I don't get it.

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Ok so Christ gave them the authority, but didn’t say that we couldn’t choose to go directly to him.
 
Lilith785 said:
Ok so Christ gave them the authority, but didn’t say that we couldn’t choose to go directly to him.
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To say that is to say that the power He gave them to forgive sins is redundant and useless, and essentially has no point.

Besides which, He gave them more than authority - He gave them power to bind and loose. And HIS OWN authority - ‘who hears you, hears Me, who rejects you rejects Me’. That means if THEY teach that confession is necessary in certain circumstances, He ratifies that teaching as being His own (which, thanks to the Holy Spirit’s guidance, it is!)
 
LilyM said:
To say that is to say that the power He gave them to forgive sins is redundant and useless, and essentially has no point.

Besides which, He gave them more than authority - He gave them power to bind and loose. And HIS OWN authority - ‘who hears you, hears Me, who rejects you rejects Me’. That means if THEY teach that confession is necessary in certain circumstances, He ratifies that teaching as being His own (which, thanks to the Holy Spirit’s guidance, it is!)
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AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamen and AMEN!
 
Lilith785 said:
Ok so Christ gave them the authority, but didn’t say that we couldn’t choose to go directly to him.
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i can’t recall the verse of scripture where we’re are commanded to confess are sins directly to God…can you find that quote for me? Thx! I’ve seen where we are to confess our sins to one another James 5:16, but not directly to God.
 
I do recall the case of Christ and the Leaper, where the Leaper asked Christ to heal him, and HE DID! And then what did Christ do after healing the Leaper, he told him to go show himself to the priest so that he could be declared clean of his sins.
 
Lilith785 said:
Christ said (paraphrase) “No one comes to the Father but through me” So why do we confess to a preist when we can confess directly to god in prayer? http://www.dineoxford.com/pics/img/2657/y09w0131xdtc/82(2).gif
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What is your real objection to confession? I’ll bet your real objection is that it is uncomfortable, embarrassing. True?

God knows that when we confess to a priest we have to confront our sins in a much fuller way than if we just “confess to God”. And we need to confront our sins, to truly face them and repent of them. So God, knowing us better than we will ever know ourselves, has ordained that we should confess our sins to a priest, and receive forgiveness from a priest.

On that latter point, there is comfort and closure in hearing the words of forgiveness actually pronounced. Lacking that, it is possible to doubt one’s forgiveness, and that happens all the time to Protestants - many of them have said as much.
 
VociMike said:
What is your real objection to confession? I’ll bet your real objection is that it is uncomfortable, embarrassing. True?
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I never stated that I had an objection. I was simply asking about something which I did not understand. 🤷

I do however believe that going directly to God makes more sense. Hypothetical situation:

A Priest is suffering from a crisis of faith.
Does his forgiveness mean anything?

Lets say the Priest is corrupt, (yes it happens).

The point is that Priests are still human and subject to everything that we are. At what point is that authority taken away, and how are we to know if that “man given” forgiveness means anything. I say why waist time and go straight to the source. I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
 
perhaps we learn lessons in humility by being humiliated for having to confess our sins against God to a priest. Perhaps the only true act of Reconciliation comes not from confessing the sins that only God and I know, but perhaps by allowing someone in on our secret to give us the absolution we seek. Confessing to a priest takes out the ambiguity on whether or not we were hurt or saddened by the sin committed. This way, only three people know what happened, and you can be forgiven in person, instead of finding out that you were forgiven in God’s time.
 
Lilith785 said:
I never stated that I had an objection. I was simply asking about something which I did not understand. 🤷

I do however believe that going directly to God makes more sense. Hypothetical situation:

A Priest is suffering from a crisis of faith.
Does his forgiveness mean anything?

Lets say the Priest is corrupt, (yes it happens).

