How's the Music?

[roadsend]

In my experience, the music at the vast majority of Catholic Churches is, in a word, “garbage.” I would much prefer no signing at all to what most parishes offer.

What is ironic is that the greatest liturgical music ever written was written for the Catholic Church, and it was jettisoned wholesale years ago for banal, treacly, oft-times heretical, unsingable dreck.

It’s a truism that Catholics don’t sing. We don’t because the music is so terrible, syncopated and silly that no one with any taste whatsoever (and then assuming it’s orthodox) would want to sing it. Even at that, the range and usual lack of music for the congregation guarantees a cringing silence from the pews. (Maybe it’s a secret penitential process?!)

Honestly, the music at most Masses is nothing short of an embarrassment.

I completely concur.
I have nothing but utter disdain for the drivel I hear at Mass every Sunday.
Even with my hearing aids on mute it is a struggle to put up with the tripe that is shoved at us.
In my opinion OCP and the like have done more harm to the church in America during my lifetime than all of the attacks by its declared enemies.

 

[KarenElissa]

If I were in charge of music at my parish, my two biggest rules would be the music is singable and “catholicy.”

I read music well and am good at sight reading and some of the music we sing gives me trouble. If I’m having trouble picking it up than for people who don’t read music it is going to be pretty much impossible. Music with crazy rhythms, constantly changing times and keys, or crazy ranges and jumps are just not good if you are expecting people to sing.

It should also sound Catholic. There are some songs out there that can be interpreted in a catholic or more protestant way, we should just skip those. If it takes much thinking at all to figure out how it works with catholic theology it isn’t a good song to be singing in mass where most people will do little interpreting and just take it at face value.

I don’t mind necessarily mind more modern if it fits the above criteria, is just seems so much of it doesn’t. There are the occasional one that I really like. We sang Emmanuel by Steve Angrisano this week and that works quite well, I’ve also heard Adoration by Matt Maher and that was nice.

 

[steveb1]

One of the more important reasons that I left the Church was the horrendous, deliberate, murder of liturgical music by “modern” committees and their pet composers. The old standard choir in the loft faded into a melancholy, nostalgic memory; Latin music/Latin chanting disappeared; the classical liturgical sense of mystical mystery mostly gone with the traditional music. Replaced by: insipid new pieces that no one could sing and no one would wish to sing; people even by deliberate choice attending folk Mass, yet who apparently had no idea what folk music is, and could not sing it; the introduction of a few Protestant hymns, lugubriously played and sung.

All this musical change for the worse was also occurring with other nascent, grim artistic changes such as abstract, “modern art” illustrations in the misselettes and the intrusion of a kind of “with it” Sixties-type Art of Liberal Concern (I’m not against liberals, but I do acknowledge that their avante-guard influence post-V2 spelled the beginning of the end for liturgical greatness).

No narcissism meant here: the Church “needs” me like a hole in the head, so it’s no loss for the Church that I have moved on to what for me are greener spiritual pastures. But the cavalier way in which the hierarchy and “terrorist” liturgists imposed - and continue to impose - their airy-fairy views of “correct” music on a long-suffering, battered Faithful is one key element of why I, and many others, have left the Church. I would still probably attend Mass and other liturgical functions - for art’s sake, if not the Church’s - had the Church not “modernized” to the extent of killing its own best liturgical traditions.

In its rush to modernize - generally a great idea - the Church tragically threw out the liturgical baby with the bathwater of obsolete customs. When the Church marginalized its Latin roots and its use of older musical forms, it also marginalized its mystery and mysticism. I suppose that goes to show that people lead the Church … that people are fallible … and that they create messes even with the best intentions.

 

[jubileekim]

So I have to ask, what would you who say that the OCP type music is inspired apparently by the dark forces of the enemy say to the daughter of the woman in her 80’s who died last week and requested in a letter to her daughter that her favorite songs be sung at her funeral mass this Friday? This fine Catholic lady, who sang in the choir for 23 years and was a daily mass attendee, asked for You Are Mine, Here I Am Lord, On Eagles Wings, and As The Deer Longs (the one to the tune O Waly Waly). She also requested the musicians for her funeral, myself and two folk-type guitarists. Shall I tell her that it is “banal dreck” and “garbage” and that I will be singing acapella gregorian chant? This is the music that inspired her to come to church praise her Lord.

