I hate college.

[CollegeStinks]

Thank you for trying to understand. I guess you just got lucky … After 10 years of intense searching, praying, and studying, with guidance from a Spiritual Director, and in that time being completely healed of a severe psychosis that the doctors would say would be problematic for me the rest of my life, many, many things have started coming together all of a sudden and I’m experiencing peace and joy that transcends any other experience I’d had before, and it is, independent of my ****** life circumstances. I am still surrounded by jerks and fools, but suddenly I’ve given up control, and therefore my responsibility, to put labels on them. I just love them and when I must deal with them in contexts that used to stress me out, I no longer let it disturb my peace. I’m doing my best to contain my enthusiasm and direct my comments toward the issue being asked about. If I don’t, I apologize.

If I see my brother doing something I believe to be harmful, then it is up to me to notice that, and if possible, try to convey to my brother that he might change something. Just don’t call it a sin. And I’m saying it is impossible for humans to make a right judgment of another human, taking into account what’s in his heart.

So I can say, “I feel hurt when you did that,” but don’t say, “you sinned against me.”

In the first, I am communicating a feeling I have to another person. In the second, I have judged.

I**'d like to see anywhere, other than as implied by footnotes that as far as I know are not considered inspired by God, but are man’s interpretations, where Jesus said we have any responsibility whatsoever to judge anything as good or evil, except our own motives. Not other people’s outward acts.**

Alan

1 Corinthians 5:11-13 “But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler–not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? But those who are outside, God judges. remove the wicked man from among yourselves.”

^St. Paul here tells people who appear to be in a similar situation as mine not to associate with the such people. Specifically he is talking about members of the Church. God judges those outside of the Church, but we judge those among us.

Matthew 18:15 “If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.”

^This directly clashes with your approach of dealing with sinners.

Matthew 7:1 is merely a condemnation of hypocrisy. It’s not a blanket statement over judgement the way many people think. More often than not it’s used by non-Christians to silence Christians from speaking out against issues of morality. But you must use context.

Finally,

John 7:24 “Judge not according to the appearance: but judge just judgement.”

What I meant by the fundamentalist remark was that it seemed like you focused on the literal value of one verse without considering the overall context. Judgement is a necessity for being not only a good Christian, but for being a successful human being. I apologize that I could not find any verses shedding light onto the “love the sinner, hate the sin” idea on a quick skim, but I’m pretty sure they’re there. Not only was I thought it in high school theology, but the priest at my church gave a similarly themed homily not too long ago. Catholics are to judge wicked acts as wicked. What we are not to do is judge the state of one’s soul.

There is a book that I read not too long ago that dealt with Catholic issues in the modern world that one of my old priest’s gave to me that was really good. It was titled Catholicism, I can’t remember who wrote it and am in a hurry so maybe I’ll get back to you later on that.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Thank you for considering my view, even if only to refute it. Either way, at least you have entertained my ideas in part.

Do you not believe God can renew your mind and heart so you no longer judge even actions? Do you not think He would want to, if you’d let go of voices from the past telling you otherwise? Can he not show you a mindframe that keeps you peaceful amid the emotional storm of dealing with messed up people? If not, then scripture is not totally serious about “with God all things are possible.”

If you think you’re being humble by saying, “God will never choose me,” then I submit you are not willing to let Him have his way to mold you as the Divine Potter.

All I’m asking is that you do not reject out of hand that God can create anything your or my humans minds can come up with. If not, we are claiming our imagination is more powerful than God’s word.

If you can imagine a world where the lion sleep with the lamb, the righteous and sinner see each other as truly equal in spirit, where you can walk among societal rejects with the dignity and compassion of Jesus?

If you can imagine it, God can do it. That says to me, if it’s good, why not pray for it? To say our prayer is too grandiose means we think we’ve come up with something too big for God to hear us about.

How about this: “Dear Lord, please help me receive the peace that Jesus freely gave me, that I can experience what it’s like to be calm among a storm of troubling circumstances and become closer to Jesus in mind and heart.”

If you want me to speak directly to one or more points in the last post, I will. I don’t want to be pushy or argumentative, because it is not my will whether you are to experience my words, but that of the Father through the guiding hand of the Holy Spirit. My ego has a different take on it, but I’m trying to keep that ever-growing part of me in check!

