I have found joy in other people's suffering! Another spiritual expression of my deep anxiety

[Domiy]

I’m so confused about this. On one level I feel horrible, but it makes me feel so much better.

My best friend (married) has found out that he cannot have kids. At first he took it quite well, but he admits that he’s had cycles of anger, regret, sadness, mild depression etc. He’s quite good at masking his pain and finding ways to get it off his mind. But he’s started to open up to me a lot more, engaging in philosophical discussions and pondering deep spiritual thoughts with me. I’ve never seen him like this. And I must say, it’s made me feel somewhat better about my own depression. Maybe it’s because he was always insensitive towards my suffering, or pretended that he always had all the answers and was untouchable. Maybe I was jealous or envied him. Or maybe, seeing someone I can relate to is all I need. Either way, seeing him down, even though he does his best to hide it, makes me feel so calm about myself.

He’s questioning God and his purpose in life the exact same way I’ve done for so long. He tells me that perhaps traditional marriage isn’t the right vocation for him, or that he and his wife would be better off living as missionaries, even though that is so far from what they want. He doesn’t want it. He wants kids, and a life of marriage and fatherhood like he’s always planned. Nothing can ever replace that desire, because it’s his desire. I know because no matter how many alternative windows God opens for me me, I still want what I want, and what I’ve always wanted.

He also tells me that none of the traditional ‘God has a purpose’ motivations work for him. This is how hurt he is; I asked him how he would feel if he knew that one day, he could save someones life because of his current suffering. His response was that it wouldn’t really make him feel that much better, because a life saved does not compensate for multiple lives he could’ve created himself having kids. I call this justifying your refusal of God’s will, again something I’m very familiar with.

So we both find ourselves questioning God’s will and purpose for our lives, feeling as if God does not agree with our desires. As I said, simply seeing him suffer really helps me. He and his wife are both starting to further understand what walking with God is truly about. It’s not a simple matter of ‘do good, pray, and you’ll live happily ever after on earth’. I can’t help but feel this is the way they always thought things were, because they’re so used to having everything fall so perfectly in place for them. Dare I say, walking with God and living happy can be two very different things. God will not always give us what we want, and we must learn to live with what He feels is our best path to salvation. Sure, an eternity of unspeakable glory awaits us, but being promised something intangible that we cannot even begin to understand is always tough. Walking with God is about trusting that Heaven will be worth the lifetime of suffering you’ve endured to reach it. This is never easy.

It doesn’t matter who’s suffering is worse, I personally think that everyone has their own way of interpreting the discrepency between what they want and what they get. At the end of the day, neither of us have what we want, and it looks likely that we will never have it, because God has spoken.

This is the first time I’ve ever really seen someone close to me suffer. Perhaps I was just frusrated at living so long in depression while all those around me strolled through happily, never paying attention or compassion towards me. Now I feel like I can relate to someone. Then it hit me; my best friend is my Simon of Cyrene - a helper who has been tasked with carrying some of the world’s grief with me, because I could no longer carry it all on my own. God has yet to answer my prayers, but at least He has heard my cry. While I walk the road of salvation, with all those around me turning a blind eye or mocking me even more, I have been lent a helping pair of shoulders. I can only imagine how Jesus felt, seeing one of his beloved brethren forced to suffer for his sake. Was he possibly conflicted in admitting that his walk to the top was made much easier due to someone else’s suffering, and that he found comfort and rest on Simon’s shoulders? Even after being given a helping hand, he couldn’t help but cry out to God, thinking he had been forsaken! I guess this shows how much suffering can hurt us.

So, can anyone here relate to any of this? Am I perhaps just a cynic or a saddist in my view on the world, or am I just not carrying my Cross as well as Jesus carried His?

 

[anonymous_in_fl]

I certainly hope you are not finding joy in other people’s suffering---- that is quite sadistic.

I hope what you are gaining is the ability to offer up your own sufferings, and to be of assitance to others by sharing in bearing their burdens through mutual prayer and emotional support.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

There is a German word with no English equivalent Schadenfreude so we just borrow it. From two different sources:

noun

• pleasure derived by someone from another person’s misfortune.
• enjoyment obtained from the troubles of others

So if it’s like, “oh boy it is fun to see him taken down a notch. Now maybe his little comfortable life doesn’t seem all that superior to the rest of us, huh?” that indicates you want to see him react to a little pain. You have judged and want to punish. But on the other hand, it also brings you together in your stories so at best it can help you relate to each other. He gets a taste of what you live with, and you see how he reacts when it happens – so it can also be unifying, and increase empathy and who knows what that can lead to.

