How would one go about labeling the Catholic Church vs the Traditional sects?

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MillTownCath

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Hey all!

So when I speak to people who are in a Traditional Sect, I want to be as respectful as possible. I don’t want to say “your religion” as if they aren’t Catholic, but I’m uncertain about what I should call it.

I don’t want to call it SSPX because to my knowledge that isn’t really a religion, it is just a movement/sect in the Traditional rite movement.

I don’t think I can call it Tridentine Mass because that doesn’t describe the theological differences, only the Mass.

I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
 
Catholic Church vs the Traditional Sects :confused::confused::confused:

What’s that?

You call people who identify as Catholic, Catholic.
 
MillTownCath said:
Hey all!

So when I speak to people who are in a Traditional Sect, I want to be as respectful as possible. I don’t want to say “your religion” as if they aren’t Catholic, but I’m uncertain about what I should call it.

I don’t want to call it SSPX because to my knowledge that isn’t really a religion, it is just a movement/sect in the Traditional rite movement.

I don’t think I can call it Tridentine Mass because that doesn’t describe the theological differences, only the Mass.

I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
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Do you both believe Church teachings?
 
MillTownCath said:
I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
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The sect starts when someone believes that he/she is right, everyone else is wrong.

According to this definition you put yourself to a sect.

In the reality only God is the TRUTH, only Jesus Christ is the way, the truth and the life; we only grasp crumbs from his fulness. We Catholics humbly accept our imperfections.
 
I need some more help. Can you list three bullet point items for your beliefs and her beliefs that begins to characterize the difference between you? Then I might be able to give some advice on thoughtful wording.
 
MillTownCath said:
Hey all!

So when I speak to people who are in a Traditional Sect, I want to be as respectful as possible. I don’t want to say “your religion” as if they aren’t Catholic, but I’m uncertain about what I should call it.

I don’t want to call it SSPX because to my knowledge that isn’t really a religion, it is just a movement/sect in the Traditional rite movement.

I don’t think I can call it Tridentine Mass because that doesn’t describe the theological differences, only the Mass.

I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
Click to expand...
The SSPX is a society of clergy. I think mindsets are what you are thinking of, or, Catholic world views. Some Catholics are orthodox, some are to the left of orthodox and some are to the right right of orthodox.

Try to determine what you both agree on first and I think you’ll find you agree on much more than you disagree on.
 
I know we’re both Catholic, but we believe very different things. I just want to know how to reference what she believes (Pre VII) in contrast to what I believe.(Novus Ordo)

I mean no disrespect.

Do I just call her a pre Vatican Twoer?
 
MillTownCath said:
I know we’re both Catholic, but we believe very different things. I just want to know how to reference what she believes (Pre VII) in contrast to what I believe.(Novus Ordo)

I mean no disrespect.

Do I just call her a pre Vatican Twoer?
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If your friend believes that the OF (Novus ordo) is invalid, and that the current pope are false/heretics then she would be a sedevacantist. Term applied to those who feel the chair of Peter is empty or occupied by a false pope. This term does not apply to SSPX because they are no longer excommunicated, but they are still not fully in communion with Rome. Most of us who preffer the EF (Tridentine Rite) are not sede’s, nor do we really care to be called “traditionalist” we are just Catholics who follow the Pope and Bishops who are in full communion with Rome. Our beliefs are orthodox because of this.
 
MillTownCath said:
I know we’re both Catholic, but we believe very different things. I just want to know how to reference what she believes (Pre VII) in contrast to what I believe.(Novus Ordo)

I mean no disrespect.

Do I just call her a pre Vatican Twoer?
Click to expand...
Call her what you like, but here is what the pope says…
The Church’s teaching authority cannot be frozen in the year 1962 – this must be quite clear to the Society. But some of those who put themselves forward as great defenders of the Council also need to be reminded that Vatican II embraces the entire doctrinal history of the Church. Anyone who wishes to be obedient to the Council has to accept the faith professed over the centuries, and cannot sever the roots from which the tree draws its life.
blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2009/03/12/official-text-of-popes-letter-to-bishops-on-williamson-affair/
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So, when there appears to be a conflict in some teaching, it’s reasonable to have questions.
 
Is it just a matter of preference for the Traditional Latin Mass? Or are there actual doctrinal differences between you?
 
MillTownCath said:
I know we’re both Catholic, but we believe very different things. I just want to know how to reference what she believes (Pre VII) in contrast to what I believe.(Novus Ordo)

I mean no disrespect.

