue in the presence of the Lord, and our prayers for our brethren and sisters not cease in the presence of the Father’s mercy” (Letters 56[60]:5 [A.D. 253]).

Methodius

“Hail to you for ever, Virgin Mother of God, our unceasing joy, for to you do I turn again. You are the beginning of our feast; you are its middle and end; the pearl of great price that belongs to the kingdom; the fat of every victim, the living altar of the Bread of Life [Jesus]. Hail, you treasure of the love of God. Hail, you fount of the Son’s love for man. . . . You gleamed, sweet gift-bestowing Mother, with the light of the sun; you gleamed with the insupportable fires of a most fervent charity, bringing forth in the end that which was conceived of you . . . making manifest the mystery hidden and unspeakable, the invisible Son of the Father—the Prince of Peace, who in a marvelous manner showed himself as less than all littleness” (Oration on Simeon and Anna 14 [A.D. 305]).

“Therefore, we pray [ask] you, the most excellent among women, who glories in the confidence of your maternal honors, that you would unceasingly keep us in remembrance. O holy Mother of God, remember us, I say, who make our boast in you, and who in august hymns celebrate the memory, which will ever live, and never fade away” (ibid.).

“And you also, O honored and venerable Simeon, you earliest host of our holy religion, and teacher of the resurrection of the faithful, do be our patron and advocate with that Savior God, whom you were deemed worthy to receive into your arms. We, together with you, sing our praises to Christ, who has the power of life and death, saying, ‘You are the true Light, proceeding from the true Light; the true God, begotten of the true God’” (ibid.).

Hilary of Poitiers

“To those who wish to stand [in God’s grace], neither the guardianship of saints nor the defenses of angels are wanting” (Commentary on the Psalms 124:5:6 [A.D. 365]).

Ephraim the Syrian

“You victorious martyrs who endured torments gladly for the sake of the God and Savior, you who have boldness of speech toward the Lord himself, you saints, intercede for us who are timid and sinful men, full of sloth, that the grace of Christ may come upon us, and enlighten the hearts of all of us so that we may love him” (Commentary on Mark [A.D. 370]).

“Remember me, you heirs of God, you brethren of Christ; supplicate the Savior earnestly for me, that I may be freed through Christ from him that fights against me day by day” (The Fear at the End of Life [A.D. 370]).

The Liturgy of St. Basil

“By the command of your only-begotten Son we communicate with the memory of your saints . . . by whose prayers and supplications have mercy upon us all, and deliver us for the sake of your holy name” (Liturgy of St. Basil [A.D. 373]).

Gregory of Nazianz

“May you [Cyprian] look down from above propitiously upon us, and guide our word and life; and shepherd this sacred flock . . . gladden the Holy Trinity, before which you stand” (Orations 17[24] [A.D. 380]).

"Yes, I am well assured that [my father’s] intercession is of more avail now than was his instruction in former days, since he is closer to God, now that he has shaken off his bodily fetters, and freed his mind from the clay that obscured it, and holds conversation naked with the nakedness of the prime and purest mind . . . " (ibid., 18:4).

John Chrysostom

“He that wears the purple * . . . stands begging of the saints to be his patrons with God, and he that wears a diadem begs the tentmaker [Paul] and the fisherman [Peter] as patrons, even though they be dead” (Homilies on Second Corinthians 26 [A.D. 392]).

“When you perceive that God is chastening you, fly not to his enemies . . . but to his friends, the martyrs, the saints, and those who were pleasing to him, and who have great power [in God]” (Orations 8:6 [A.D. 396]).*
 
I pray to my patron Saint Damien every day. I pray to Jesus directly a lot too, but when I dont feel like I am worthy, like in a state of mortal sin, I ask Saint Damien to pray with me.

He has interceded for me a few times, and I was healed of 2 minor health problems with his help. Praying to saints can be really awesome.
 
There is no scripture that states pray to Saints, contrary to the opposite… I accept the doctrination by Catholic leaders to pray to saints. That is my understanding as well.