In the long musical history of the Church, there has always been “new” music that was added to the old.

 

[moreorless]

So I have to ask, what would you who say that the OCP type music is inspired apparently by the dark forces of the enemy say to the daughter of the woman in her 80’s who died last week and requested in a letter to her daughter that her favorite songs be sung at her funeral mass this Friday? This fine Catholic lady, who sang in the choir for 23 years and was a daily mass attendee, asked for You Are Mine, Here I Am Lord, On Eagles Wings, and As The Deer Longs (the one to the tune O Waly Waly). She also requested the musicians for her funeral, myself and two folk-type guitarists. Shall I tell her that it is “banal dreck” and “garbage” and that I will be singing acapella gregorian chant? This is the music that inspired her to come to church praise her Lord.

In the long musical history of the Church, there has always been “new” music that was added to the old.

I have taken the position that funerals are generally not the appropriate time to offer an educational moment, and I will grit my teeth, smile, and do what the family requests.

 

[jubileekim]

My point was that this “drivel” is what helped this dear woman connect to her Christ. I am prepared to use a variety of styles in music to help all parishoners to make this connection; that is what is important to me, not to “educate” people into a place where they cannot freely worship. Christ desires our hearts in worship, not a false facade of “proper” musical style instituted by individual men’s preferences. Ref: Psalm 40, esp. v. 6 I guess you can tell I’m a convert and not a cradle Catholic, eh?

 

[JHow]

So I have to ask, what would you who say that the OCP type music is inspired apparently by the dark forces of the enemy say to the daughter of the woman in her 80’s who died last week and requested in a letter to her daughter that her favorite songs be sung at her funeral mass this Friday? This fine Catholic lady, who sang in the choir for 23 years and was a daily mass attendee, asked for You Are Mine, Here I Am Lord, On Eagles Wings, and As The Deer Longs (the one to the tune O Waly Waly). She also requested the musicians for her funeral, myself and two folk-type guitarists. Shall I tell her that it is “banal dreck” and “garbage” and that I will be singing acapella gregorian chant? This is the music that inspired her to come to church praise her Lord.

In the long musical history of the Church, there has always been “new” music that was added to the old.

Obviously no one is going to advocate insulting the deceased’s taste in music by refusing to sing these songs. I would also add that I don’t think that OCP music is inspired by the “dark forces of the enemy”. I don’t doubt the good intentions of those who write and perform this music, and, judging from your comments, I can only imagine that if a friend requested some other material (hymn in latin, perhaps?) to be sung at their funeral, you would no doubt strive to accomodate that request as well.

 

[Mathias64]

From Vatican II Sacrosanctum Concilium:

