I have a friend who is a Catholic and Spirit and the same time

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As we were talking, she told me that she participates in Spiritism since she was a child and her mother used to receive spirits from another world. She also told me that in Brasil, spiritism and the CC work together as many Catholics are participating in Spiritism. I also know other Catholics from Brasil that are also involved with spiritism religion.

What is the Church’s teachings on this?
 
QUOTE=wisdomseeker;8595009]hummm… i have some Catholics on spirituality forum saying it is perfectly fine to consult with them. i wonder how they come up with this.

Santeria and Catholicism/ Voodoo and Catholicism - all wrong.

I know someone who is a “counselor”, which means she is some sort of Catholic voodoo practitioner. She has a botanica if you know what that is (if you don’t see below). It’s a store where they sell herbs, potions, statues of the Saints, and usually there is a room in the back where you can see someone about doing some spells for you.

People pay her and she reads cards and make little amulets for them. If a woman says her husband is cheating she tells her to bring her one of his underwear and she does her magic.

She also deals with spirits.

When I confronted her she said she goes to mass every day and the spirits are nothing but Saints. 😦

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/8716/botanica.jpg
 
QUOTE=wisdomseeker;8595009]hummm… i have some Catholics on spirituality forum saying it is perfectly fine to consult with them. i wonder how they come up with this.
Santeria and Catholicism/ Voodoo and Catholicism - all wrong.

I know someone who is a “counselor”, which means she is some sort of Catholic voodoo practitioner. She has a botanica if you know what that is (if you don’t see below).

People pay her and she reads cards and make little amulets for them. If a woman says her husband is cheating she tells her to bring her one of his underwear and she does her magic.

She also deals with spirits.

When I confronted her she said she goes to mass every day and the spirits are nothing but Saints. 😦

http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/8716/botanica.jpg

Yes, and priests dont seem to speak against none of it. i wonder why.
 
hummm… i have some Catholics on spirituality forum saying it is perfectly fine to consult with them. i wonder how they come up with this.
They probably think it is OK. Spiritism was very popular in the mid to late 1800’s and the Church issued various documents condemning the practice. For example from New Advent:

As Spiritism has been closely allied with the practices of “animal magnetism” and hypnotism, these several classes of phenomena have also been treated under the same general head in the discussions of theologians and in the decisions of ecclesiastical authority. The Congregation of the Inquisition, 25 June, 1840, decreed:

Where all error, sorcery, and invocation of the demon, implicit or explicit, is excluded, the mere use of physical means which are otherwise lawful, is not morally forbidden, provided it does not aim at unlawful or evil results. But the application of purely physical principles and means to things or effects that are really supernatural, in order to explain these on physical grounds, is nothing else than unlawful and heretical deception.
This decision was reiterated on 28 July, 1847, and a further decree was issued on 30 July, 1856, which, after mentioning discourses about religion, evocation of departed spirits and “other superstitious practices” of Spiritism, exhorts the bishops to put forth every effort for the suppression of these abuses “in order that the flock of the Lord may be protected against the enemy, the deposit of faith safeguarded, and the faithful preserved from moral corruption”. The Second Plenary Council of Baltimore (1866), while making due allowance for fraudulent practice in Spiritism, declares that some at least of the manifestations are to be ascribed to Satanic intervention, and warns the faithful against lending any support to Spiritism or even, out of curiosity, attending séances (Decreta, nn. 33-41). The council points out, in particular, the anti-Christian character of Spiritistic teachings concerning religion, and characterizes them as an attempt to revive paganism and magic. A decree of the Holy Office, 30 March, 1898, condemns Spiritistic practices, even though intercourse with the demon be excluded and communication sought with good spirits only. In all these documents the distinction is clearly drawn between legitimate scientific investigation and superstitious abuses. What the Church condemns in Spiritism is superstition with its evil consequences for religion and morality.

From the current Catechism of the Catholic Church paragraph 2117
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.

So at least from what I have been able to determine the Church does not support the practice and in fact advises against being affiliated with it.
 
They probably think it is OK. Spiritism was very popular in the mid to late 1800’s and the Church issued various documents condemning the practice. For example from New Advent:

As Spiritism has been closely allied with the practices of “animal magnetism” and hypnotism, these several classes of phenomena have also been treated under the same general head in the discussions of theologians and in the decisions of ecclesiastical authority. The Congregation of the Inquisition, 25 June, 1840, decreed:

Where all error, sorcery, and invocation of the demon, implicit or explicit, is excluded, the mere use of physical means which are otherwise lawful, is not morally forbidden, provided it does not aim at unlawful or evil results. But the application of purely physical principles and means to things or effects that are really supernatural, in order to explain these on physical grounds, is nothing else than unlawful and heretical deception.
This decision was reiterated on 28 July, 1847, and a further decree was issued on 30 July, 1856, which, after mentioning discourses about religion, evocation of departed spirits and “other superstitious practices” of Spiritism, exhorts the bishops to put forth every effort for the suppression of these abuses “in order that the flock of the Lord may be protected against the enemy, the deposit of faith safeguarded, and the faithful preserved from moral corruption”. The Second Plenary Council of Baltimore (1866), while making due allowance for fraudulent practice in Spiritism, declares that some at least of the manifestations are to be ascribed to Satanic intervention, and warns the faithful against lending any support to Spiritism or even, out of curiosity, attending séances (Decreta, nn. 33-41). The council points out, in particular, the anti-Christian character of Spiritistic teachings concerning religion, and characterizes them as an attempt to revive paganism and magic. A decree of the Holy Office, 30 March, 1898, condemns Spiritistic practices, even though intercourse with the demon be excluded and communication sought with good spirits only. In all these documents the distinction is clearly drawn between legitimate scientific investigation and superstitious abuses. What the Church condemns in Spiritism is superstition with its evil consequences for religion and morality.