Thanks
But whatever the Church proclaims as doctrine, is of the Bible and doesn’t go against Bible teachings,
 
But whatever the Church proclaims as doctrine, is of the Bible and doesn’t go against Bible teachings,
Then what is the scripture that we pray to Saints and Mary? It’s a direct conflict to Timothy 2:5,

Prays to saints and Mary is based not on the bible, but upon Catholic tradition.
 
Then what is the scripture that we pray to Saints and Mary? It’s a direct conflict to Timothy 2:5,

Prays to saints and Mary is based not on the bible, but upon Catholic tradition.
it doesn’t contridict that verse S: your on a forum, if you hold the Catholic faith as truth, you must accept this, and the Saints pray for us, there is only one meditator between God and man, search these forums, this topic has been addressed abunch, id answer, but im going to bed, night, God bless you, St. Francis pray for you and protect you (:

Edit: heres a website for you to check out

scripturecatholic.com/saints.html#saints-IV

catholic.com/tracts/praying-to-the-saints
 
it doesn’t contridict that verse S: your on a forum, if you hold the Catholic faith as truth, you must accept this, and the Saints pray for us, there is only one meditator between God and man, search these forums, this topic has been addressed abunch, id answer, but im going to bed, night, God bless you, St. Francis pray for you and protect you (:

Edit: heres a website for you to check out

scripturecatholic.com/saints.html#saints-IV

catholic.com/tracts/praying-to-the-saints
We are saying the same thing in different ways. I agree Catholicism teaches and approves praying to saints, I just say from a biblical perspective only its a conflict.
 
We are saying the same thing in different ways. I agree Catholicism teaches and approves praying to saints, I just say from a biblical perspective only its a conflict.
You mean it is an individual conflict, for you? From a purely Catholic perspective there is no conflict. I would assume you’ve done some study on this. I would only encourage you to get into an exhaustive study on the matter because the body, and" the great glory cloud of witnesses " should be instrumental in the Catholic walk.

scripturecatholic.com/saints.html
 
You mean it is an individual conflict, for you? From a purely Catholic perspective there is no conflict. I would assume you’ve done some study on this. I would only encourage you to get into an exhaustive study on the matter because the body, and" the great glory cloud of witnesses " should be instrumental in the Catholic walk.

scripturecatholic.com/saints.html
I have exhausted the record and talked with Priests plus did my own research. Best I gather we pray to saints because Catholicism says so, but again not in scripture.
OK fine.

I am comfortable being Catholic though I pray only to true deity.
 
Please pray for me and I will pray for you. But please don’t pray to me and I will not pray to you.

God Bless.
If you read literature from the 14th to 16th century, you’ll see that the word pray does not mean to Glorify or Adore… It means basically to talk to.

When I “pray” to a Saint, I am simply talking to them and asking them to “Pray” for me to Jesus. Just as when I asked you to “pray” for me.

I can’t look up the Chapter : Verse this 10 seconds, but in the Book of John’s Revelation elders approach Jesus at His Throne with the prayers of those still living. Maccabees also has some relevant passages about praying for the dead and them praying for us.

Personally I agree with you that it’s a bad choice of words… We don’t (and shouldn’t) “pray” to Saints if you take the word “pray” to mean Adore and Glorify… There’s only One that gets that… I’m just too old at this point to worry about splitting hairs over the definition of a word. Are you OK with the idea of talking to Saints and asking them for their prayers to Jesus? If so, then we agree on everything except the definition of the word “Pray”…

God bless
 
Please pray for me and I will pray for you. But please don’t pray to me and I will not pray to you.

God Bless.
Would you repel someone that wanted to pray for you? Thats what the saints are doing.

Is it difficult for you at mass when the priest occasionally evokes a Hail Mary for a particular reason?
 
I believe prayers should be to deity exclusively. I don’t pray to you, saints, Mary or anyone else only God.

The bible makes it clear we don’t need intercession, only Christ is a mediator ,Revelation has God rebuking those who prayed to saints.

Not a big deal only disagreement I have with Catholicism, it is not mandatory to pray to saints and Mary far as I know.
If you read literature from the 14th to 16th century, you’ll see that the word pray does not mean to Glorify or Adore… It means basically to talk to.