**VI SACRED MUSIC **
112. The musical tradition of the universal Church is a treasure of inestimable value, greater even than that of any other art. The main reason for this pre-eminence is that, as sacred song united to the words, it forms a necessary or integral part of the solemn liturgy.
Holy Scripture, indeed, has bestowed praise upon sacred song 42], and the same may be said of the fathers of the Church and of the Roman pontiffs who in recent times, led by St. Pius X, have explained more precisely the ministerial function supplied by sacred music in the service of the Lord.
Therefore sacred music is to be considered the more holy in proportion as it is more closely connected with the liturgical action, whether it adds delight to prayer, fosters unity of minds, or confers greater solemnity upon the sacred rites. But the Church approves of all forms of true art having the needed qualities, and admits them into divine worship.
Accordingly, the sacred Council, keeping to the norms and precepts of ecclesiastical tradition and discipline, and having regard to the purpose of sacred music, which is the glory of God and the sanctification of the faithful, decrees as follows.
113. Liturgical worship is given a more noble form when the divine offices are celebrated solemnly in song, with the assistance of sacred ministers and the active participation of the people.
As regards the language to be used, the provisions of Art. 36 are to be observed; for the Mass, Art. 54; for the sacraments, Art. 63; for the divine office. Art. 101.
114. The treasure of sacred music is to be preserved and fostered with great care. Choirs must be diligently promoted, especially in cathedral churches; but bishops and other pastors of souls must be at pains to ensure that, whenever the sacred action is to be celebrated with song, the whole body of the faithful may be able to contribute that active participation which is rightly theirs, as laid down in Art. 28 and 30.
115. Great importance is to be attached to the teaching and practice of music in seminaries, in the novitiates and houses of study of religious of both sexes, and also in other Catholic institutions and schools. To impart this instruction, teachers are to be carefully trained and put in charge of the teaching of sacred music.
It is desirable also to found higher institutes of sacred music whenever this can be done.
Composers and singers, especially boys, must also be given a genuine liturgical training.
116. The Church acknowledges Gregorian chant as specially suited to the Roman liturgy: therefore, other things being equal, it should be given pride of place in liturgical services.
But other kinds of sacred music, especially polyphony, are by no means excluded from liturgical celebrations, so long as they accord with the spirit of the liturgical action, as laid down in Art. 30.
117. The typical edition of the books of Gregorian chant is to be completed; and a more critical edition is to be prepared of those books already published since the restoration by St. Pius X.
It is desirable also that an edition be prepared containing simpler melodies, for use in small churches.
118. Religious singing by the people is to be intelligently fostered so that in devotions and sacred exercises, as also during liturgical services, the voices of the faithful may ring out according to the norms and requirements of the rubrics.
119. In certain parts of the world, especially mission lands, there are peoples who have their own musical traditions, and these play a great part in their religious and social life. For this reason due importance is to be attached to their music, and a suitable place is to be given to it, not only in forming their attitude toward religion, but also in adapting worship to their native genius, as indicated in Art. 39 and 40.
Therefore, when missionaries are being given training in music, every effort should be made to see that they become competent in promoting the traditional music of these peoples, both in schools and in sacred services, as far as may be practicable.
120. In the Latin Church the pipe organ is to be held in high esteem, for it is the traditional musical instrument which adds a wonderful splendor to the Church’s ceremonies and powerfully lifts up man’s mind to God and to higher things.
But other instruments also may be admitted for use in divine worship, with the knowledge and consent of the competent territorial authority, as laid down in Art. 22, 52, 37, and 40. This may be done, however, only on condition that the instruments are suitable, or can be made suitable, for sacred use, accord with the dignity of the temple, and truly contribute to the edification of the faithful.
121. Composers, filled with the Christian spirit, should feel that their vocation is to cultivate sacred music and increase its store of treasures.
Let them produce compositions which have the qualities proper to genuine sacred music, not confining themselves to works which can be sung only by large choirs, but providing also for the needs of small choirs and for the active participation of the entire assembly of the faithful.
The texts intended to be sung must always be in conformity with Catholic doctrine; indeed they should be drawn chiefly from holy scripture and from liturgical sources.

I yield to the long-lined legalism, but how do we recioncile our cuirrent and previous pope’s blessing of Lifteen and the Charismatic Mass?

 

[johnnykins]

So I have to ask, what would you who say that the OCP type music is inspired apparently by the dark forces of the enemy say to the daughter of the woman in her 80’s who died last week and requested in a letter to her daughter that her favorite songs be sung at her funeral mass this Friday? This fine Catholic lady, who sang in the choir for 23 years and was a daily mass attendee, asked for You Are Mine, Here I Am Lord, On Eagles Wings, and As The Deer Longs (the one to the tune O Waly Waly). She also requested the musicians for her funeral, myself and two folk-type guitarists. Shall I tell her that it is “banal dreck” and “garbage” and that I will be singing acapella gregorian chant? This is the music that inspired her to come to church praise her Lord.

In the long musical history of the Church, there has always been “new” music that was added to the old.

Like any good Catholic I would (secretly) grit my teeth and do what was asked. Of course, if I had been the choir director who proffered that awful simulacrum for music all these past years, I’d have to don sackcloth and do penance for 30 years in atonement for ruining a generation’s appreciation of liturgical music. The dark forces are everywhere - especially in too many Music Directors’ offices.

 

[johnnykins]

I yield to the long-lined legalism, but how do we recioncile our cuirrent and previous pope’s blessing of Lifteen and the Charismatic Mass?

