How to talk to an anti-Catholic

[Kirk_O]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

 

[TimothyH]

My suggestion is to be Christ, to live an authentical Christian life of prayer, service, pennance and peace.

When you love others, forgive those who insult you, help people whom will never give you anything in return, deny yourself, work hard, frequent the sacraments and are at great peace, people will notice. When the world is in a rage and everyone is freaking out, and you go about your day calmly, not distracted by the crisis of the day but stay focused on what is in front of you, people will want to be like you and ask you how to do it. That is the time to start talking.

I have come to the conclusion that 99.999% of the time, talking about doctrine and dogma are a waste of time and breath. People don’t want to know about doctrine and dogma. They want to know why their life stinks, why their husband had to leave, why the dog had to die, why their son is on drugs and why they never seem to find this joy and peace that Christians are always talking about. People aren’t interested in doctrine. People want healing, forgiveness and peace in their lives.

If you can demonstrate a life of joy and peace, then people will be attracted to you like moths to a flame. The worst thing we can do to anti-Catholics is preach the gospel and not live it. We have to be able to demonstrate Christian lives, and authentic Christian living starts with prayer, not with doctrine.

-Tim-

 

[JM3]

My suggestion is to be Christ, to live an authentical Christian life of prayer, service, pennance and peace.

When you love others, forgive those who insult you, help people whom will never give you anything in return, deny yourself, work hard, frequent the sacraments and are at great peace, people will notice. When the world is in a rage and everyone is freaking out, and you go about your day calmly, not distracted by the crisis of the day but stay focused on what is in front of you, people will want to be like you and ask you how to do it. That is the time to start talking.

I have come to the conclusion that 99.999% of the time, talking about doctrine and dogma are a waste of time and breath. People don’t want to know about doctrine and dogma. They want to know why their life stinks, why their husband had to leave, why the dog had to die, why their son is on drugs and why they never seem to find this joy and peace that Christians are always talking about. People aren’t interested in doctrine. People want healing, forgiveness and peace in their lives.

If you can demonstrate a life of joy and peace, then people will be attracted to you like moths to a flame. The worst thing we can do to anti-Catholics is preach the gospel and not live it. We have to be able to demonstrate Christian lives, and authentic Christian living starts with prayer, not with doctrine.

-Tim-

Well said, Tim.

 

[Steveabrous]

I understand your situation too well. My mother In law was the same way. She would bring me these objections. I would say " i’ ll look into that" when I would give her the answer to her objection it became clear to me that she wanted to hold on to her prejudice and wasn’t interested in the truth. Just wanted to spew venom against the Catholic church. I brought this to her attention and told her to keep her comments to herself around me. I would say if this person is not interested in the truth then shake the dust off your feet and leave them to the lord.

 

[JRKH]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

I too agree with Tim’s post.

The problem with these people is that their minds are already made up so arguing with them is pointless.
In your post you did not say whether this is a private conversation or if this stuff happens around other people. If he only does it in private, then your best course is to simply ignore it since you know he is only bating you.
If it occurs where others are around, about the best you can do is to interject that what he is saying is incorrect - but then refuse to go into specifics.
If this fellow follows the normal pattern of his ilk, he makes these charges and even if you try to make counterpoints he talks over you, getting louder in an effort to “shut you down”. A very common ploy.
In company - by declaring that he is wrong but then refusing to debate on his terms, you are letting others know that there is another side to this and if they want to hear it you will be happy to discuss it with them.

His own foul behavior contrasted to your own loving calm will be your greatest asset.

Peace
James

 

[Contra_Mundum_1]

Great advice so far.

In my experience, people who stubbornly hold on to their prejudice, spew venom on the church, and refuse to engage in a real discussion do that because of an emotional reason. If you find what that is you could perhaps find a way to talk to that person.

 

[catholictiger]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

its pretty simple you get to know the guy and you have a relationship with you. I actually attended a retreat where this guy who is a councilor talked about how he deals people who are resistant to what he does.

He explains that there are 4 types of resistence

intellectual resistance
physical resistance
spiritual resistance
emotional resistance.

