Huge Crisis of Faith

[Praedicare]

Friends,

Amidst all the hopeful attempts at holiness and reunification of the churches, can we admit one thing to each other? The Body of Christ remains divided, shattered, and fractured into many pieces after many long centuries of schism. This is scandalous to many non-Christians. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important.

Today I woke up in a state of horror, asking myself: “What if all this is just bunk? After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans? Does the Trinity even exist? Why is the world so silent and empty of God?” The Bible doesn’t do much for me, and the Church’s claims sometimes seem meaningless.

I wonder if miracles and holy things have stopped appearing in this modern world because science has shown that they were just fairy-tales and fantasies all along. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?

Yet I wonder if all the saints, legends, traditions, and superstitions really were just a made-up “Christian Mythology” to fill in the gaps while we wait for one who isn’t coming back. It’s torture! It’s unbearable doubt! What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?

This doesn’t really fit in “Apologetics” or anything… I’m already a Catholic, but undergoing a spiritual crisis. I hope you can help, or at least pray for those like me.

 

[Anglewannabe]

. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important. .

IMO ecumenism with other denominations will probably never exist. I want to hold on to my Catholic beliefs and don’t want protestants to change them. I suspect they
feel the same way. The best we can hope for is harmony and respect for each other

.
. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?.

There is probably a lot of truth to that

. What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?
.

The sun is not Divine. God is. After saying ‘I want to believe’ follow up with ‘God please show me how to believe’

Of course I have prayed for you

 

[Praedicare]

Thank you Anglewannabe.

The very fact that there are so many Christian beliefs is what bothers me so much. We can claim to have the Full Interpretation Of The Bible, or The Most Ancient Church, or whatever you want - but in the end, as to Truth, it’s just our claim against theirs. How does one even decide anymore, with the gigantic number of churches? I’m not denying absolute truth… I’m simply fearful because it has been greatly obscured.

Your advice about prayer is simple, and therefore good. One thing is always sure: there is one God, who is not distant but near to us.

A Spanish priest friend of mine wrote this to me:

Your questions have a deep background of a need of certainty; and life is much more rich, and dynamic. All the struggles about doctrine and power, all the failures and brokenness, are just the tip of the iceberg in Church history – and drama.

History (including history of the church) is full of weaknesses, paradoxes, falls, ups and downs. As every human heart. We are full of dungeons and crevices, with dragons and terrible angels.

So you NEED to start with regaining a better view of WHO JESUS – the LOGOS, One of the Three – IS, and start with this. Don’t have anything for granted.

You need to read THEOPHILOS, by Michael O’Brien, Then, Drawn into the Mystery of Jesus Through the Gospel of John, and also Into the Heart of God: Jean Vanier Explores the Gospel of John in the Holy Land (audio book, CD), both by Jean Vanier.

And ALL the novels by Louis De Wohl, will do you GOOD including his essay Founded on a Rock: A History of the Catholic Church;
The Spear: A Novel of the Crucifixion, first of all, and then in due order:
The Living Wood: Saint Helena and the Emperor Constantine,
The Restless Flame: A Novel About Saint Augustine,
Citadel of God: A Novel About Saint Benedict,
The Joyful Beggar: St. Francis of Assisi,
The Quiet Light: A Novel About Thomas Aquinas,
Lay Siege to Heaven: A Novel About Saint Catherine of Siena,
The Golden Thread: A Novel About St. Ignatius Loyola,
Set All Afire: A Novel About Saint Francis Xavier…

Only AFTER reading these books, you might put the same questions again to yourself: they are not a problem of good or bad ones, weak popes or choosing between the traditions of East and West.** All these things are leaves, and life is in the roots!**
What matters is knowing Who Jesus is - the Prologue of John - what He did, and does, and How (through weakness) - and that Jesus has sent the Holy Spirit to fulfill His own work, and He is always at work, in the middle of our failures and shortcuts, both in our broken hearts and in the broken history of the world. Recall the Veni Sancte Spiritus and the Veni Creator.

Is a living Body, who is shaping himself, growing and struggling, who was entrusted by the Lord to Peter and the Eleven. And the task and strife goes on…
We are not alone.
Holiness –the concrete life of Saints- is the fruit of the Holy Spirit in the Church, both in the East and in the West. But you need to have Jean Vanier in mind, and Louis De Wohl. Then read again On Fairy-stories, by Tolkien, and ORTHODOXY, by Chesterton, and his Autobiography …Also Cardinal Newman may help …

 

[fred_conty]

Friends,

Amidst all the hopeful attempts at holiness and reunification of the churches, can we admit one thing to each other? The Body of Christ remains divided, shattered, and fractured into many pieces after many long centuries of schism. This is scandalous to many non-Christians. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important.