When I “pray” to a Saint, I am simply talking to them and asking them to “Pray” for me to Jesus. Just as when I asked you to “pray” for me.

I can’t look up the Chapter : Verse this 10 seconds, but in the Book of John’s Revelation elders approach Jesus at His Throne with the prayers of those still living. Maccabees also has some relevant passages about praying for the dead and them praying for us.

Personally I agree with you that it’s a bad choice of words… We don’t (and shouldn’t) “pray” to Saints if you take the word “pray” to mean Adore and Glorify… There’s only One that gets that… I’m just too old at this point to worry about splitting hairs over the definition of a word. Are you OK with the idea of talking to Saints and asking them for their prayers to Jesus? If so, then we agree on everything except the definition of the word “Pray”…

God bless
 
Would you repel someone that wanted to pray for you? Thats what the saints are doing.

Is it difficult for you at mass when the priest occasionally evokes a Hail Mary for a particular reason?
Yes I said before pray for me, don’t pray to me.

Direct your prayers to God.
 
I believe prayers should be to deity exclusively. I don’t pray to you, saints, Mary or anyone else only God.

The bible makes it clear we don’t need intercession, only Christ is a mediator ,Revelation has God rebuking those who prayed to saints.

Not a big deal only disagreement I have with Catholicism, it is not mandatory to pray to saints and Mary far as I know.
Could you please define “pray”? I think this is much ado of nothing…

Thanks

God bless
 
Yes I said before pray for me, don’t pray to me.

Direct your prayers to God.
No not to you FOR you. Praying is asking a saint to pray (ask God) for you. Yes some people go too far and deify the saint but that is wrong.
Catholics fully agree that Paul refers to living Christians as saints. All of us in the body of Christ are saints.

It would be easy to conclude that this is the only way to use the word “saint.” However, long before the time of Christ, King David used the term “saint” while speaking to his fellow Jews, “Love the Lord all you his saints” (Psalm 31:23 NRSV and NIV). The KJB has over 80 instances of the word “saint” in the Old Testament that don’t refer to “living Christians”(i.e., 1 Sam.2, 2 Chr.6:41, Job.5:1, Prov.2:8, Dan.7:18, 21, Hos 11:12).

Even Paul sometimes gives the word a distinct meaning: “believers and saints” (Acts 9:32 ), “to the saints and faithful brothers” (Col 1:2). The term is used in a variety of contexts throughout the Bible. The word “saint” simply means “holy one” or “sanctified” (Sanctus). It could be a Jew of the Old Testament, a Christian of the New Testament, a faithful Christian living today, or a Christian in Heaven.
 
👍
No not to you FOR you. Praying is asking a saint to pray (ask God) for you. Yes some people go too far and deify the saint but that is wrong.
Catholics fully agree that Paul refers to living Christians as saints. All of us in the body of Christ are saints.

It would be easy to conclude that this is the only way to use the word “saint.” However, long before the time of Christ, King David used the term “saint” while speaking to his fellow Jews, “Love the Lord all you his saints” (Psalm 31:23 NRSV and NIV). The KJB has over 80 instances of the word “saint” in the Old Testament that don’t refer to “living Christians”(i.e., 1 Sam.2, 2 Chr.6:41, Job.5:1, Prov.2:8, Dan.7:18, 21, Hos 11:12).

Even Paul sometimes gives the word a distinct meaning: “believers and saints” (Acts 9:32 ), “to the saints and faithful brothers” (Col 1:2). The term is used in a variety of contexts throughout the Bible. The word “saint” simply means “holy one” or “sanctified” (Sanctus). It could be a Jew of the Old Testament, a Christian of the New Testament, a faithful Christian living today, or a Christian in Heaven.
I can’t convince you and you can’t convince me of the wisdom or lack their of in directing prayers to saints.

Since prayers to saints are not mandatory within the RCC I feel I am in good standing on the other 99% of core beliefs.

Good debate, lets hope Obama and Romney are as civil tonight.