Taste and good sense are not part of the Papal charism. Of course, one does wonder what Furyk really was all about. Or, maybe there is no need to wonder anymore.

I don’t think anyone has said you can’t have the stuff we’re made to endure - just that it’s bad from so many perspectives.

 

[Phemie]

Like any good Catholic I would (secretly) grit my teeth and do what was asked. Of course, if I had been the choir director who proffered that awful simulacrum for music all these past years, I’d have to don sackcloth and do penance for 30 years in atonement for ruining a generation’s appreciation of liturgical music. The dark forces are everywhere - especially in too many Music Directors’ offices.

There are moments to instruct and funeral preparation is usually not one of those. Everyone is too emotional and we can do more harm than good at that time even if our intention is to do what the Church asks.

But why don’t we mention what the Church wants during funerals and weddings in the bulletin? Would it be so difficult to teach about those rites? For example, how many brides know that the Church’s preference is for the bride and groom to come in together in the entrance procession? If we kept talking about it families would come to know and understand the whys of the Rites.

As for what a previous poster asked, when I requested some Latin responses during Dad’s funeral Mass (a man who had been an altar server for 30 years pre Vat. II) the choir director said “Oh, the Church doesn’t do that anymore.” Funny, she’d been more than pleased when I’d commented positively on the Latin Sanctus they’d sung at Christmas, 2 weeks before. She threw me a bone with an Ave Maria solo during the Offertory, which is really not what I had in mind at all.

 

[OraLabora]

I’ve grown to appreciate a chorus of voices with no instrumentation at all. I’ve gone from, “any instrument is okay,” to, “no instruments at all.”

Ditto. I prefer the OF Mass, but also prefer the Propers and Ordinary sung in Latin with Gregorian chant, a cappella, but not against organ pieces before the introit, during the offertory after the hymn, and at the exit procession.

And that indeed is how it is done at our abbey church every Sunday. And during the week, at Mass, it’s all Gregorian chant, a cappella.

 

[stephraim]

Ditto. I prefer the OF Mass, but also prefer the Propers and Ordinary sung in Latin with Gregorian chant, a cappella, but not against organ pieces before the introit, during the offertory after the hymn, and at the exit procession.

That’s my preference (but with the Offertory proper from the Gradual). Sounds perfect. Here we’re slowly working our way away from the “Four-Hymn Sandwich.”

 

[anp1215]

Our parish has 3 Masses that are somewhat “traditional” (still have instruments though) and one that is more “contemporary” (newer songs by evangelical artists, more instruments, etc.)

I personally prefer very traditional hymns and no instruments.
I am supposed to attend the contemporary Mass because I have to go to BOW which is during that Mass, but I like the other ones better.

But in the end, music to me is only secondary, what actually takes place during the Mass is more important.

 

[roadsend]

So I have to ask, what would you who say that the OCP type music is inspired apparently by the dark forces of the enemy say to the daughter of the woman in her 80’s who died last week and requested in a letter to her daughter that her favorite songs be sung at her funeral mass this Friday? This fine Catholic lady, who sang in the choir for 23 years and was a daily mass attendee, asked for You Are Mine, Here I Am Lord, On Eagles Wings, and As The Deer Longs (the one to the tune O Waly Waly). She also requested the musicians for her funeral, myself and two folk-type guitarists. Shall I tell her that it is “banal dreck” and “garbage” and that I will be singing acapella gregorian chant? This is the music that inspired her to come to church praise her Lord.

In the long musical history of the Church, there has always been “new” music that was added to the old.

I would contrast it with the incident quite sometime ago when the mother of a teacher I knew died and her pastor refused her request conveyed by her son for a Latin Requiem Mass, since the Church had “outlawed Latin”.
She was buried to the strains of the modern drivel, with which we have been afflicted.
The teacher, unable to keep his promise to his mother to make sure that she was buried with a traditional funeral, pretty much stopped going to church after this.
This “new music” has not been added to “the old”. It has pretty much replaced it in most parishes where I have gone to Mass.

