How to respond to false prophet accusations about the Pope

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For some strange reason, my original thread with the above question had its actual title totally changed to something about an article regarding former Judge Napolitano calling Pope Francis the antichrist, and the entire thread was moved over to another forum… so I’m putting this one here again. Thank you so much to all of the original responders in my other thread who provided very good advice yesterday. I truly appreciate it. The person whom I’m trying to obtain advice about to respond to is now saying that Francis is not only a false prophet but THE false prophet referred to in Revelation, and they seem to be going a bit off the deep end in their outright fear and despise of him. They’re also saying that many Catholics seem to be worshiping the Pope rather than God. It’s a pretty intelligent and well-educated person whom I care about saying these things, so I’m trying to stay as calm as I can and answer them in a way that won’t totally drive them away, but that’s getting harder and harder for me! They were actually baptized Catholic when they were very young but apparently never really raised under Church teachings or brought to Mass much, if at all. If anyone has any further suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated!
 
For some strange reason, my original thread with the above question had its actual title totally changed to something about an article regarding former Judge Napolitano calling Pope Francis the antichrist, and the entire thread was moved over to another forum… so I’m putting this one here again. Thank you so much to all of the original responders in my other thread who provided very good advice yesterday. I truly appreciate it. The person whom I’m trying to obtain advice about to respond to is now saying that Francis is not only a false prophet but THE false prophet referred to in Revelation, and they seem to be going a bit off the deep end in their outright fear and despise of him. They’re also saying that many Catholics seem to be worshiping the Pope rather than God. It’s a pretty intelligent and well-educated person whom I care about saying these things, so I’m trying to stay as calm as I can and answer them in a way that won’t totally drive them away, but that’s getting harder and harder for me! They were actually baptized Catholic when they were very young but apparently never really raised under Church teachings or brought to Mass much, if at all. If anyone has any further suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated!
What are the specific accusations? From this post, the only two I can see are that the pope is the false prophet and that some people seem to worship him.

Re: him being the false prophet, there are several things the Bible describes about the false prophet that seem incompatible with Pope Francis.

2 Thess. 2:3-4 says, “Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.”

In the first place, the pope has not proclaimed himself to be god. Far from it. He has repeatedly described himself as a sinner in need of prayer:

“Your Holiness, I want to ask why you ask so insistently that people pray for you?” “I have always asked this. … [If] the Lord does not help in this work of assisting the People of God to go forward, it can’t be done. I am truly conscious of my many limitations, with so many problems, and I a sinner – as you know! – and I have to ask for this.” source

“When I speak of the Church I like to speak of the faithful, the baptized, the whole church, no? In that case, it’s better to speak of sinners. We are all sinners, no?” source

Second, where is the rebellion that’s supposed to occur before he is revealed? The Great Apostasy should be more apparent. Yes, the world is growing more secular, but it was also very secular during the French Revolution. Secularism looked more like the Great Apostasy in the 1700s than it does in modern times. In that time, an actress portraying the goddess reason was enthroned on the great altar of Notre Dame Cathedral while the Catholics were being persecuted. If I had been alive, I might have thought the Great Apostasy was upon us. But it wasn’t. Now the pope comes to America and some people cry and wave their arms at him, and your friend thinks that’s proof he is the false prophet? Give me a break!

Third, when has the pope exalted himself against every object of worship (2 Thess. 2:4)? He seems to speak very gently and humbly about other religions, so much so that he is sometimes criticized as if he was indifferent as to what religion you are. (He isn’t indifferent about that, he has said very clearly that there is no salvation outside the Church, with all due qualifications where they are supposed to be.) But he certainly hasn’t done any self-exaltation to try to get other religions to worship himself instead. He’s just very different from the false-prophet.

2 Thess. 2:9 gives us another clue about the false prophet: “The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders.”

I don’t think very many people are impressed with any miracles Pope Francis has done. The closest thing, perhaps, was back when he leaned in close to St. Januarius’ blood, and it flowed. To me, that doesn’t qualify as “all power…with pretended signs and wonders.” So he isn’t the false prophet.