Today I woke up in a state of horror, asking myself: “What if all this is just bunk? After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans? Does the Trinity even exist? Why is the world so silent and empty of God?” The Bible doesn’t do much for me, and the Church’s claims sometimes seem meaningless.

I wonder if miracles and holy things have stopped appearing in this modern world because science has shown that they were just fairy-tales and fantasies all along. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?

Yet I wonder if all the saints, legends, traditions, and superstitions really were just a made-up “Christian Mythology” to fill in the gaps while we wait for one who isn’t coming back. It’s torture! It’s unbearable doubt! What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?

This doesn’t really fit in “Apologetics” or anything… I’m already a Catholic, but undergoing a spiritual crisis. I hope you can help, or at least pray for those like me.

One antidote to your poison is to read the gospel of St. Mathew and the acts. This gives you a picture of who Jesus is, and what his church is like. Then read some history and you will find out for yourself that the catholic one reflects both Jesus and the church he started in the beginning.

As for the other churches, they have to answer for themselves but they do not look like the one coming from Jesus.

In addition, pray and read either the bible or a spiritual book every day for a while, and stay away from anything that isn’t catholic for a good while. You’ve been poisoned.

I say: “Peace upon you.”

 

[Michael_Mayo]

After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans?

Time for a square one reset. You need to go to the source deep with you, your own personal connection with God, your creator. So much of our spiritual life is based on faith. None of us have most likely ever seen Jesus. It sometimes seems that all we have is a tradition handed down to us from others. We believe we have received grace in Baptism and sacraments. All that is faith. But beyond all that and more to the core of your crisis is your fundamental uncertainty about God.

As someone who has followed the advice of John of the Cross and gone into the darkness with faith, temporarily stripping away all the thoughts and images that our tradition has given us, I have found that undoubtable connection that does not depend on the fallibility of the mind. Go into that silent darkness open and without expectation and present yourself to the Most High. Once that fundamental relationship is strengthened all the other falls into place. The Jesus you seek is silently waiting and will reveal himself to you but in ways you cannot image and most do not expect.

 

[tawny]

Praying to the Holy Spirit to give you guidance, direction, strength, fortitude & wisdom in your time of need.

 

[PennyinCanada]

I found great comfort in reading how our Blessed Mother appeared in 1917 and before a huge crowd. On a predetermined date and time, there was the miracle of the sun dancing. Soaking deep mud was made dry in an instant. Healings occurred.

The parting of the Red Sea happened a very long time ago, but we have something greater in this event. The sun danced.

May your soul find peace in the Heart of our Lord.

 

[CrossofChrist]

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/messages/youth/documents/hf_ben-xvi_mes_20100806_youth_en.html

ewtn.com/library/theology/ratzbeau.htm

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/alpha/index_en.html

whosoeverdesires.wordpress.com/2011/01/29/the-conversion-of-romano-guardini/

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

By turning against ourselves, we each, Catholics-against-Catholics as well as Protestants-against-Catholics, have been forced to examine our own beliefs and if we do it right we can learn in the process. So what seems like a problem, has in this way been turned into a blessing, from my view.

When I was little, it was fashionable for Protestant kids to feel superior to Catholics because of their ability to quote verses from the Bible. Could that have been part of why the Church, after Vatican II, began to encourage the faithful to read the Bible? If so, then it may be one way we have adapted to the forces of “competition” and become better for it. :bible1:

The Internet continues to be a blessing to us. It’s funny how so many of us grew up thinking we really had a handle on our Catholic upbringing, and now that we share stories and ideas with other Catholics and even non-Catholics all over the globe, it can serve to enrich us into points of view we’ve never considered. Or it can divide us and make us feel and act separated from and negative toward each other. For me it feels like a lot of the former and a little of the latter, mixed together.

 

[Lormar]

Friends,

Amidst all the hopeful attempts at holiness and reunification of the churches, can we admit one thing to each other? The Body of Christ remains divided, shattered, and fractured into many pieces after many long centuries of schism. This is scandalous to many non-Christians. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important.

Today I woke up in a state of horror, asking myself: “What if all this is just bunk? After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans? Does the Trinity even exist? Why is the world so silent and empty of God?” The Bible doesn’t do much for me, and the Church’s claims sometimes seem meaningless.

I wonder if miracles and holy things have stopped appearing in this modern world because science has shown that they were just fairy-tales and fantasies all along. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?

Yet I wonder if all the saints, legends, traditions, and superstitions really were just a made-up “Christian Mythology” to fill in the gaps while we wait for one who isn’t coming back. It’s torture! It’s unbearable doubt! What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?