👍
 
Could you please define “pray”? I think this is much ado of nothing…

Thanks

God bless
👍 This

And this:
Rev 5:8 And when he had taken it, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb. Each one had a harp and they were holding golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints.
Even if you equate “saints” with “Christians”, weren’t all in Christ ? Aren’t we one body ? Whether asleep or alive ? Hebrews 12 the author says we’re surrounded by a
“great could of witnesses…”
I personally think you’re taking 1 Tim 2:5 out of context. Christ the Mediator was the bridge that covered our separation from God by the Fall. If you want to take 1 Tim 2:5 literally you’d have to pray directly to Jesus to get him to intercede. The problem with that was his death and resurrection was the intercession! He is the mediator for eternal life. 1 John 5:11-12. He is the mediator for grace and mercy from temptation. 1 Corintians 10:13. There is a difference between mediation and intercession. 1 Timothy 2:1-4 Paul says
"I urge, then, first of all, that petitions, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for all people— 2 for kings and all those in authority, that we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness. 3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior, 4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth. "
 
👍

I can’t convince you and you can’t convince me of the wisdom or lack their of in directing prayers to saints.

Since prayers to saints are not mandatory within the RCC I feel I am in good standing on the other 99% of core beliefs.

Good debate, lets hope Obama and Romney are as civil tonight.

👍
Ok. I will just say that I was a person that came out of 15 years of anti catholic Fundamentalism and this idea of praying to saints (which is really the wrong terminology because you are not asking the saint for a miracle or help, just to pray for you as we do on earth) was like a cross to a vampire.

Often I read the bible in a literal way with ALL things and could not see deeper meanings. There is much language to overcome and the way we speak today has to figure in.

As a matter of fact, Catholics do not teach that Christians should pray to saints. What they do teach is that we should ask for saints’ intercession.

In the case of Catholic prayer “to saints,” Catholics ask saints or a particular saint to pray on their behalf. They might say “Please pray for my roommate whose lung has collapsed. I know that you are in heaven with Jesus, and so I ask that you pray to him for me.” The common response to this is, why not pray to Jesus Himself? Why not go directly to the source? Why are intermediaries needed, when the Bible says there is no mediator between God and man?

To answer these questions, let’s consider the process of intercession. In most evangelical churches, there are prayer chains, prayer partners, and intercessory prayer teams. These people are responsible for listening to the prayer needs and concerns of the congregation, telling these concerns to others if necessary, and praying for these concerns. To give an example of this in action, when my roommate’s lung collapsed, I asked my mom to pray for her. My mom, in turn, asked her Bible study to pray. This is an example of intercession. When I asked my mom to pray, I was not praying to her; rather, I was asking her to pray on my behalf. Why not go straight to God? Because I wanted more people praying for my roommate. Because I wanted the support of my faith community, the Church. Because I coveted the prayers of godly people. I was not asking for a mediator between myself and God; rather, I wanted someone to walk alongside me in prayer. The only difference between this familiar process and Catholics who pray to saints is that those saints are dead.

The next problem is precisely that: if the saints are dead, how can they hear us?

First, consider the resurrection. Those saints are not dead, but risen. We believe that Christ rose from the grave, killing death for all the saints. The promise of resurrection is the promise of life.

However, one may believe in the resurrection and believe that those in heaven must be happy, otherwise what use is heaven? Hearing our prayer requests would burden them, making Heaven an unhappy place. Doesn’t this contradict the teaching that the saints are glorified?

Not quite. In the book of Revelation, the saints express many emotions, but impatience features more prominently than happiness. In Revelations 6:10, the martyrs cried “Oh sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before you will judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?” In other places the prayers of the saints are thrown to the earth by angels in a golden censor. Moreover, in the parable of Lazarus and the rich man, Lazarus looks into hell and sees the rich man suffering and hears his petitions to save his family from hell (Luke 16:19-31). While this parable is likely meant to be taken symbolically, there is no assumption that those in heaven are completely oblivious of earth or hell.

You don’t have to respond as we left off nicely. I just had to convey these last thoughts to you. Your, your not mandated to ask for intercession as far as I know but there is a bigger picture and the church is wise to see it. Peace.
 
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