I just don't get it....

[VeritasLuxMea]

I feel like so many of these responses were uncharitable.

It’s not fair to peg a man as a “sex addict” because he wants to have sex with his wife.

It also looks like, given the way he’s describing it, he’s doing his best to resist temptation in these tough times. Which is as it should be.

So, here we have a couple that is trying to practice NFP and is struggling. I don’t know what the answer is, but I’m sure it involves more support and less shaming for what very well may be a normal desire.

 

[Calliso]

I feel like so many of these responses were uncharitable.

It’s not fair to peg a man as a “sex addict” because he wants to have sex with his wife.

It also looks like, given the way he’s describing it, he’s doing his best to resist temptation in these tough times. Which is as it should be.

So, here we have a couple that is trying to practice NFP and is struggling. I don’t know what the answer is, but I’m sure it involves more support and less shaming for what very well may be a normal desire.

Yep exactly he isn;t some sex addict because he gets irritable when he isn;t able to have sex with his wife. And you know for some people waiting 10 days might not be a big deal but for some people it is. And I should also point out since it has been brought up that there is a big difference between a situation where one spouse physicall can;t have sex due to illness or injury and two perfectly healthy spouses who can;t have sex because they can;t have another baby at the moment and since their religon says no contraception they are basically left with abstaining. But this reallly highlights once again the problems with over selling nfp. Sure some find that the period of abstaining brings each other closer others like the OP find that it just brings frustration. And people shouldn;t jump all over and judge those that struggle with nfp sorry its not a cake walk for everyone.

 

[Moore11]

This thread is a great example of the poor marketing of NFP. NFP is dang hard for most couples. Including my wife and me. We took all the classes 3 times and every time all they tell you is how awesome it is and how easy it is. they tell you that you may only have to abstain 5 days a month. That you will find other ways to be close. But for many it is a hard, scary frustrating battle. Most things that are holy are that way. ABC is the wrong and easy way out and NFP is not as alluring as the “wide path.” We struggled for years with it and the reason many strong marriages practice NFP is because weak ones cannot. My wife and I became irritable as do our good friends. Recently, we got rid of NFP entirerly. Realizing that we had begun to use it with a “birth control” mindset. Our relationship has improved immensly.
my advice:

1. get it out of your head that it is as easy as ABC.
2. Find a NFP couple who has real struggles like you and talk with them. CCL will have some good contact couples. Dont just talk to the instructors, meet with real people who learn it and struggle with it.
3. I have no idea what your situation is but if you have used ABC for a long time and now are using NFP it may be time to discern the vocation to truly be open to life.
4. Realize that the reason it is so hard is because her body and yours are giving each other signals and also are physically wanting to. “red light time” is the best time.
5. Invest in something like the ladycomp which starts off conservative but then really opens up once it “learns” your cycles.
6. We had to institute a rule no rubbing or being naked in front of each other during red light time.
7. Most important, dont give up and dont listen to those who dont think you should be having a hard time with this. Use it to better yourself and your marriage but dont feel bad because you dont wake up next to your wife in the morning all happy because you cant have sex.

PS Two of our CCL instructing couples are now divorced and the other one has trouble concieving which makes them not quite so understanding of those of us that are fertile myrtles. It just got to the point that another child was less of a stress than us continuing NFP.

 

[Calliso]

This thread is a great example of the poor marketing of NFP. NFP is dang hard for most couples. Including my wife and me. We took all the classes 3 times and every time all they tell you is how awesome it is and how easy it is. they tell you that you may only have to abstain 5 days a month. That you will find other ways to be close. But for many it is a hard, scary frustrating battle. Most things that are holy are that way. ABC is the wrong and easy way out and NFP is not as alluring as the “wide path.” We struggled for years with it and the reason many strong marriages practice NFP is because weak ones cannot. My wife and I became irritable as do our good friends. Recently, we got rid of NFP entirerly. Realizing that we had begun to use it with a “birth control” mindset. Our relationship has improved immensly.
my advice:

