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Sunbreak
Guest
Almost everything in that article applies to men too and how men blow their marriages.
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Miss_Felicity
Guest
I think this article and the one it responds to are both good reads for men and women. It takes two to save or squander a marriage.
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ClearWater
Guest
Touché. It does have a number of valid points. It is a good guide to be aware of. I’ll admit.
I have heard it said that typically women go into marriage thinking he will change, that men going into marriage thinking she’ll always stay the same!
I have heard it said that typically women go into marriage thinking he will change, that men going into marriage thinking she’ll always stay the same!
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adrift
Guest
Why get advice from someone who has failed marriages look to those who have stayed married. I wonder if their advice would be similar?
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Cojuanco
Guest
Basically, “don’t do what I did”?
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ClearWater
Guest
Basically, “don’t do what I did”?
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ClearWater
Guest
As long as the advice is sound, why care who it came from?
If your house is on fire, does it matter who provides the water?
If your house is on fire, does it matter who provides the water?
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DaveBj
Guest
With regard to women’s expectations, I’ve heard it explained like this: Women are very concerned about the marriage itself, and their concerns boil down to three things – the “aisle” (Will all the flowers be right? Will I look all right when everyone turns around to look at me? Will I stumble and fall or do something else to embarrass myself?), the “altar” (Will he actually be there? Will we get all our lines right? Can I avoid breaking into tears, or starting to giggle? Can he and the other guys avoid fainting?), and the “hymn” (Can we get through all the music without any embarrassing sour notes?)
Then comes the day, and she turns the corner into the center aisle back of the church and sees that guy standing in his tux at the front, and all of a sudden the spellings change: “I’ll . . . ALTER . . . him!”
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polki
Guest
A nurse once told me a story of how a mother of one of her patients (who was a child) verbally attacked her one time saying “what qualifies you to work with children when you don’t have any of your own?” She replied “well I never had a stroke either but I helped your father recover from his.”
In other words, just because someone hasn’t been in a successful marriage doesn’t mean they can’t offer sound advice so that others can learn from their experience.
For people who have had successful marriages, they should thank God every day. For people who are divorced, it is not always because of something “they did”.
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LongingSoul
Guest
In a way, I thought that too. The advice seems detached and most of it generic to all relationships between people.
Marriages have that added element that you aren’t free to just walk away from it without it having been deemed intrinsically invalid, so at the end of the day, the most important things in keeping marriage going concern identifying as ‘married’ rather than the generic aspects of two individuals making a relationship work. (Which are still important).
That aspect may be more difficult to truly convey when someone is experiencing detachment from marriage because of divorce.
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Cat
Guest
Wife married happily for 34 years.
Yes, I think this advice is good and I would probably give a lot of the same advice, although I would probably have more “do’s” rather than “don’ts” on my list.
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holyrood
Guest
I disagree. It takes two to make a good marriage, but only one to destroy it. I saw it over and over and over on the infidelity forum: one partner doing everything in their power to forgive, heal, move on, start fresh, be a better spouse, while the other just continued with hurtful, hateful, destructive behaviors to the point it was simply impossible to have anything like a real marriage with that person.
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EasterJoy
Guest
It is not an exhaustive list of mistakes, and it does concentrate on the mistakes women tend to make. It is a bit more a list of symptoms, though, rather than a list of fundamental problems. The “how we did it” lists tend to be a bit better at describing the foundations of a good marriage and important “maintenance routines.”
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chevalier
Guest
On the other hand, one shouldn’t assume a man won’t know when a woman lies. The stereotype according to which men lack the requisite ‘emotional intelligence’ here and women have the advantage is a myth.
There’s a widespread belief or attitude according to which courtesy only works one way, i.e. man to woman. I see a lot of rude behaviour and bad manners from women these days, perhaps more than from men.
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JLCecilia
Guest
OH MY, THIS HIT HOME FOR ME! Seeing as an adult the way my mom treats my dad as there to serve her emotional whims just makes me cringe b/c I know that’s how I’m treating my DH. The last time I visited my folks, we were all in the car waiting on mom as usual and she got upset w/ my dad for forgetting HER gloves on the table. I know I’m commanded to respect my parents, but I asked my mom why it’s HIS responsibility to get HER gloves!
Thankfully, though at times I hate it, DH is like his dad. His dad is like my mom, there to be served. Of course, both of us are the babies of our families, so we both expect to be served, which really doesn’t work for either of us
The reason it’s good that he’s this way as that he doesn’t give into my every whim, I’m forced to grow up (a little). Not saying my dad doesn’t have a backbone, but he can’t say no to mom w/out her pulling the emotional manipulation. At this point, I pray for him to be blessed for serving my mom for 48 years and for having to live in an unequally yoked marriage. Sometimes I’m jealous of my mom for having someone to serve her and give her everything she wants; then I realize what a monster she is and how can she ever feel love for someone she doesn’t show love to and who despises her?
Sometimes I see my MIL’s service to her DH as a weakness b/c she’s a people pleaser and needs to make up for her insecurities and b/c her DH isn’t very affectionate, even neglectful (DH and his brothers would agree w/ me here). But then I compare her to my mom and how much MIL has gone without and that she’s still joyful and considerate and I realize I have a lot of growing to do.
Thanks for posting this!
Thankfully, though at times I hate it, DH is like his dad. His dad is like my mom, there to be served. Of course, both of us are the babies of our families, so we both expect to be served, which really doesn’t work for either of us
The reason it’s good that he’s this way as that he doesn’t give into my every whim, I’m forced to grow up (a little). Not saying my dad doesn’t have a backbone, but he can’t say no to mom w/out her pulling the emotional manipulation. At this point, I pray for him to be blessed for serving my mom for 48 years and for having to live in an unequally yoked marriage. Sometimes I’m jealous of my mom for having someone to serve her and give her everything she wants; then I realize what a monster she is and how can she ever feel love for someone she doesn’t show love to and who despises her?Sometimes I see my MIL’s service to her DH as a weakness b/c she’s a people pleaser and needs to make up for her insecurities and b/c her DH isn’t very affectionate, even neglectful (DH and his brothers would agree w/ me here). But then I compare her to my mom and how much MIL has gone without and that she’s still joyful and considerate and I realize I have a lot of growing to do.
Thanks for posting this!
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chevalier
Guest
It may be the expectation of squiring that arises when the post-mediaeval tales of chivalric romance (which originally came from a heresy within Islam in Andalusia in about 10th century and from there to Provence, and then the troubadours would spread it around) go to people’s heads.
If you look at Friedrich v. Schiller’s The Glove, you may recognise a couple of things. Similar themes in legends go back to the middle ages because even then, I guess, sober-minded people recognised the excesses of lady worship. I’m one of the last hand-kissers myself, but I always stress that the whole chivalry thing works both ways. Gentility applies to men and women equally, and being a lady involves a ton of obligations, not only entitlement.
In the middle ages, I guess, people would have had vices and virtues and redeeming qualities for their faults, such as perhaps the males could be rather feisty, quarrelsome and inclined to conflict and land grabs, making up for it with valour and sacrifice, while on the other hand, I guess the noblewomen may’ve been rather fickle and spoiled but making up for it when the time came to nurse the wounded or perform works of charity, manage the land in the husband’s absence on a war etc.
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