The point is that Priests are still human and subject to everything that we are. At what point is that authority taken away, and how are we to know if that “man given” forgiveness means anything. I say why waist time and go straight to the source. I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
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so what as the passage from scripture again that he tells us to confess our sins directly to God?

Also the first part of a valid confession is that we make an act of contrition, that is going to God and saying we are truly sorry for our sin, because of our love for him. The priest doesn’t forgive the sin, he says the words of absolution as an outward sign of the inner forgiveness that God has granted us. Much like Jesus and the leaper, Jesus does the healing, the priests validate it.
 
Lilith785 said:
I never stated that I had an objection. I was simply asking about something which I did not understand. 🤷

I do however believe that going directly to God makes more sense. Hypothetical situation:

A Priest is suffering from a crisis of faith.
Does his forgiveness mean anything?
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Yes, because it’s not the priest’s forgiveness; it’s God’s forgiveness - the priest is only the “tap” out of which God’s “water” is flowing.
Lets say the Priest is corrupt, (yes it happens).
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What if he is? He is still God’s instrument of forgiveness.
The point is that Priests are still human and subject to everything that we are. At what point is that authority taken away, and how are we to know if that “man given” forgiveness means anything. I say why waist time and go straight to the source. I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
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He might or He might not, but how would you know, either way? 🤷

God doesn’t speak to us in a human voice when we are alone. We have no way of knowing what God is doing, when we are alone, because we cannot see Him or hear Him. But He speaks with the priest’s voice in the Confessional; of this we are sure, because God said to the priest “Whoever hears you hears Me.” (Luke 10:16)
 
I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.

That is such a childish and loaded dare and does not further discussion.

The point is auditory confession is the regular means by which God has revealed to us that he will forgive our sins.
 
Lilith785 said:
I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
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‘Not everyone who calls me ‘Lord, Lord’ will be saved’. As Jesus said.

So it stands to reason that God is not obligated to forgive everyone who asks - for example, if they don’t ask with a true spirit of contrition and desire to turn aside from their sin.
 
Lilith785 said:
I do however believe that going directly to God makes more sense. Hypothetical situation:

A Priest is suffering from a crisis of faith.
Does his forgiveness mean anything?

Lets say the Priest is corrupt, (yes it happens).

The point is that Priests are still human and subject to everything that we are. At what point is that authority taken away, and how are we to know if that “man given” forgiveness means anything. I say why waist time and go straight to the source.
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Doing what God calls on us to do is never wasting time.

As for corrupt and sinful priests, let’s extend that question to all those sinful men who wrote the bible. Why do you accept the bible if it was written by sinful men?
I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
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What purpose would that serve? I don’t have the authority to speak for God. But the Church does have that authority. So if you want to hear what God wants, listen to the Church. “He who hears you, hears me. He who rejects you, rejects me.”
 
Lilith785 said:
I never stated that I had an objection. I was simply asking about something which I did not understand. 🤷

I do however believe that going directly to God makes more sense. Hypothetical situation:

A Priest is suffering from a crisis of faith.
Does his forgiveness mean anything?

Lets say the Priest is corrupt, (yes it happens).

The point is that Priests are still human and subject to everything that we are. At what point is that authority taken away, and how are we to know if that “man given” forgiveness means anything. I say why waist time and go straight to the source. I dare you to tell me that God won’t forgive me if I ask him directly.
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It’s not “man-given” forgiveness. Like with the other sacraments, the validity of the sacrament has nothing to do with the worthiness of the priest or deacon administering it.

Seems like with such a “dare” that you DO have an objection. 🤷
 
From what I was taught and understand, the priest is acting in the physical place of Christ by the authority given to the apostles by Jesus during his life. It is the right of a priest, as given by Jesus, through his Vicar on earth–the descendant of Peter. You could technically go to Jesus directly, but you get instant forgiveness on earth, and there is no uncertainty in the forgiveness because you are not hearing the absolution. Plus, confessions not just cleanses your sins, it restores the union with the Church and all her treasures.
 
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