This doesn’t really fit in “Apologetics” or anything… I’m already a Catholic, but undergoing a spiritual crisis. I hope you can help, or at least pray for those like me.

Praedicare, I know exactly what you are going through. I’ve been going through a faith crisis myself. Twice I posted desperate pleas. The first in the Prayer Section which got buried in no time. The second in the tradition section, which engendered only one response from a kind member. I only hope you get more support here than I did.

Prayers for you, my friend. It is called “faith” for a reason. No merit in it if you have all the proof in the world in order to believe. It is a risk you take in life. Eternity, if it exists, is never ending. So you will lose nothing by believing since you will never know if you were wrong.

Yes, I know all about Pascal’s Wager.

 

[Lormar]

Praying to the Holy Spirit to give you guidance, direction, strength, fortitude & wisdom in your time of need.

You’re a good woman, Tawny. God bless and reward you for your kindness to so many.

 

[Estevao]

Friends,

Amidst all the hopeful attempts at holiness and reunification of the churches, can we admit one thing to each other? The Body of Christ remains divided, shattered, and fractured into many pieces after many long centuries of schism. This is scandalous to many non-Christians. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important.

Really? I think ecumenism is moving along quite nicely, I expect a reunion with the Orthodox around 2054 which is why I’m trying to stay healthy so I can live to see it.The Anglican communion will probably come back too very soon. If you’re talking a reunion with protestantism in general you’ll be waiting a long time for that though!

Of course I know it’s hard to get on in such a secularized world with its constant influence on the people in the Church. St John Paul II talked about “European culture gives the impression of “silent apostasy” on the part of people who have all that they need and who live as if God does not exist.” This was from a great apostolic exhortation he wrote.

vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/apost_exhortations/documents/hf_jp-ii_exh_20030628_ecclesia-in-europa_en.html

Today I woke up in a state of horror, asking myself: “What if all this is just bunk? After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans? Does the Trinity even exist? Why is the world so silent and empty of God?” The Bible doesn’t do much for me, and the Church’s claims sometimes seem meaningless.

Where is Jesus? He’s in your nearest tabarnacle, he’s in the poor and sick, go and visit him sometime if you want to see him.

I wonder if miracles and holy things have stopped appearing in this modern world because science has shown that they were just fairy-tales and fantasies all along. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?

Yet I wonder if all the saints, legends, traditions, and superstitions really were just a made-up “Christian Mythology” to fill in the gaps while we wait for one who isn’t coming back. It’s torture! It’s unbearable doubt! What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?

This doesn’t really fit in “Apologetics” or anything… I’m already a Catholic, but undergoing a spiritual crisis. I hope you can help, or at least pray for those like me.

THe notion of a “god of the gaps” being the God of Christianity is not true. The Christian God is not based on gaps in scientific knowledge, that’s an old secularist claim, but the interaction between science and theology is much different than this.

Miracles happen all the time, Fatima, Padre Pio’s stories, Eucharistic miracles, go and look them up. I suggest first reading the Catechism’s section on faith beginning with article 142, though, you seem to have a secularist’s conception of faith as something that is a “leap in the dark” without any evidence.

You can answer all the questions you have about the historicity and soundness of the Catholic faith, but if you approach them from a position of despairing doubt instead of looking them as difficulties some of which you will solve with the light of Jesus “leading you kindly” as Blessed Cardinal Newman would put it, you’ll just be spinning your wheels like this.

 

[Lormar]

Estavo, a post like yours will push him right out the door.

 

[Praedicare]

Many thanks to the replies so far… especially Lormar for the kindness, fredconty for such a radical “poison” allegory, and CrossofChrist for the links.

 

[CrossofChrist]

Friends,

Amidst all the hopeful attempts at holiness and reunification of the churches, can we admit one thing to each other? The Body of Christ remains divided, shattered, and fractured into many pieces after many long centuries of schism. This is scandalous to many non-Christians. I have been conscious of a creeping atheism within myself lately, largely because of the circus of empty ecumenism between Churches making the Faith seem equivocal and not very important.

Today I woke up in a state of horror, asking myself: “What if all this is just bunk? After 2000 years - longer than the whole span of Old Testament history - where is Jesus? Why do I feel as if we’ve all been left orphans? Does the Trinity even exist? Why is the world so silent and empty of God?” The Bible doesn’t do much for me, and the Church’s claims sometimes seem meaningless.

I wonder if miracles and holy things have stopped appearing in this modern world because science has shown that they were just fairy-tales and fantasies all along. But what if the miracles and holy things have become less visible because our culture of The Machine (as Tolkien would say) and “Knowledge-Falsely-So-Called” (as St. Paul would say) has cut us off from Mystery?