From the current Catechism of the Catholic Church paragraph 2117
2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.

So at least from what I have been able to determine the Church does not support the practice and in fact advises against being affiliated with it.
I see. i wonder because they dont seem to think that these spirits are from demons but good spirits. she even told me her grandfather who died many many years had come to enter a woman.
 
Satanic. In the truest sense of the word, this is Satanic stuff.

Satan is the master of mixing bad with good and masking the evil with what appears to be good. This is a satanic corruption of the faith. Stay away from it, and instruct your friend.
 
Satanic. In the truest sense of the word, this is Satanic stuff.

Satan is the master of mixing bad with good and masking the evil with what appears to be good. This is a satanic corruption of the faith. Stay away from it, and instruct your friend.
I think is not possible to steer her away from it. she grew up believing and no one is going to change her mind now. her mother received spirits and she would never go against her mother. I wish I could. the CC in brasil is infected with this sort of thing and it has all been accepted by the clergy. therefore i could not even speak against. it has to come from the pulpit.
 
You are right it should come from the pulpit. I bet it has from time to time.

We have to remember though, that if this is imbedded in the culture it may take some time to root out. I would guess that some of the priests grew up with this also, and not that they support it, but they may have more acceptance of the people.

On the other hand, I have run into this kind of thing in my work from time to time. I find it creepy. Well, actually, evil. I hope these people, who may in themselves be pretty innocent, can be weaned away from this corrupting influence.

There is something to be said about becoming comfortable with our powerlessness (don’t let me fool you, scares me deep down!!!) because it increases our reliance on God. When one experiences such powerlessness but is culturally offered something like spiritism which seems to balance the scales a bit, give them some power, the temtation must be very great. Pray for them.
 
You are right it should come from the pulpit. I bet it has from time to time.

We have to remember though, that if this is imbedded in the culture it may take some time to root out. I would guess that some of the priests grew up with this also, and not that they support it, but they may have more acceptance of the people.

On the other hand, I have run into this kind of thing in my work from time to time. I find it creepy. Well, actually, evil. I hope these people, who may in themselves be pretty innocent, can be weaned away from this corrupting influence.

There is something to be said about becoming comfortable with our powerlessness (don’t let me fool you, scares me deep down!!!) because it increases our reliance on God. When one experiences such powerlessness but is culturally offered something like spiritism which seems to balance the scales a bit, give them some power, the temtation must be very great. Pray for them.
yes, exactly. they tend to feel peaceful and they claim these good spirits are able to chase away the bad spirits that surrounds then and they can tell them what is going on in their lives.
 
yes, exactly. they tend to feel peaceful and they claim these good spirits are able to chase away the bad spirits that surrounds then and they can tell them what is going on in their lives.
The devil masquerades as an angel of light.
 
That is not it. voodoo is not the same is spritism. holy father did not say anything about spiritism…
The Pope also included evil spirits in his condemnation. Spiritism is the contacting of said evil spirits.
 
they dont call upon evil spirit they say is good spirit.
What good spirits are those?

The only good spirits are God, angels, and the saints. All good spirits serve God, not man, and are set above man. Humans do not have authority to force angels or saints to do anything because they serve God, not man. If we are trying to tell an angel or saint what to do, and we tell them to do something that is against the will of God, we are trying to impose our will over God’s, which is a sin against the First Commandment. The right way to beseech an angel or saint is through prayer. Because humans have no authority over good spirits presently (although we will judge angels at the end of time), any attempt to conjure up an angel or a saint is going to result in conjuring up something else, and that something else can only be evil.
Catechism of the Catholic Church:
2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.

2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future. Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.

2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.
That last paragraph is directed against botanistas, yerberias and all the other syncretistic “healers.”
 
What good spirits are those?

The only good spirits are God, angels, and the saints. All good spirits serve God, not man, and are set above man. Humans do not have authority to force angels or saints to do anything because they serve God, not man. If we are trying to tell an angel or saint what to do, and we tell them to do something that is against the will of God, we are trying to impose our will over God’s, which is a sin against the First Commandment. The right way to beseech an angel or saint is through prayer. Because humans have no authority over good spirits presently (although we will judge angels at the end of time), any attempt to conjure up an angel or a saint is going to result in conjuring up something else, and that something else can only be evil.

That last paragraph is directed against botanistas, yerberias and all the other syncretistic “healers.”
Ok, I got it. thank you.
 
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