1. get it out of your head that it is as easy as ABC.
2. Find a NFP couple who has real struggles like you and talk with them. CCL will have some good contact couples. Dont just talk to the instructors, meet with real people who learn it and struggle with it.
3. I have no idea what your situation is but if you have used ABC for a long time and now are using NFP it may be time to discern the vocation to truly be open to life.
4. Realize that the reason it is so hard is because her body and yours are giving each other signals and also are physically wanting to. “red light time” is the best time.
5. Invest in something like the ladycomp which starts off conservative but then really opens up once it “learns” your cycles.
6. We had to institute a rule no rubbing or being naked in front of each other during red light time.
7. Most important, dont give up and dont listen to those who dont think you should be having a hard time with this. Use it to better yourself and your marriage but dont feel bad because you dont wake up next to your wife in the morning all happy because you cant have sex.

PS Two of our CCL instructing couples are now divorced and the other one has trouble concieving which makes them not quite so understanding of those of us that are fertile myrtles. It just got to the point that another child was less of a stress than us continuing NFP.

Great post I think this is what the OP needed. Really helpful non judgemental advice.

 

[etmom]

Our youngest will be 10 soon and my wife doesn’t want kids so far apart…so I guess we’re done(I’d like more maybe our struggles will open that door).

As someone who has large age gaps between children, I’d like to encourage you to not let that stop you. We have had to postpone children for serious reasons at points during our marriage, but returned to being open to life when the circumstances resolved. Our oldest is 25, our youngest is 2. There is a 13 year age gap between our 2nd and 3rd child. 2 years between number 3 and 4, then 7.5 years between number 4 and 5, 17 months between number 5 and number 6.

Our children all have a very unique relationship with each other, the younger ones have brought so much love and joy to the older ones, the little ones have such strong role models from their older siblings. We are truely blessed! I’m glad we didn’t rule out future children due to the large gaps between some of our children.

There were times in our marriage where it looked almost certainly like we were “done”, we could not imagine the circumstances changing and it would have been easy to close ourselves off from being open to life. One of the advantages of NFP is there are no permenent decisions, nothing that could have an adverse affect on fertility in the future.

As for the difficulty, it can be quite a struggle. It will most likely get easier than it is for you now, but we find the periods of abstainance (which are increasing in length due to cycle irregularities as I age) are very challenging, especially when the length can’t be predicted with any regularity. Following NFP into perimenopause is certainly a roller coaster and difficult. NFP is quite frequently oversold, the difficulties glossed over, and when couples find themselves struggling, they are simply made to feel like they are not faithful enough, need a stronger prayer life, or they shouldn’t be using NFP to begin with. It is a discipline, and it can take time to adjust to. We find it to be worth it, and it has made our relationship stronger over time. But I still don’t find it very easy.

There was another post about NFP recently, and a poster said that their prolife, NFP teaching OB/GYN referred to it as “sacrificial family planning”. I feel that describes it very accurately. It is a sacrifice, it is not easy. But for those of us who truely need to postpone, perhaps indefinitely, another child, it enables us not to have to have to abstain indefinitely. And it does really make you evaluate, each and every month, the reasons you are postponing which is a very good thing!

 

[The_Bucket]

I feel like so many of these responses were uncharitable.

It’s not fair to peg a man as a “sex addict” because he wants to have sex with his wife.

It also looks like, given the way he’s describing it, he’s doing his best to resist temptation in these tough times. Which is as it should be.

So, here we have a couple that is trying to practice NFP and is struggling. I don’t know what the answer is, but I’m sure it involves more support and less shaming for what very well may be a normal desire.

And I daresay this can apply to a married couple who were indeed chaste until marriage as my wife and I were. I think it’s best to sell NFP as something that is indeed a struggle but that as Catholics we are all called to struggle to attain the perfection that is Christ. I don’t know that it makes intimacy better at all, though the “reuniting” after a time apart is certainly good, but with the right mindset it can be very good for improving self-control and discipline of both spouses.

The truth is that abstaining while in a marriage is infinitely harder than before marriage. At least to me. Because there is absolutely nothing morally wrong with sex between spouses. The barrier of knowing that I’d be committing sin and bringing a woman I loved into that sin as well if I tried something before marriage was quite strong. I’d never want to hurt her like that! Abstaining after that barrier is removed? Quite difficult indeed.