Intellectual resistance is simple you have someone who has been taught certain things and beliefs certain things and he disagrees with you because they don’t fit into his philosophical ideologies or what ever.
Physical resistance is simply someone is resting you physically, but when it comes issues you explain that probably doesn’t apply
I’m not to sure about spiritual resistance but it is probably something to do with anger against God or something along the lines of prayer. Probably not something you need to worry about in most people.

emotional resistance is the BIG one and I have heard most people when it comes to the Church people deal with emotional resistance. Many times in people’s lives they have an experience that turns them off from the Catholic Faith, it could be something to do with the sex abuse scandal, it could be that a priest was very uncharitable in a sitation, like he wasn’t willing to help someone for this reason. Some examples I can think of is someone would say to a kid who thought he has a call tot he priesthood but is very very overwieght that you are to fat you wouldn’t be accepted, or a women has a baby out of wedlock and she was in charge of some ministry or did something in the church and the priest very rudely told her to stop being involved in the Church because he thought it would bring scandal. These are only a couple of examples that are probably wide spread in the Church. The simple fact is that when we deal with people who are anti-catholic many times their hate of the Catholic church could stem from something that is emotional. Just like someone who be pro-choice emotionally because their sister got brutally raped and she had an abortion. We must realize that in this situation no argument will ever ever change their mind.

But in general we must realize that there are more then just intellectual reasons people are anti-Catholicm, I think the first and main goal of any evangelization strategy must include a getting to know the person. God doesn’t just hit with a lightning bolt to tell us something he knows our hearts our desires in life and our situation in life. He speaks to us where we are, we must learn that we must know a person before we can ever hope to convert them. I say this if you go into a relationship with someone who may be anti-catholic and you have the mind-set that I’m going to show him/her how wrong she is you have lost the fight already. But if you try to get to know everyone like they are your closet friend and then work to bring them to the faith it is amazing how much more effective it is.

The last thing you should ever do with someone who has a emotional resistance to the Catholic Church is give them more for them to be emotional about. Also be prepared to give an explanation of your joy when asked about it.

 

[Black_Knight]

He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

Personally I like that option. http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h244/corona_stellarum/Smilies/Oldmanwithcane.gif

Still, my best tactic is to make 'em prove what they allege, pointing out that just because someone says it doesn’t make it so.

Facts always trump the propaganda and polemics, so it’s actually pretty easy to make them look like a bigoted ignoramus by laying out the facts.

That “killed millions” junk is usually targeted at the inquisition…the really bad news for them is that 1. they can’t cite a source for their numbers (and even then their “sources” never cite sources!) and 2. their alleged millions would have depopulated Europe because those numbers didn’t exist at that time.

Then too, they like to pretend there’s no blood on their historic hands, which they do my disavowing the guys responsible. Basically they try to come off as if there are no sinners amongst them…which we all know is ludicrous for any believer to assert.

Unless you’re just stuck with the guy for some reason, you may decide he’s a waste of your time. Unless he comes at you in public, you can just blow him off. If it’s public …I just cut him off at the knees with the same kind of rapid fire response that he scatter guns you with.

Keep it short and concise. John Martignoni has some awesome examples in his 2-Minute Apologetics that will give you fast paced ammo for response.

Also when you get away from them pray the Divine Mercy Chaplet for 'em.

 

[adf417]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

Sit him down with a Jehovah’s Witness and ask both of them if they both believe Catholics worship Mary, which they will probably agree on this issue. Then ask the JW to justify this belief. When the JW is finished ask the JW - then what you are saying is that I also worship the flag when we salute it or the cross hanging on my wall correct? When the JW agrees, you can leave the conversation in prayer and allow the other two to hash out the details. I promise your point will eventually be made.

Peace!!!

 

[MidnightSun12]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

I would try to prepare some quick one-liners to defend the Church. Even if the person is hostile to the One True Faith, they still deserve to hear a defense for the Church’s teachings. Who knows, maybe your defenses might stay in the back of this person’s mind and maybe they’ll think back to these conversations while they are on their death-bed and finally see the Truth.

For example,

If you are told that the Church’s teachings are repressive and hateful for opposing “gay rights”, simply say:

It’s hateful to want people with same-sex attraction to go to heaven?

