Hy the lack of apparitions in Islam? (Edited Title)

[Servant19]

So there are apparitions in every religion. Why does God allow this? If you say Satan is responsible for the non Christian ones then you would say Satan is more powerful than God because God wants everybody to reach salvation and that is absurd. Why apparitions in all religions?

Maybe because all the worlds major religions are from God

Many think how can this be with so many contradictions between them?
There are theologically sound explanations out there which offer a reconciliatory explanation.

 

[Dorothy]

So there are apparitions in every religion. Why does God allow this? If you say Satan is responsible for the non Christian ones then you would say Satan is more powerful than God because God wants everybody to reach salvation and that is absurd. Why apparitions in all religions?

There could not be apparitions in all religions. People can be deluding themselves, have mental problems, and allowing themselves to be deceived. God does not give different truths to different people. Jesus was born, lived, died, and ROSE FROM THE DEAD. The apostles freely gave their lives, having seen the Risen Christ.

No other starter of a religion rose from the dead.

 

[runningdude]

I don’t understand your statement. In what way do you, a Catholic, see these alleged visions converting people into error?

Personally, I believe with all my heart that if such visions exist they are not of God. Our God is not a God of confusion.

I did not say these vision are authentic; I said people claim to have them.

 

[Servant19]

I did not say these vision are authentic; I said people claim to have them.

How do you discern what is an authentic and what is a non-authentic vision?

 

[Dorothy]

I did not say these vision are authentic; I said people claim to have them.

Thank you for clarifying!

 

[runningdude]

How do you discern what is an authentic and what is a non-authentic vision?

If it leads somebody away from the one true holy faith, then in can’t be authentic.

Even visions of Christ or the Saints may still be mere dreams. It requires careful discerning of the message by the church to determine if the vision may be authentic; even then Catholics are not obligated to accept the private revelation given in such a vision.

Catholics are bound only to believe that which is publicly taught by the Catholic Church.

 

[Celtic_Maiden]

There are thousands of denominations of Christianity. God seems just fine with confusion.

There are a lot of denominations in the Moslem Religion if you want me to name all of them let me know, so God seems just fine also with this confusion.

 

[Servant19]

If it leads somebody away from the one true holy faith, then in can’t be authentic.

Even visions of Christ or the Saints may still be mere dreams. It requires careful discerning of the message by the church to determine if the vision may be authentic; even then Catholics are not obligated to accept the private revelation given in such a vision.

Catholics are bound only to believe that which is publicly taught by the Catholic Church.

So you’re saying that any vision that leads a person to become a Muslim or a Bahai or a Buddhist, for example is not authentic?

And by non-authentic, you mean it guides the person AWAY from God?

 

[runningdude]

So you’re saying that any vision that leads a person to become a Muslim or a Bahai or a Buddhist, for example is not authentic?

Yes. At best, it would be a mere dream.

And by non-authentic, you mean it guides the person AWAY from God?

God would not send a message that leads a person away from the Catholic Church. To be drawn closer to God is to be drawn closer to his church.

 

[daler]

Yes. At best, it would be a mere dream.

God would not send a message that leads a person away from the Catholic Church. To be drawn closer to God is to be drawn closer to his church.

In studying near death experiences, people of different cultures and religions tend to see a Buddha, or Jesus, or Muhammad in the Being of Light that they identify with Who their Prophet figure is.

From a Native American perspective, that Figure could be someone else entirely. I don’t think that one can discount such experiences as a “mere dream” solely on whether or not they fall into one particular theology. That wouldn’t make sense (to me).

 

[Dorothy]

Our all-knowing God knows where we are coming from, and the framework of our beliefs. He comes to us at our level and draws us to Himself.

There is one Truth, …Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

There are a lot of denominations in the Moslem Religion if you want me to name all of them let me know, so God seems just fine also with this confusion.

Yup, confusion all over the place!

 

[daler]

Yup, confusion all over the place!

The same illness afflicts in its dissections and schisms all of the ancient religions, whether Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Hindu, or Buddhist. Yet there are always those who profit by division, and gain by fear and intrigue, following their own interpretations. Hence, a thousand schisms are created, a single body dissected, and all these by “learned” divines who create niches for themselves.

