I fear we might have entered that time

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One problem is that many people who felt trapped in a wrong body in past eras didn’t have a good way to express that; many were likely illiterate, and even if they had been literate, the records may have been lost or the person might have refrained from writing their true thoughts for fear of reprisal or because it was just too weird.

We have no way of knowing for sure if the woman who cross-dressed to be a soldier or a monk, or the man who cross-dressed to play femme roles onstage or be a femme prostitute, just wanted that “career”, or if they really had gender dysphoria. Probably some of each among the many cross-dressers out there.
 
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Tis_Bearself said:
We have no way of knowing for sure if the woman who cross-dressed to be a soldier or a monk, or the man who cross-dressed to play femme roles onstage or be a femme prostitute, just wanted that “career”, or if they really had gender dysphoria.
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Exactly.
We don’t know.
It’s way too easy to go back in time and revise the history.
But it’s still good to have the primary sources.

Gender bending is nothing new under the sun. But the stakes are very raised when we now have the technology to do permanent changes, and a lot of loud ideologies trying to shout each other down (or force legislations, silence or deplatform the opposition)
 
The quotation in the OP brings to mind every tribal, cultural, and nationalist mindset ever. Really, there is nothing new under the sun.

As to gender ideology, I think it is but one facet of a broader disorder, the culture of self-absorption.
 
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I enjoyed reading Louis de Wohl’s historical fiction on the saints. There’s almost always a character who think the times are so bad it must be the end of the world. It was comforting to see! As a reader you really “get” why the character felt that way. “Lay Siege to Heaven, for example, is the story of St. Catherine and set during the Black Plague in Europe. The author describes it very graphically and you can see why folks worried it was the end times! I recommend the books right now. They’re great stories of saints who lived through momentous and turbulent times in history… and they’re great reminders that we’re not the only ones to think The End is near!
 
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Have you done a deep dive into history? Pick out a place, a time, and read more than Wikipedia. Find out about the societies, people, how they lived. You will find that there is nothing new under the sun.
 
The top scientists in the world used to think that our bodies/illnesses were controlled by the four humors. The people who denied germ theory were at the pinnacle of science.

Wise men once thought that seizures were evidence of demonic possession, my grandma thought cats tried to smother babies and that static electricity could kill a person. My 80 + year old uncle does not understand what DNA is.

Our scientific knowledge grows and expands.

Tomorrow science may define the medical basis for those who are somewhere in the Trans spectrum.
 
How far into it are you delving?

I believe there is mention of transgender people in either the Written Law (Torah) or the Oral Law (Talmud). Truly, there is nothing new under the sun. Maybe over the sun?
 
TheLittleLady said:
Tomorrow science may define the medical basis for those who are somewhere in the Trans spectrum
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It would definitely be helpful.

There’s so much noise and confusion and politization that trying to come to any clear understanding is impossible ATM
 
meltzerboy2 said:
How far into it are you delving?
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Well, I went to the bibliography and most sources were from the 2000s, some from 1990s, a book from the 1930s (which I tried but failed to download) and a couple articles from the 1960s that required payment.

No primary sources and nothing from before 1900.

That being said, the actual article had some blue links that I’m starting to follow and I’m hoping to find some primary sources in there.

I did find an interesting article about what appears to be a MTF from the late 1800s and I want to delve further.

The writers of the original article didn’t do themselves any favors in how they presented their case. They kinda threw in everything into the kitchen sink as padding—they mixed god/goddess myths in with the historic cross dressers and the homosexual cultures of various times and places, current LGBT events and heaps of modern commentary.
Of course, Wikipedia is that way—anybody can contribute.

What I’m looking for is early examples of our classic (1900s) understanding of the transsexual/transgender phenomenon (persistent dysphoria from birth, in the absence of other psychological disorder, unrelated to perceived advantage of being the other sex, which doesn’t increase during times of stress nor remit during less stressful times).

Gender bending and variations in sexual expression are seen across culture and times. Studying it gives us more insight, but a lot of its origin remains unclear.