Alan

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Matthew 7:1 is merely a condemnation of hypocrisy. It’s not a blanket statement over judgement the way many people think. More often than not it’s used by non-Christians to silence Christians from speaking out against issues of morality. But you must use context.

So when Jesus said, “stop judging,” he really meant, “stop judging if your sins are worse than the one whom you are judging?”

Then we’re into the plank in our own eye problem.

Sounds like a Catch-22.

John 7:24 “Judge not according to the appearance: but judge just judgement.”

There’s one problem with this. How are we to make a just judgment, unless we can see what’s on a person’s insides? Doesn’t intent and state of the heart and other factors contribute toward whether certain acts are even sinful, and if so how serious it is?

Jesus also tells us to be perfect. I say until we are, we cannot make a just judgment. So we can aspire to be one who can make that judgment, but that doesn’t mean Jesus was wrong or incomplete when He said that when we judge, we shall be judged.

What I meant by the fundamentalist remark was that it seemed like you focused on the literal value of one verse without considering the overall context.

OK, I see your concern. Actually, I’ve gone through such an amazing experience and my life is so much better than before – better than I could ever imagine under my circumstances – that I wish to encourage others to seek this place. I take a holistic approach to the Bible, because I believe the real power of the Bible is how it speaks to the heart, and not so much the head. I am focused not on what each passage means, but what does it do to me when I let it in without trying to figure it out at all, such as in contemplative prayer forms such as Lectio Divina.

Basically if we insist that we be able to figure out anything the Bible says and understand it and accept that it makes sense to us before we let it past our minds and into our hearts, then God will never be able to speak to us through His word, except to the extent that what He says, we already agree with.

Judgement is a necessity for being not only a good Christian, but for being a successful human being.

Have it your way. We can never be completely free from judging, but it should be our goal. As far as successful, I assume you’re talking about worldly success? If so, that’s hardly a yardstick a Christian should use, I’d suggest.

I apologize that I could not find any verses shedding light onto the “love the sinner, hate the sin” idea on a quick skim, but I’m pretty sure they’re there. Not only was I thought it in high school theology, but the priest at my church gave a similarly themed homily not too long ago.

Bet you can’t find them. I may be wrong, of course.

Catholics are to judge wicked acts as wicked. What we are not to do is judge the state of one’s soul.

But there again lies the rub. How is it possible to know whether a certain destructive or harmful act is actually a sin, unless you presume to know the state of their soul?

Again, how can you claim their is a sin, without claiming that the one who did the act was a sinner? If you can know that for certain, then you have judged the state of the person’s soul.

There is a book that I read not too long ago that dealt with Catholic issues in the modern world that one of my old priest’s gave to me that was really good. It was titled Catholicism, I can’t remember who wrote it and am in a hurry so maybe I’ll get back to you later on that.

OK, I’ll be interested in hearing what it has to say.

Alan

 

[coco2]

Just pray for them and love them. Believe it or not, some of these people will find God despite and maybe because of all this darkness they have thrown themselves into. I should know, I was one of those idiotic college students at one time. And I will tell you, that I NOTICED the students on the sidelines carrying their Bibles around and not following the crowd. And it made me wonder… and eventually, I wanted to know what was in that Book, so I finally picked mine up and opened it. YOU ARE WITNESSING YOUR FAITH AND GOD IS WORKING THROUGH YOU TO TOUCH SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE WITHOUT (you) EVEN KNOWING IT.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Just pray for them and love them. Believe it or not, some of these people will find God despite and maybe because of all this darkness they have thrown themselves into. I should know, I was one of those idiotic college students at one time. And I will tell you, that I NOTICED the students on the sidelines carrying their Bibles around and not following the crowd. And it made me wonder… and eventually, I wanted to know what was in that Book, so I finally picked mine up and opened it. YOU ARE WITNESSING YOUR FAITH AND GOD IS WORKING THROUGH YOU TO TOUCH SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE WITHOUT (you) EVEN KNOWING IT.

I like your ideas!

There isn’t much need for us to do the work of God, in a place where the work is already done.

Alan

 

[wjp984]

First of all, welcome to the forum. Second of all, you might want to consider changing your name again because if you want to post in other threads, your name does not give a good impression.