Re: the suspicion that people worship him, what is his evidence? Is it that people get very emotional about him? Sorry, but emotion is not worship unless you offer it as an act of worship. Worship is something you do with your will, it doesn’t happen by accident when you’re very emotional about a celebrated person visiting your town. I’ve gotten much more emotional about seeing my dog after a long absence than the people in Philadelphia are getting about the pope. But in both cases there is no worship because there is no intention of worship.
 
When people start making accusations like that they’re more concerned with being right than conforming to logic. At that point trying to argue with them is just an exercise in hearing oneself talk.

Though… you’re not going to convince them right then and there, but planting seeds is always good. So I might be a little wrong.
 
I believe claims of the Pope being the/The anti-christ and a false prophet were made against just about all the Popes. Pope Francis is just another target by misguided people who believe in a special brand of apocrypha. He bears the insults and accusations with the grace of Christ as Christ bore His cross on the way to Calvary. Pray for the Pope and all the clergy and religious. :gopray:

Back to your point: either he is or he isn’t. If he is the anti-christ, the end is coming soon so we all best get our souls in order; criticizing other Christians is hardly going to help anyone’s soul. If he isn’t, the world isn’t going to end and those who criticize and slander him will have a lot of egg on their face (again) as well as sins to atone for. Either way, it’s hardly Christian to cast spurious comments in the name of God.

God Bless you! 👍
 
The type of person describes is not going to be convinced with words.

Forget about the Pope. I wouldn’t even discuss the Pope, not for one second.

Be the best Christian you can be - love your neighbor more than yourself, make peace a priority in your life and spread peace wherever you go, feed the hungry and clothe the naked, stand up for injustice and treat everyone, especially those lower than you with dignity and respect.

They will notice, and ask you how you do it, and then it is time to talk about the sacraments.

-Tim-
 
What are the specific accusations? From this post, the only two I can see are that the pope is the false prophet and that some people seem to worship him.

Re: him being the false prophet, there are several things the Bible describes about the false prophet that seem incompatible with Pope Francis.

2 Thess. 2:3-4 says, “Let no one deceive you in any way; for that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God.”

In the first place, the pope has not proclaimed himself to be god. Far from it. He has repeatedly described himself as a sinner in need of prayer:

“Your Holiness, I want to ask why you ask so insistently that people pray for you?” “I have always asked this. … [If] the Lord does not help in this work of assisting the People of God to go forward, it can’t be done. I am truly conscious of my many limitations, with so many problems, and I a sinner – as you know! – and I have to ask for this.” source

“When I speak of the Church I like to speak of the faithful, the baptized, the whole church, no? In that case, it’s better to speak of sinners. We are all sinners, no?” source

Second, where is the rebellion that’s supposed to occur before he is revealed? The Great Apostasy should be more apparent. Yes, the world is growing more secular, but it was also very secular during the French Revolution. Secularism looked more like the Great Apostasy in the 1700s than it does in modern times. In that time, an actress portraying the goddess reason was enthroned on the great altar of Notre Dame Cathedral while the Catholics were being persecuted. If I had been alive, I might have thought the Great Apostasy was upon us. But it wasn’t. Now the pope comes to America and some people cry and wave their arms at him, and your friend thinks that’s proof he is the false prophet? Give me a break!

Third, when has the pope exalted himself against every object of worship (2 Thess. 2:4)? He seems to speak very gently and humbly about other religions, so much so that he is sometimes criticized as if he was indifferent as to what religion you are. (He isn’t indifferent about that, he has said very clearly that there is no salvation outside the Church, with all due qualifications where they are supposed to be.) But he certainly hasn’t done any self-exaltation to try to get other religions to worship himself instead. He’s just very different from the false-prophet.

2 Thess. 2:9 gives us another clue about the false prophet: “The coming of the lawless one by the activity of Satan will be with all power and with pretended signs and wonders.”

I don’t think very many people are impressed with any miracles Pope Francis has done. The closest thing, perhaps, was back when he leaned in close to St. Januarius’ blood, and it flowed. To me, that doesn’t qualify as “all power…with pretended signs and wonders.” So he isn’t the false prophet.

Re: the suspicion that people worship him, what is his evidence? Is it that people get very emotional about him? Sorry, but emotion is not worship unless you offer it as an act of worship. Worship is something you do with your will, it doesn’t happen by accident when you’re very emotional about a celebrated person visiting your town. I’ve gotten much more emotional about seeing my dog after a long absence than the people in Philadelphia are getting about the pope. But in both cases there is no worship because there is no intentiof worship.
Well said.