And I maintain that we should be very cautious about using the law to make other people “play along” with the extraordinary and unprovable claim of being born in the wrong body.
 
2 Timothy 3 gives a thorough description of “the last days” which matches contemporary observation precisely.

Although the world has seen evil epochs throughout history, and religious observers of those past evil times sometimes speculated, based on the observed evils, that they were witnessing “the last days,” there is another criterion in scripture for when the END will come. That criterion is not based on an evil occurrence, but upon the completion of “The Great Commission” of world evangelization.

Matthew 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

(From Wikipedia on the Amazon synod)

The Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazon region, commonly referred to as the Amazon synod , met in Rome from 6 to 27 October 2019. Pope Francis announced on 15 October 2017 that it would work “to identify new paths for the evangelization of God’s people in that region”, specifically the indigenous peoples who are “often forgotten and without the prospect of a serene future”.

The obstacles to evangelization include the difficult terrain that makes native populations hard to reach, the great variety of languages spoken, and the resistance of landowners and business interests. The Amazon basin, according to one Vatican report, covers some 6,000,000 km2, with a population of 2.8 million divided among 400 tribes that “speak some 240 languages belonging to 49 linguistic families”. The Synod defines the region to include all or parts of Bolivia, Brazil, Colombia, Ecuador, French Guiana, Guyana, Peru, Venezuela, and Suriname, most of which are countries where the population is largely Roman Catholic.

Somewhere on Planet Earth, a Christian missionary or Catholic priest already has, or soon will fulfill the Great Commission. Then, in the words of Jesus, "…SHALL THE END COME."

Do not fear if we have entered this time. Our lives do not belong to us, but to our Creator. We are living precisely where and when He wants us.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Even if science defined, it would take people another 100 years to accept the science.
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I’ve mentioned this before—I do have a dog in this fight.
Some years back, a young Teenage relative who’d had a traumatic early life but with normal gender presentation decided to transition. He also had several other, moderate to severe, psychiatric issues.
The story is convoluted but basically, the psychiatric professionals at a respected and well-known local hospital jumped on his “transsexual” claim and refused to even address his other issues.
It was easy for them. They didn’t have to do the hard work of walking alongside a deeply traumatized kid with demonstrable wounds.
So he goes on to transition, none of his other diagnoses are ever addressed, then he proceeds to attempt suicide several times.

AT first, I could explain it as an outlier case, that this kid was able to lie convincingly , or he fell through the cracks or his practitioners were stupid but acted in good faith or whatever.
But as time goes on. I’m coming across more and more cases of teens unhappy with their birth sex (after having a happy childhood), have had many tearful talks with parents, heard too many stories of gender clinics who are pushing hormones from the very first visit…

But I have also seen kids (plural) detransition after being very demanding and insistent for sometimes years.

None of this makes sense to me. I’m trying very hard to make sense out of it.

And with the aggression and power the transactivists have, because they’re not above lying and gaslighting, we need to make sense of it, sooner rather than later.

Which is what I’m trying to do.
 
Sure they have always existed. But did they consider sex change operations normal? Did their children get indoctrinated that gender is fluid and a social construct? That marriage is not necessarily between a man and a woman? That killing a baby is ‘ok’ if the woman needs a career?

I could go on and on…but basic foundational things of society have been overturned. That i feel is very different .Anyone’s past is up for fair game…get yourself fired, break the statue, fight with the police
 
0Scarlett_nidiyilii said:
and a lot of loud ideologies trying to shout each other down
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And therein I think lies the difference. In past times, a woman would have to hide a relationship with an unmarried man. Heck, get pregnant and you are pulled out of school and hidden and the baby given to an orphanage.

I think the strict social order of the past would have seriously restricted nearly all people from announcing their selves as transgender. Not to mention, it probably wouldn’t have been written down. Perhaps ostracized and that’s it. There was nowhere near as much stuff documented in the past than today when I can look online and see a trans person thousands of miles from me.
 
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