If you don’t mind me asking, what college do you attend? I am sorry to hear that your Newman Center is terrible. They really can be hit or miss depending on the current crowd of students.

Nonetheless, perhaps there are others who also think like you but are afraid to speak out. Did you ever think of this possibility. You might get ridiculed by some but I am willing to bet there are some people at your Newman Center that think like you are are just afraid. With numbers you can start to change things together.

Furthermore, check out your local parish. There might be a local parish with a young adult group. Sometimes when the Newman Center is not very good at a university, Catholic students will join together at a local parish. So look for that.

 

[TheDoors]

He is risen!
College can be rough, but you tend to get out of it what you put in. In this case, perhaps you were a bit misled when you chose this peticular one. I know alot of schools that claim to be quiet, christian centers of learning, and oh would you like to hear about our greek life?

Pray. Prayer is good. Pray in the morning, pray at night, pray all the time.

Talk. Discuss this with your advisor, and the housing director. If they can’t help, well,

Search. Take your happy self over to google and find a new school. You’re paying alot of money for this experience. I wouldn’t be willing to pay for something that isn’t quality.

 

[marica_mandic]

I’m very angry. It’s 1:20 AM and outside of my building I hear drunk kids frolicking in their own stupidity. My room mates all got drunk earlier this evening and thankfully left. Unfortunately they left their God-awful rap music playing, and the reason they left was to get more drunk and “hook-up” with women. This place is like hell and I feel beyond isolated. I refuse to partake in the progressive cultural filth that goes on here. I go to a somewhat prestigious University and am pursuing a career in science and dentistry. The cultural idiocy that takes place here is incredibly distracting. Whether it’s the vast encouragement of sexual promiscuity, indulgence, or secularism, there is always some sort of campus event that any Christian should vehemently object. But there is absolutely no human being on this God forsaken campus that has the courage to live their convictions. None. Everyone on campus fits neatly into 1 of 2 categories. Either they partake in whatever they can to make themselves feel pleasured (hedonists), or they don’t partake themselves but possess the post-modern attitude that such actions are acceptable and not contrary to morality. American Universities are pure evil, that’s what I’ve learned these past 2 years. I feel very very very angry. I’ve never felt so alone.

They do nothave the same wiew to party as you. You do not have be like they just that they accept you. Maybe in University yo have some daily programs, in which you belong.
On outside of University try to find people who think like you. With angry you will nothing make.

 

[Eliza10]

Wow. I feel for you. Its been awhile since I was in college. Mine was also secular. During college I met students from Campus Crusade for Christ. They were very devout and wholesome people and their witness for Christ led me to a true conversion to Christ (I called it “Born-Again” then. Basically, I truly believed and accepted Christ for the first time!). Three of the people I knew there were devout Catholic, and they came to mind many years later when I converted to Catholic. God gave me graces, just after that conversion, of being surrounded by many devout Christians - and it seemed that I kept meeting Christians everywhere! I wondered how I missed them all the previous years!

So, I know other people here may oppose this suggestion, but, if the Newman Center at your college is not spiritual (Are you sure, though? Maybe the more devout ones aren’t the first and most flamboyant ones you meet*) then try another Christian campus group. (You have Catholic Answers Forum here to support you if anyone there raises questions about your uniquely Catholic beliefs). Whatever group you try, give it more than one meeting. Three, at least!

Because I feel very sure of this - your college is NOT “God-forsaken”!

While I was in college one summer I took a job back home in a hospital records office. There was plenty of time to socialize in the long days there but the people in the office were shallow and worldly, and I just didn’t fit in. I was so lonely there! I ached for Christian fellowship! “This place is God-forsaken!”, I concluded, in my discouragement…

No sooner had that thought taken hold in my mind than God showed me the truth. An open-faced young girl came down with records from an upstairs office. For some reason, one of us asked the other, “Are you a Christian?” and then that place was “God-forsaken” no more. I now had someone to go to lunch with or meet for breaks and share my love for the Lord and His Word with. She was Charismatic, and she shared that she was seeking the gift of tongues, wondering why God hadn’t blessed here with that gift she felt she needed. I told her I didn’t think God meant for everyone to have it. So we did not agree on all things but what we had in common was very much more.

I learned this: “No place is God forsaken”! So I challenge you to ask God to show you Christians where you are, and then wait. He will act. I do think that particularly in places with such darkness as you describe, He puts some very bright lights.