Mary.
 
The type of person describes is not going to be convinced with words.

Forget about the Pope. I wouldn’t even discuss the Pope, not for one second.

Be the best Christian you can be - love your neighbor more than yourself, make peace a priority in your life and spread peace wherever you go, feed the hungry and clothe the naked, stand up for injustice and treat everyone, especially those lower than you with dignity and respect.

They will notice, and ask you how you do it, and then it is time to talk about the sacraments.

-Tim-
But if you cannot love the Pope, how can you claim to love your neighbor? 🤷
 
Thanks so much to all of you for your insights and recommendations. They are very much appreciated! I never in a million years thought I would have to defend the Catholic Church to this person that I care about. They’re very set in their beliefs, so it’s not easy for me to balance my responses with kindness, but I will do the best I can and pray for Our Lord to handle the rest! God’s blessings to all of you for your assistance.
 
It’s really the pot calling the kettle black.we don’t go for announcing prophecies all the time like the jokers at T B N. make one every week it seems and when they don’t come to fruition they don’t denounce these characters as false prophets. Apparently it’s only when you step on some political agenda that people denounce. People dying in the streets in the Mid East and promising to do something about iit, those folks are never denounced.
If you want to know more about false prophets look up Joseph Smith’s
Predictions. More false prophecies than you can shake a stick at but he got away with it then and still does.
The other thing that makes these people crazy is that people actually come out to see the pope. that’s gotta kill them and make them jealous as all get out. If they weren’t jealous why wouldn’t they denigrate Francis in such huge amounts all the time?
They know if they put H a l Lindsey in a motorcade either no one would show up or a great salad could be made from what they salute him with.
 
Thanks so much to all of you for your insights and recommendations. They are very much appreciated! I never in a million years thought I would have to defend the Catholic Church to this person that I care about. They’re very set in their beliefs, so it’s not easy for me to balance my responses with kindness, but I will do the best I can and pray for Our Lord to handle the rest! God’s blessings to all of you for your assistance.
The Lord will be with you always! 👍
 
For some strange reason, my original thread with the above question had its actual title totally changed to something about an article regarding former Judge Napolitano calling Pope Francis the antichrist, and the entire thread was moved over to another forum… so I’m putting this one here again. Thank you so much to all of the original responders in my other thread who provided very good advice yesterday. I truly appreciate it. The person whom I’m trying to obtain advice about to respond to is now saying that Francis is not only a false prophet but THE false prophet referred to in Revelation, and they seem to be going a bit off the deep end in their outright fear and despise of him. They’re also saying that many Catholics seem to be worshiping the Pope rather than God. It’s a pretty intelligent and well-educated person whom I care about saying these things, so I’m trying to stay as calm as I can and answer them in a way that won’t totally drive them away, but that’s getting harder and harder for me! They were actually baptized Catholic when they were very young but apparently never really raised under Church teachings or brought to Mass much, if at all. If anyone has any further suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated!
You can not argue with them. They are set in their minds and will not budge. What you can do is let them know through your words and actions how much you love Jesus. If they press you on this say to them, “I would appreciate it if you would not insult a person of whom I have a great deal of respect.” Then drop it. If they want to fight tell them to take this fight somewhere else. You are not going to engage in it.

If someone is sincerely interested in what you believe and why, try to explain but don’t get into an argument. This accomplishes nothing except hard feelings.
 
It’s really the pot calling the kettle black.we don’t go for announcing prophecies all the time like the jokers at T B N. make one every week it seems and when they don’t come to fruition they don’t denounce these characters as false prophets. .
I agree with you, but I would not exactly call them false prophets, the bible tells us false prophets will be able to do great signs and wonders, so people think they are truly something to get excited about, Ive never seen a SINGLE person like this yet, I think if there had been, proof of their supernatural abilities would be all over the internet.

Think about how many people would be fooled if they saw a man doing something like calling down fire from heaven, or moving large objects with their mind, flying, etc etc. in front of large crowds, I have a feeling A LOT of people, probably even some Christians would take what they say VERY seriously!

Instead they are more like con men, all they can do is talk, nothing more, they dont even meet the criteria to be called a false prophet, I doubt they realize this though.
 
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