Do I just call her a pre Vatican Twoer?
Click to expand...
You can ask her how she would like to be identified, or how she describes her faith. The people I know that attend the SSPX chapels ( and I have gone to mass at their chapels) typically use the term traditional Catholic or traditionalist Catholic to describe themselves. And they generally would not think of what is posted in the Traditional Catholicism forum here as encompassing traditional Catholicism. This forum is kind of a mishmash of opinions, questions and practices.
 
MillTown - If the girl of whom you speak goes to Mass at an SSPX chapel, then she is a Catholic. Now if you and she have different ideas about Catholic doctrine, that doesn’t mean that one of you isn’t Catholic. It means you have a disagreement - people of good will disagree sometimes.

If the situation is as I have described it, I think you should go talk to the SSPX priest about any concerns you may have about the SSPX. He won’t tell you that you have to attend his chapel. He’ll try to answer your questions.
 
MillTownCath said:
Hey all!

So when I speak to people who are in a Traditional Sect, I want to be as respectful as possible. I don’t want to say “your religion” as if they aren’t Catholic, but I’m uncertain about what I should call it.

I don’t want to call it SSPX because to my knowledge that isn’t really a religion, it is just a movement/sect in the Traditional rite movement.

I don’t think I can call it Tridentine Mass because that doesn’t describe the theological differences, only the Mass.

I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
Click to expand...
I do not know what Catholic VII is. I believe in the Creed, One Holy Catholic Apostolic Church. SSPX is what it says it is. If that is what they say they are then that is what you call them. I want to be called OHCAC as the creed says. I believe the problem arises when you engage in dispute as to why either of you take the position you take. If your intention is to understand then dialogue. If your intention is other than that then pray.
 
MillTownCath said:
Hey all!

So when I speak to people who are in a Traditional Sect, I want to be as respectful as possible. I don’t want to say “your religion” as if they aren’t Catholic, but I’m uncertain about what I should call it.

I don’t want to call it SSPX because to my knowledge that isn’t really a religion, it is just a movement/sect in the Traditional rite movement.

I don’t think I can call it Tridentine Mass because that doesn’t describe the theological differences, only the Mass.

I just am not positive on how I should reference what she believes.
I’m Catholic, and she’s Catholic, but we don’t believe the same things exactly.

Anyone have any suggestions? Thanks!
Click to expand...
I use the terms “Pre-Vatican II Catholic” and “Post-Vatican II Catholic”. I myself have never been a “post-Vatican II Catholic”, except for a few weeks when I was baptized via a local novus ordo parish in 1978. Apart from that, I have been strictly pre-Vatican II, and don’t mind being labeled that way, though others might have a problem.

The more I learn of what is believed and done in the novus ordo church, the more I sincerely believe they are two separate religious belief systems. If you had experienced the Church in its pre-V2 form as I have, you would agree. The two groups really do seem to speak two different theological languages, if I were to sit down and have a theological discussion with a novus ordo, I doubt either of us would know what the other is talking about. “RCIA”? “Extraordinary Form”? “Eucharistic Ministers”? What??:confused: Its all Greek to me. Just as many of you would not know what I meant if I said “ember days”, “rogation days”, “paten”, “Agnus Dei” , and so forth.
 
Zhenia said:
I use the terms “Pre-Vatican II Catholic” and “Post-Vatican II Catholic”. I myself have never been a “post-Vatican II Catholic”, except for a few weeks when I was baptized via a local novus ordo parish in 1978. Apart from that, I have been strictly pre-Vatican II, and don’t mind being labeled that way, though others might have a problem.

The more I learn of what is believed and done in the novus ordo church, the more I sincerely believe they are two separate religious belief systems. If you had experienced the Church in its pre-V2 form as I have, you would agree. The two groups really do seem to speak two different theological languages, if I were to sit down and have a theological discussion with a novus ordo, I doubt either of us would know what the other is talking about. “RCIA”? “Extraordinary Form”? “Eucharistic Ministers”? What??:confused: Its all Greek to me. Just as many of you would not know what I meant if I said “ember days”, “rogation days”, “paten”, “Agnus Dei” , and so forth.
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I am not sure I understand the notion that there are two different theological languages. I grew up with a Latin mass, Agnus Dei and a paten. If you were to attend an Eastern Rite Church or an Eastern Orthodox Church then the comparison to the Western Rites would be different. The theology is the same in the Western and Eastern Rites and pretty similar in the Orthodox. There are 7 sacraments that bind us. You say potato and I say pohtahtoh has nothing to do with theology.

If these minimal issues create confusion that would worry me. I speak Spanish and would like to speak other languages. I am trying to learn the Hail Mary in Greak, trying to memorize the Our Father in Latin and it takes effort. It would be possible with effort to unconfuse yourself. This is particular confusion by focusing on the particulars. I do not understand this.
 
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