*Is there ever a Daily Mass or Eucharistic Adoration at the campus Newman Center? If you go there, you will likely find the devout Catholics in your midst!

 

[FidesSpesCarita]

I think you’re completely eliminating the role of context in scripture. The footnotes in my New American Bible even say, regarding Matthew 7:1, “This is not a prohibition against recognizing the faults of others, which would be hardly compatible with vv 5 and 6.”

And I wasn’t saying that my sins were any less serious. That does not prohibit me from recognizing what is evil and what is not. I’m sorry but I don’t agree with such a fundamentalist interpretation of this. You offer good advice nonetheless (And with that I just made a judgement).

This is a good way to be. We MUST judge the actions of others as best we can, just read the letters of Paul and how often he said something like “You are sinning!! Now cut the poo and return to Christ.” It is important that these people have a witness to what the faith is, teaches and can work within a person. But also remember the verse Matthew 7:3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother’s eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?”

The best advice I can give you is to be an exemplar of the love which Christ bore epitomized in the Fulton Sheen Quote

Christian love bears evil, but it does not tolerate it.
It does penance for the sins of others, but it is not broadminded about sin.
The cry for tolerance never induces it to quench its hatred of the evil philosophies that have entered into contest with the Truth.
It forgives the sinner, and it hates the sin; it is unmerciful to the error in his mind.
The sinner it will always take back into the bosom of the Mystical Body;
but his lie will never be taken into the treasury of His Wisdom.
Real love involves real hatred:
whoever has lost the power of moral indignation and the urge to drive the buyers and sellers from the temples
has also lost a living, fervent love of Truth.
Charity, then, is not a mild philosophy of “live and let live”;
it is not a species of sloppy sentiment.
Charity is the infusion of the Spirit of God,
which makes us love the beautiful and hate the morally ugly.

1 Corinthians 5:11-13 “But actually, I wrote to you not to associate with any so-called brother if he is an immoral person, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or a swindler–not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Do you not judge those who are within the church? But those who are outside, God judges. remove the wicked man from among yourselves.”

^St. Paul here tells people who appear to be in a similar situation as mine not to associate with the such people. Specifically he is talking about members of the Church. God judges those outside of the Church, but we judge those among us.

Matthew 18:15 “If your brother sins, go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you, so that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every fact may be confirmed. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.”

^This directly clashes with your approach of dealing with sinners.

Matthew 7:1 is merely a condemnation of hypocrisy. It’s not a blanket statement over judgement the way many people think. More often than not it’s used by non-Christians to silence Christians from speaking out against issues of morality. But you must use context.

Finally,

John 7:24 “Judge not according to the appearance: but judge just judgement.”

What I meant by the fundamentalist remark was that it seemed like you focused on the literal value of one verse without considering the overall context. Judgement is a necessity for being not only a good Christian, but for being a successful human being. I apologize that I could not find any verses shedding light onto the “love the sinner, hate the sin” idea on a quick skim, but I’m pretty sure they’re there. Not only was I thought it in high school theology, but the priest at my church gave a similarly themed homily not too long ago. Catholics are to judge wicked acts as wicked. What we are not to do is judge the state of one’s soul.

There is a book that I read not too long ago that dealt with Catholic issues in the modern world that one of my old priest’s gave to me that was really good. It was titled Catholicism, I can’t remember who wrote it and am in a hurry so maybe I’ll get back to you later on that.

Wonderful exegesis, you are obviously well versed in your faith. Keep that up. And keep your faith in Christ and His ability to work conversion through you.

Also, Alanfromwichita’s statement that “In this world, there must either be no sin, or we must not be able to detect it” makes me feel that, perhaps, he has absorbed a bit too much from the new age movement. In this world there IS sin and it is our duty to fight that sin and assist, as best we are able, Christ in His work of redeeming the world. Just remember that you MUST maintain the attitude of Caritas in veritate, love in truth. You must first LOVE them or they will take any reprimand or correction as a “fundie” diatribe leveled against them and begin to fight you. That is one point where Alanfromwichita is absolutely correct. How you address the issue can be as important as the issue itself in bringing that person to a correct understanding of the truth and to a miraculous conversion (or reversion) to Christ.