 

[Mathias64]

I know I have touched a lot aof nerves - and I have also reveled quite a few predjudices. That was my intent, to have us look at ourselves, reread our own posts. So what do ya’ll think Jesus would think about all this? Some us of like finery crave celebration, organization and legalism – but the fact remains that all we can really do that counts is love Him. God does not need us or any of the stuff we do “in his name”. All our preferences, styles, languages, statues & stained glass windows mean NOTHING if we do not LOVE Him. Conversely, if we DO love Him (the only real stipulation for entering his kingdom), then the rest is somewhat insignificant. Is it not? I once attended a mass in the woods where a cross was made from scavenged sticks, the altar was a large rock and the priest’s vestments were a bed sheet adorned with pictures drawn by teenagers with felt-tipped pens. I cannot help but believe that Jesus found that much more pleasing than a grand procession in a grand cathedral. In his life on earth, Jesus spurned finery and wealth and embraced physical poverty for the sake of spiritual wealth. Bottom line is there are no Catholics in heaven. The best we can hope for is a God who understands and KNOWS us. I believe with all my heart in the Holy Catholic Church (i.e. “Universal” church), and I believe that in the end, God will gather the flock, and all will know the whole truth. When that happens, those (and only those) who love him will enter in. What this all means is: whatever we do for love of Him is AOK to HIM. So why can’t we feel that way toward each other? One of my favorite sayings is, “God made rock n’ roll so we would know what the party’s like in heaven”. I sure hope that’s true! That’s a band I want to play in! Perhaps when I hear rock, some of you will hear chant.

 

[Musician]

I also would like to add that I see my work as a church musician to be a ministry. I want to help people worship the Lord. I play the organ at our church and include tons of classical stuff from all musical eras, as well as traditional hymns, chant, and even an occasional contemporary piece that I feel is appropriate.
Not all new stuff is awful, but most of it is.

 

[lookingtotheast]

I know I have touched a lot aof nerves - and I have also reveled quite a few predjudices. That was my intent, to have us look at ourselves, reread our own posts. So what do ya’ll think Jesus would think about all this? Some us of like finery crave celebration, organization and legalism – but the fact remains that all we can really do that counts is love Him. God does not need us or any of the stuff we do “in his name”. All our preferences, styles, languages, statues & stained glass windows mean NOTHING if we do not LOVE Him. Conversely, if we DO love Him (the only real stipulation for entering his kingdom), then the rest is somewhat insignificant. Is it not? I once attended a mass in the woods where a cross was made from scavenged sticks, the altar was a large rock and the priest’s vestments were a bed sheet adorned with pictures drawn by teenagers with felt-tipped pens. I cannot help but believe that Jesus found that much more pleasing than a grand procession in a grand cathedral. In his life on earth, Jesus spurned finery and wealth and embraced physical poverty for the sake of spiritual wealth. Bottom line is there are no Catholics in heaven. The best we can hope for is a God who understands and KNOWS us. I believe with all my heart in the Holy Catholic Church (i.e. “Universal” church), and I believe that in the end, God will gather the flock, and all will know the whole truth. When that happens, those (and only those) who love him will enter in. What this all means is: whatever we do for love of Him is AOK to HIM. So why can’t we feel that way toward each other? One of my favorite sayings is, “God made rock n’ roll so we would know what the party’s like in heaven”. I sure hope that’s true! That’s a band I want to play in! Perhaps when I hear rock, some of you will hear chant.

The bold is mine, WHAT?? Uh yes there are Catholics in fact heaven is nothing but Catholic! What I mean by this is that Catholic is one who has accepted all what God offers to that person either in this life or right before judgment. So there are Catholics in heaven there is a reason why all those who have made it to heave are saints. Very interesting as I read your post it’s very full of emotion, but in it lacks logic. As I’ve told my friends feeling can only take you so far you have to use reason and logic as well.

 

[Acolythus_sum]

Bottom line is there are no Catholics in heaven. .

If that is so, then why is your religion “Catholic”?!? If you believe that there are no Catholics in Heaven, then you should join some other religion which has a chance!

I’m not advocating heresy, of course, but it would be logical, if your statement were true.

 

[Whitacre_Girl]

I prefer GOOD music. I don’t care the genre, only that it is well played, song worshipfully, and invites the congregation to worship with it.

Contemporary, classical, organ, chant…all music can be holy and reverent.