So I wouldn’t judge it so much, but if you are savoring pain one time I imagined an adversary having to answer to God for something and imagined him stammering and suddenly I felt compassion for him. So like imagining him in a very terrible situation and see if that little smile comes off his face, and it may not only satisfy, but mortify the need to see him suffer. Mortify would be a good thing. Or not; individual results may vary.

But it if helps you understand each other, allow that to see him in a kinder, gentler way.

And I don’t know if you really wanted to see him suffer, but that you wanted him to “come to your level” and that involved some pain that reminds you of pain you’ve had, but if you think that it has made you better than it could actually give the sensation that you are wishing pain upon others. Because it can benefit them in the same way it has helped you. So it may be a counterintuitive version of the Golden Rule. Would you put a soldier in a battle without letting him run the obstacle course? Same way with spiritual warfare; purification by fire as gold.

That said, sometimes if it’s a good friend with a sense of humor, if they do something dumb that they usually make fun of me for doing, that can be worth a laugh or two.

 

[coco2]

I believe that the devil can invade your thoughts and place the thought that you are happy at another person’s misfortune. I’ve had this happen to me. I don’t freak too much about it, (anymore) because it is completely a false thought. I’m not like that in any way in my everyday life, so I know when it comes, it isn’t from me, and certainly not from God. I just let it go out of my mind, then I’m able to feel my own thoughts. Also, pray to St. Michael to defend you in battle.

 

[Mystical_Seeker]

I believe that the devil can invade your thoughts and place the thought that you are happy at another person’s misfortune. I’ve had this happen to me. I don’t freak too much about it, (anymore) because it is completely a false thought. I’m not like that in any way in my everyday life, so I know when it comes, it isn’t from me, and certainly not from God. I just let it go out of my mind, then I’m able to feel my own thoughts. Also, pray to St. Michael to defend you in battle.

I like that you let it go and don’t fight it. False thoughts can’t hurt us unless we let them, especially if we don’t realize that we have a choice.

 

[Vic_Taltrees_UK]

Sounds a bit like empathy to me, but I could be wrong!

God will open your eyes to more and more people’s suffering all around you.

It’s queer, being sad and joyful at the same time.

You don’t appear to have joy “at” their suffering, if I follow your explanation correctly.

 

[Trident_H]

I think this depends on if this is a common thing for you or just a one-off. I mean if you’re delighted to watch the news then maybe you’ve got an issue. But if it’s more about this one guy finally getting a bit humbled. A bit schooled in the lessons of where you’re at. Handed a heaping plate of understanding. Well then that sounds pretty understandable. I mean it’s not an optimal. But it does have a reasonable explanation.

Because now you guys have a connection. Now you guys are on the level. And now, for once you can show him some compassion. And man. Being in the position to finally dole out sympathy after you’ve had it served on you for so long has got to feel genuinely good. I mean for once you can return some favors here. For once you can make your own problems recede because your able to trivialize your own pain for ONCE. To make it subordinate to someone else’s. So yeah. That could become a bit of a craving for sure. Nothing unusual there.

So I’d suggest you just channel this into a positive. And show him true caring concern. And true compassion. And if he turns to you and wonders aloud what purpose his suffering could possibly have you could honestly answer him that it’s finally given you an opportunity to be compassionate. Instead of always being focused on yourself. And your own pain.

So yeah. You’ve got some good intuition in this already. I’m just supporting the right side of that.

Peace.

-Trident

 

[multitude]

I certainly hope you are not finding joy in other people’s suffering---- that is quite sadistic.

Yup. Sorry but I doubt that is empathy. It is false compassion. That’s how the Cain vs. Abel, Esau vs. Jacob types of relationships start. And I know who were favored in the end. Though Cain and Esau persecuted their younger brothers, and though Jacob may have been less than honest, God took Abel’s side, and Isaac took Jacob’s side.

In the end, I’ve experienced stuff like this before, but on the other end. And I’d rather not have your false compassion, you can keep it.

 

[nimbus123]

Dear Domiy, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt, since you are devoting quite a bit of introspection to this issue.

I believe, based on personal experience, that what you truly crave is empathy and understanding for your situation in life. You mentioned this is the first time anybody had empathy for you. I am sorry.