If you are asked what gives you the right to “to tell a woman what she can do with her body”, simply say:

Because I was a child in the womb, just like you were.

If you are told that Catholics “worship” our Holy Mother or the Saints simply ask:

Is it wrong to ask the people we love to pray for us?

Don’t be condescending, but phrase your responses as legitimate questions. There’s no need to go in for a crushing blow and try to “win” the argument… Just try to plant a seed, no matter how small it may be.

 

[Steveabrous]

Great advice so far.

In my experience, people who stubbornly hold on to their prejudice, spew venom on the church, and refuse to engage in a real discussion do that because of an emotional reason. If you find what that is you could perhaps find a way to talk to that person.

I agree. In my mother in laws case she was afraid her daughter would leave thier family church and become catholic. Until I told her I wouldn’t listen to her unless she was willing to hear the truth about Catholicism her attacks were relentless. That was several years ago. Today she is much better. She even takes my kids to PSR on Wednesday nights. I do believe we have to point out to these people when they are being prejudicial

 

[Grace2013]

What can one do when the person believes all the lies from the web, media or even worse from the pulpit? He brings up all of the classic points like; the Church has killed millions, the Church has to much money, She kept people from reading the Bible and not to mention the whole thing about worshipping the saints and Mary. He wont except my counterpoints because they come from Catholic sources. anyone have a solution to this besides hitting him over the head with an iron?

I know it is hard, but try to keep responses emotionally neutral - most likely with such mainstream “anti-Catholic” responses like that, they are grasping to not believe something or other about the Faith.

There would be no Bible in the first place had it not been for the Catholic Church. Many Baptists (just for example though I sure there may be others) think that the “original” Bible is the modern day 1900’s KJV version with 66 books and have never even heard that there was a 1611 one with the correct 73. This alone is verifiable by many sources. Interesting that some areas (esp. the South) overlook that. Don’t bring other sources into it yet (may be too soon to go hey- Here’s a copy of ‘Rome Sweet Home’ ), try to stick with Bible first even if they are “KJV only”. There is also a KJV “Apocrypha” if you are able to get them receptive/curious enough to know about the “other” books of the Bible but they still will not read/use your Catholic Bible.

Mary and Saints are hard for many to grasp, try to address that one later if possible. If they are a believer in the righteous going straight to heaven as soon as they phsyically die and are “forever saved” (in their terms) then it may be fairly easy for them to see how the righteous are never dead (Saints). The Bible **encourages us to *pray for one another * **(James 5:16) as Christians and **the prayers of the Saints go directly to God (Revelations 8:4). **You can bring in Purgatory later (1 Cor 3:13).

Starting with John 6:41-59 and the **Real Presence **is a great one because it forces “Bible-only” to explain where and why do they think it means Jesus was speaking “figuratively”. Whenever Jesus presented a parable, He always explained it. In this case, He did not add anything to it as it is meant to taken literally.

Many stopped following Him right away because of that, and if it were only “symbolic” the Jews wouldn’t have had a cause to try and argue about it. Many of the early Christians were persecuted and accused of being “cannibals.” If you can get them to bear witness to that, then there will be some common ground.

Hope that helps some. If the iron doesn’t work, then try a 2 X 4 (kidding).

 

[Kirk_O]

Thanks for all of the great advice. He is a prayer brother (my old Protestant friends) He is new to the group so he wasn’t around when I converted back to Catholicism. But he is kind about it all but he is set on what he has learned and believes is true. It might be his personality, he seems to be a sort of a conspiracy theorist. So it might be a hopeless cause and I should just stop debating him and just show him how we a different then he thinks. Of course that takes more time and me being impatient doesn’t help.

 

[JRKH]

Thanks for all of the great advice. He is a prayer brother (my old Protestant friends) He is new to the group so he wasn’t around when I converted back to Catholicism. But he is kind about it all but he is set on what he has learned and believes is true. It might be his personality, he seems to be a sort of a conspiracy theorist. So it might be a hopeless cause and I should just stop debating him and just show him how we a different then he thinks. Of course that takes more time and me being impatient doesn’t help.

Yep - I’m afraid you are just going to have to live the gospel and let the Holy Spirit do the rest.

Peace
James