"In brief, dissensions among various sects have opened the way to weakness.  Each sect hath picked out a way for itself and is clinging to a certain cord.  Despite manifold blindness and ignorance they pride themselves on their insight and knowledge…"
							Baha'u'llah, Kalimat-i-Firdawsiyyih

 

[runningdude]

In studying near death experiences, people of different cultures and religions tend to see a Buddha, or Jesus, or Muhammad in the Being of Light that they identify with Who their Prophet figure is.

From a Native American perspective, that Figure could be someone else entirely. I don’t think that one can discount such experiences as a “mere dream” solely on whether or not they fall into one particular theology. That wouldn’t make sense (to me).

As a Catholic, I believe anything that contradicts the faith Christ entrusted to his church must be incorrect. There is one God, and one faith.

There is no reason to believe that a near death experience is not biological in origin, in essence a more “extreme” dream. If it contradicts the given faith, then it must not be an authentic religious vision. Even then, a perfectly kosher Catholic vision rolleyes could still be biological.

 

[daler]

As a Catholic, I believe anything that contradicts the faith Christ entrusted to his church must be incorrect. There is one God, and one faith.

There is no reason to believe that a near death experience is not biological in origin, in essence a more “extreme” dream. If it contradicts the given faith, then it must not be an authentic religious vision. Even then, a perfectly kosher Catholic vision rolleyes could still be biological.

While the visions of Daniel, and John in Revelation are accepted as real, and we are told that there shall be “One Fold and One Shepherd”, how about the visions of others, such as Black Elk:

. “I looked ahead and saw the mountains there with rocks and forests upon them, and from the mountains flashed all colors upwards to the heavens. Then I was standing on the highest mountain of them all, and round about beneath me was the whole hoop of the world. And while I stood there I saw more than I can tell and I understood more than I saw, for I was seeing in a sacred manner the shapes of all things in the spirit and the shape of all shapes as they must live together in one being. And I saw the sacred hoop of my people was one of many sacred hoops that made one circle, wide as daylight and as starlight, and in the center grew one mighty and flowering tree to shelter all the children of one mother and one father. And I saw that it was holy.”

 

[runningdude]

While the visions of Daniel, and John in Revelation are accepted as real, and we are told that there shall be “One Fold and One Shepherd”, how about the visions of others, such as Black Elk:

. “I looked ahead and saw the mountains there with rocks and forests upon them, and from the mountains flashed all colors upwards to the heavens. Then I was standing on the highest mountain of them all, and round about beneath me was the whole hoop of the world. And while I stood there I saw more than I can tell and I understood more than I saw, for I was seeing in a sacred manner the shapes of all things in the spirit and the shape of all shapes as they must live together in one being. And I saw the sacred hoop of my people was one of many sacred hoops that made one circle, wide as daylight and as starlight, and in the center grew one mighty and flowering tree to shelter all the children of one mother and one father. And I saw that it was holy.”

The Revelation given to John has been ruled an authentic part of the canon of scripture by unanimous vote at numerous councils. This vision by “Black Elk” has not be so vetted.

 

[daler]

The Revelation given to John has been ruled an authentic part of the canon of scripture by unanimous vote at numerous councils. This vision by “Black Elk” has not be so vetted.

How many Indians, may I ask, have sat on those councils?

 

[Dorothy]

I have read several book reviews about Black Elk, and learned that he became Catholic.

As far as visions go, certain insights can be granted to seeking people…but it doesn’t mean they have seen the whole truth. In other words, visions can be taken out of context.

 

[daler]

I have read several book reviews about Black Elk, and learned that he became Catholic.

As far as visions go, certain insights can be granted to seeking people…but it doesn’t mean they have seen the whole truth. In other words, visions can be taken out of context.

Yes, Black Elk did become Catholic and saw the unity between his people’s religion and that of Christianity. His vision is the Lakota equivalent of the One Fold and One Shepherd, and is not to be discounted.

I grew up on a Sioux reservation in South Dakota and have met some of his descendants, and the descendants of Sitting Bull. There is no doubt in my mind that God sent His Prophets to the Indian peoples as well.

 

[Dorothy]

Yes, Black Elk did become Catholic and saw the unity between his people’s religion and that of Christianity. His vision is the Lakota equivalent of the One Fold and One Shepherd, and is not to be discounted.

I grew up on a Sioux reservation in South Dakota and have met some of his descendants, and the descendants of Sitting Bull. There is no doubt in my mind that God sent His Prophets to the Indian peoples as well.

Thank you for those insights! I have no doubt that Jesus came for all people.