One should also not assume that it’s “just a week or 10 days” either. In cases of variable cycles, the fertile period can be quite difficult to decipher when trying to take an even somewhat conservative approach. My wife’s cycles can be as short as 33 days or as long as 49 days. So there are plenty of times where you push that 7-10 day window to more like 15-20 days. Not. Fun. At. All.

 

[Luvz2travel]

You story is one of the reasons I think NPF is a bad idea.

 

[Rita77]

You story is one of the reasons I think NPF is a bad idea.

NFP is a natural unlike contraception artificial hormones, spermicide (chemical) condoms etc, and there is always the side effects of sterilization like loss of sexual function (that kinda defeats the purpose).

NFP is a moral option that helps us get to heaven. Trusting God with your fertility is very rewarding even if that means avoiding pregnancy, because you’re working with your body, nature and God. Congratulations op switching to NFP is a huge step towards being more open to life, being more natural, and more trusting in your faith in God.

**NFP is like exercising its hard but it’s a natural way that’s good for our bodies and our souls. **

“Birth Control and Christian Discipleship” by John Kippley is a short 60 pages and only $5 and is a great read on the subject.
Nfpandmore.org had really great info too.

 

[dailey]

You story is one of the reasons I think NPF is a bad idea.

This comment makes absolutely no sense.

So we are to put our souls in jeopardy simply because we do not want to be inconvenienced or irritable?

 

[Moore11]

This comment makes absolutely no sense.

So we are to put our souls in jeopardy simply because we do not want to be inconvenienced or irritable?

I dont know if the poster was talking about putting souls in jeopardy. I chose to take it as it is a bad idea in that it may not be what we were designed to do so therefore it is a hard (bad) idea.
NFP is a compromise given to us by the Church and God. Even the OP himself has alluded to the fact that NFP is being used as a way to not have ANY more children because of the 10 year difference there would be.

NFP in many cases (including mine) is a bad idea because it can be used with just as much sinfulness as ABC. NFP, when used this way, is hard because it is against what nature may be telling you. NFP for serious reasons or reasonable spacing is a wonderful Godsend. My wife and I thought NFP was a bad idea and are not going to use it anymore. But dont jump to the conclusion that we would contracept or abstain. NFP will never be a solution to a society that thinks everyone should only have 2 kids.

 

[dailey]

I dont know if the poster was talking about putting souls in jeopardy. I chose to take it as it is a bad idea in that it may not be what we were designed to do so therefore it is a hard (bad) idea.
NFP is a compromise given to us by the Church and God. Even the OP himself has alluded to the fact that NFP is being used as a way to not have ANY more children because of the 10 year difference there would be.

NFP in many cases (including mine) is a bad idea because it can be used with just as much sinfulness as ABC. NFP, when used this way, is hard because it is against what nature may be telling you. NFP for serious reasons or reasonable spacing is a wonderful Godsend. My wife and I thought NFP was a bad idea and are not going to use it anymore. But dont jump to the conclusion that we would contracept or abstain. NFP will never be a solution to a society that thinks everyone should only have 2 kids.

I see what you’re saying. Yes, NFP can be sinful too. My husband and I used it but I consulted with my priest first.

 

[tafan]

I feel like so many of these responses were uncharitable.

It’s not fair to peg a man as a “sex addict” because he wants to have sex with his wife.

It also looks like, given the way he’s describing it, he’s doing his best to resist temptation in these tough times. Which is as it should be.

So, here we have a couple that is trying to practice NFP and is struggling. I don’t know what the answer is, but I’m sure it involves more support and less shaming for what very well may be a normal desire.

I agree with this. Lets give him credit for accepting that ABC is wrong. Let us also admit that the abstinence periods of NFP are difficult for many couples, and this is very understandble since it is not the “natural” state of married life, despite its name. (Flame retardant on)

 

[Rita77]

I agree with this. Lets give him credit for accepting that ABC is wrong. Let us also admit that the abstinence periods of NFP are difficult for many couples, and this is very understandble since it is not the “natural” state of married life, despite its name. (Flame retardant on)

WHAT!!! natural state of married life includes times of abstinence like in sickness or first six weeks post partum etc. what’s not natural about nfp there is no artificial hormones, spermicide, rubber, or surgery to change a perfectly functioning body part into a none functioning one (sterilization).