As an example, my husband and I have had to struggle financially in the last 10 yrs, not due to our fault, but due to the current economic situation. I associate with sometimes very well to do ppl. It is hard sometimes to not let a desire for “schadenfreude” rear its head. A woman I know was speaking with me recently, who was doing very well for herself and was talking extensively about it. A desire for schadenfreude was inadvertently stirring within me. But THEN, she started talking about how much she empathizes with ppl who’ve been getting the short end of the stick in this country, how wrong it is, how wrong it is for the country, etc. etc. Any shred of envy on my part vanished immediately.

All I wanted was understanding for my situation! All I wanted was empathy! I did not want bad things to happen to other ppl! I don’t have a problem with ppl doing better than I, per se!

And so, I think it is with you.

I think what you can take away from all this, is that in our world, there are very, very few ppl who have true empathy and care in their hearts. I am so sad for you that you have encountered this so rarely. But in truth, it is in reality a very rare thing. Recognize this about other ppl, it is the way they are. Turn now to God and let Him turn this into wisdom, and use this wisdom to GIVE to other ppl the empathy you wish they would give you.

I wish you well.

 

[Rosarydevotion]

Dear Domiy, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt, since you are devoting quite a bit of introspection to this issue.

I believe, based on personal experience, that what you truly crave is empathy and understanding for your situation in life. You mentioned this is the first time anybody had empathy for you. I am sorry.

As an example, my husband and I have had to struggle financially in the last 10 yrs, not due to our fault, but due to the current economic situation. I associate with sometimes very well to do ppl. It is hard sometimes to not let a desire for “schadenfreude” rear its head. A woman I know was speaking with me recently, who was doing very well for herself and was talking extensively about it. A desire for schadenfreude was inadvertently stirring within me. But THEN, she started talking about how much she empathizes with ppl who’ve been getting the short end of the stick in this country, how wrong it is, how wrong it is for the country, etc. etc. Any shred of envy on my part vanished immediately.

All I wanted was understanding for my situation! All I wanted was empathy! I did not want bad things to happen to other ppl! I don’t have a problem with ppl doing better than I, per se!

And so, I think it is with you.

I think what you can take away from all this, is that in our world, there are very, very few ppl who have true empathy and care in their hearts. I am so sad for you that you have encountered this so rarely. But in truth, it is in reality a very rare thing. Recognize this about other ppl, it is the way they are. Turn now to God and let Him turn this into wisdom, and use this wisdom to GIVE to other ppl the empathy you wish they would give you.

I wish you well.

This is a beautiful post.

 

[Domiy]

Dear Domiy, I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt, since you are devoting quite a bit of introspection to this issue.

I believe, based on personal experience, that what you truly crave is empathy and understanding for your situation in life. You mentioned this is the first time anybody had empathy for you. I am sorry.

As an example, my husband and I have had to struggle financially in the last 10 yrs, not due to our fault, but due to the current economic situation. I associate with sometimes very well to do ppl. It is hard sometimes to not let a desire for “schadenfreude” rear its head. A woman I know was speaking with me recently, who was doing very well for herself and was talking extensively about it. A desire for schadenfreude was inadvertently stirring within me. But THEN, she started talking about how much she empathizes with ppl who’ve been getting the short end of the stick in this country, how wrong it is, how wrong it is for the country, etc. etc. Any shred of envy on my part vanished immediately.

All I wanted was understanding for my situation! All I wanted was empathy! I did not want bad things to happen to other ppl! I don’t have a problem with ppl doing better than I, per se!

And so, I think it is with you.

I think what you can take away from all this, is that in our world, there are very, very few ppl who have true empathy and care in their hearts. I am so sad for you that you have encountered this so rarely. But in truth, it is in reality a very rare thing. Recognize this about other ppl, it is the way they are. Turn now to God and let Him turn this into wisdom, and use this wisdom to GIVE to other ppl the empathy you wish they would give you.

I wish you well.

You’ve made a good analysis, something perhaps I never even noticed myself. I think true empathy was all I ever wanted. Sadly, as you say, it is extremely rare, even in my own family/friend cycle. My parents do their best, but it’s usually just a typical “things will get better, so man up and move on” type of thing. I’m a huge believer of tough love but as you said, one longs to be understood! Compassion is one thing, but to actually understand and relate to the person is another.

My friend doesn’t really offer me any compassion on his own accord. All comfort I find in him is completely unintentional on his part. Just by speaking with him I can see how things have changed for him, how he’ll probably never be fully at peace with his burden, but how his life will revolve around dealing with it. It’s caused a pretty big lifestyle change as well, as he now deeply regrets his past habits which could’ve led to his infertility.

I hope as much as anyone else things change for him, but as I say, “gotta play with the deck you’re given”.