FSC

 

[crystal_waters]

I’m very angry. It’s 1:20 AM and outside of my building I hear drunk kids frolicking in their own stupidity. My room mates all got drunk earlier this evening and thankfully left. Unfortunately they left their God-awful rap music playing, and the reason they left was to get more drunk and “hook-up” with women. This place is like hell and I feel beyond isolated. I refuse to partake in the progressive cultural filth that goes on here. I go to a somewhat prestigious University and am pursuing a career in science and dentistry. The cultural idiocy that takes place here is incredibly distracting. Whether it’s the vast encouragement of sexual promiscuity, indulgence, or secularism, there is always some sort of campus event that any Christian should vehemently object. But there is absolutely no human being on this God forsaken campus that has the courage to live their convictions. None. Everyone on campus fits neatly into 1 of 2 categories. Either they partake in whatever they can to make themselves feel pleasured (hedonists), or they don’t partake themselves but possess the post-modern attitude that such actions are acceptable and not contrary to morality. American Universities are pure evil, that’s what I’ve learned these past 2 years. I feel very very very angry. I’ve never felt so alone.

are you paying to live on campus? if so cant you get your money back and arrange alternate accomodation? it may cost a little more and you may have to get an evening/weekend job but it would solve your problem…you would not have to put up with that again!

 

[Monica4316]

I’m very angry. It’s 1:20 AM and outside of my building I hear drunk kids frolicking in their own stupidity. My room mates all got drunk earlier this evening and thankfully left. Unfortunately they left their God-awful rap music playing, and the reason they left was to get more drunk and “hook-up” with women. This place is like hell and I feel beyond isolated. I refuse to partake in the progressive cultural filth that goes on here. I go to a somewhat prestigious University and am pursuing a career in science and dentistry. The cultural idiocy that takes place here is incredibly distracting. Whether it’s the vast encouragement of sexual promiscuity, indulgence, or secularism, there is always some sort of campus event that any Christian should vehemently object. But there is absolutely no human being on this God forsaken campus that has the courage to live their convictions. None. Everyone on campus fits neatly into 1 of 2 categories. Either they partake in whatever they can to make themselves feel pleasured (hedonists), or they don’t partake themselves but possess the post-modern attitude that such actions are acceptable and not contrary to morality. American Universities are pure evil, that’s what I’ve learned these past 2 years. I feel very very very angry. I’ve never felt so alone.

I know what you mean does your campus have a Catholic group or anything of that sort?

 

[quiet52]

I would like to offer two suggestions to the OP:

Consider that there might be other students who, like you, are sitting in their dorm rooms feeling isolated, wishing they could find other people who share their moral values. Pray for them, that they won’t feel overwhelmed with discouragement, disgust and anger.

Reserve a library room or some other place on campus for Friday evenings, say 7:30 to 9:00, and then consistently advertise Catholic Bible study. If you’re the only person who shows up, you won’t have wasted your time – you can do the Bible study alone. But you might be surprised!

I know it has been a few weeks since you posted your comments. I hope things are looking up for you. But in the meantme, keep “looking up” yourself, and know that some of us are looking up also, in prayer for you.

 

[Holly3278]

This would also make me angry. Perhaps you should respond with prayer?

 

[Luigi_Daniele]

OP is banned

 

[on_eagles_wingz]

OP is banned

His old account was banned because of the name, but he is back here with a new account, “CollegeStinks”. I don’t know why they didn’t just change his name.

 

[John655]

I sympathize with you - the lifestyle you’re describing is very difficult to watch. When an earlier post mentioned about judging - I’ve always been taught that we can discern (judge) people’s actions, but not their motivations.

While I respect the suggestions of the others who want you to be a light in the darkness, is it possible that the prestigious University isn’t the place for you? I always do my best thinking in front of the Blessed Sacrament. When the drunken debauchery begins, maybe you could go to the peace and tranquility of the chapel in a Catholic Church, and spend some time in prayer before the Blessed Sacrament. Ask the Lord what He would have you do. If the Lord wants you to stay there, He will give you the strength you need - if you lean on Him. If the Lord does not want you there, He will help you to see a new path.

Some prestigious universities have great intelligence, but little true wisdom. Put this in the gentle hands of the Lord. May the Lord grant us peace in our day.