Yet I wonder if all the saints, legends, traditions, and superstitions really were just a made-up “Christian Mythology” to fill in the gaps while we wait for one who isn’t coming back. It’s torture! It’s unbearable doubt! What do I do? Do I just say “I want to believe”, and leave it at that? It seems so cheap. Does “believing in” the Sun make it burn any brighter?

This doesn’t really fit in “Apologetics” or anything… I’m already a Catholic, but undergoing a spiritual crisis. I hope you can help, or at least pray for those like me.

Ratzinger has a great 40-some pages in his Introduction to Christianity that are fantastic.

This passage is famous (well, maybe not, but it has helped me and I’m sure numerous others):

“Fastened to the cross — with the cross fastened to nothing, drifting in the abyss. The situation of the contemporary believer could hardly be more accurately and impressively described. Only a loose plank bobbing over the void seems to hold him up, and it looks as if he must eventually sink. Only a loose plank connects him to God, though certainly it connects him inescapably, and in the last analysis he knows that this wood is stronger than the void that seethes beneath him and that remains nevertheless the really threatening force in his day-to-day life.”

 

[Praedicare]

CrossOfChrist, that is incredibly powerful, moving, and beautiful…

 

[Lormar]

Ratzinger has a great 40-some pages in his Introduction to Christianity that are fantastic.

This passage is famous (well, maybe not, but it has helped me and I’m sure numerous others):

“Fastened to the cross — with the cross fastened to nothing, drifting in the abyss. The situation of the contemporary believer could hardly be more accurately and impressively described. Only a loose plank bobbing over the void seems to hold him up, and it looks as if he must eventually sink. Only a loose plank connects him to God, though certainly it connects him inescapably, and in the last analysis he knows that this wood is stronger than the void that seethes beneath him and that remains nevertheless the really threatening force in his day-to-day life.”

This is phenomenal. Cross of Christ, where did you get these quotes? The description of being fastened to a cross that is fastened to nothing, bobbing ceaselessly around and being held afloat only by it, is exactly how I have felt for a while now.

Thanks, again.

 

[Shin]

The saints are real, never fear. Read what they have to say. The substance of it has a real solidity to it, solid bone.

What they speak of and truly are — It’s not like the things of this world which are full of vanity and bluff, fantasies cloaked in authoritative terms but which quickly after a few years are revealed to have been fraudulent.

The saints are real and solid and moral and sound.

Read and hold onto them and if there are others who aren’t they will carry you through and past the difficulties.

• Prayers +

Ave Maria!

'For the wisdom of the flesh is death; but the wisdom of the spirit is life and peace.

If you live according to the flesh, you shall die: but if by the Spirit you mortify the deeds of the flesh, you shall live.’

Romans 8:6,13

 

[CrossofChrist]

This is phenomenal. Cross of Christ, where did you get these quotes?

Looking when I’ve had my own struggles.

I strongly recommend Ratzinger’s Introduction to Christianity and St. Therese’s Story of a Soul.

If you are struggling with the historical dimension of Catholicism, I have some links for that as well. But, doubt can go much deeper than that.

Lumen Fidei is something else I’d also recommend (gosh, I keep suggesting things for you guys to read…ugh…)

LF 16:

The clearest proof of the reliability of Christ’s love is to be found in his dying for our sake. If laying down one’s life for one’s friends is the greatest proof of love (cf. Jn 15:13), Jesus offered his own life for all, even for his enemies, to transform their hearts. This explains why the evangelists could see the hour of Christ’s crucifixion as the culmination of the gaze of faith; in that hour the depth and breadth of God’s love shone forth. It was then that Saint John offered his solemn testimony, as together with the Mother of Jesus he gazed upon the pierced one (cf. Jn 19:37): “He who saw this has borne witness, so that you also may believe. His testimony is true, and he knows that he tells the truth” (Jn 19:35). In Dostoevsky’s The Idiot, Prince Myshkin sees a painting by Hans Holbein the Younger depicting Christ dead in the tomb and says: “Looking at that painting might cause one to lose his faith”.[14] The painting is a gruesome portrayal of the destructive effects of death on Christ’s body. Yet it is precisely in contemplating Jesus’ death that faith grows stronger and receives a dazzling light; then it is revealed as faith in Christ’s steadfast love for us, a love capable of embracing death to bring us salvation. This love, which did not recoil before death in order to show its depth, is something I can believe in; Christ’s total self-gift overcomes every suspicion and enables me to entrust myself to him completely.

 

[Lormar]

If you are struggling with the historical dimension of Catholicism…

No, it wasn’t that. It was whether it was true at all and not a sham from the beginning.