 

[SummerSmiles]

My wife and I started using NFP again a couple months ago after using abc for the last ten years. We gave up on it ten years ago because I had such a hard time with abstinence. I read post on this forum and others, blogs and talking to other couples about NFP that “it’s the greatest thing for a marriage” “NFP makes us so much closer.” Last month was tough…but I prayed a lot and we spent a lot of time talking and going for walks and we plowed through phase 2. I found myself during that time VERY irritable…angry, depressed(I’ve had bouts of depression throughout my life) sleepless… This month I feel the same way like we’re just trudging along trying to get through. My wife feels like she’s walking on eggshells and I feel like in order to get through phase 2 I have to stay away from my wife. I just don’t get it…does this stop? What do I need to do differently to be one of those people that thinks NFP is the greatest thing since sliced bread? There is a certain amount of resentment (not sure if thats the way to put it) that I feel when my wife tries to get close but I know love making is a week away. I’ve never felt angry when my wife kissed me before…how can this be a good thing? I’ve always wanted to spend as much time with my wife as possible now I leave the house early, work late and on weekends. When we talk about how we’re feeling or try to be close it ends up in frustration and one or both of us crying (not always but sometimes). The other hang up is I fail to see NFP as “open to life” if using it as a contraceptive. Is the idea that if you’re using it as a contraceptive you’re meant to suffer or give in and have children? I’ve been the advice “pray more”…“spend time together”…“find alternate ways to show love”…I need the how…how do you move past your feelings? Does NFP get easier over time or is it a monthly struggle?

What you’re experiencing sounds pretty normal. You’re basically going from having sex available to you whenever you like to not having it available as much. It’s definitely going to take some adjusting and getting used to.

I’m in the camp that feels that NFP has strengthened my marriage; it’s brought us closer together and it’s helped us treasure the other more. Was it always this way? No. Was it easy to begin with? No. Most good things in life will not be handed to us on a silver platter; they will require serious hard work and sacrifice.

You’ve received some good advice already about focusing on chastity within your marriage. Self-sacrifice is a spiritual muscle that will take time to grow. Don’t expect it to be easy overnight, it does take some time to develop. Focus on shifting the way that you view sex within your marriage. Sex is a beautiful gift to share with your wife; treat it like a gift and not like something that you are entitled to. Praying together will definitely help you. But again, it’s not something that you can pray about tonight and expect everything to be completely resolved in the morning. Give God time to work in your marriage.

You’re right that NFP can be used with a contraceptive mentality. Couples who must use NFP are called to reevaluate every cycle whether they still have a serious reason to avoid. If that serious reason still exists, the abstinence will be easier than if that serious reason does not exist anymore. If there is not a serious reason to avoid a pregnancy, there usually comes a time when the sacrifice of abstaining during the fertile time just gets to be more of a headache/stress than another child. We should always be prayerfully considering if we have a serious reason to avoid a pregnancy. NFP is not an alternative to ABC, it is an alternative to complete abstinence when you feel that you can not accept another pregnancy.

I hope that helps.

 

[tafan]

WHAT!!! natural state of married life includes times of abstinence like in sickness or first six weeks post partum etc. what’s not natural about nfp there is no artificial hormones, spermicide, rubber, or surgery to change a perfectly functioning body part into a none functioning one (sterilization).

Certainly not going to argue with your examples being completely and utterly unnatural. And yes, it is natural for there to be normal periods of abstinence due to examples you listed. But , having a set period of time, every month, with possibly no end in site, where you can’t have sex is NOT natural (but not wanting to compare with your examples at all!!!)

I would even argue it is MORE difficult than the examples you listed, even if one of your examples became a permanent condition. If a spouse, due to illness becomes permanently unable to have sex (or even in the event of death), one has the ability to get accustomed to no sex. Its not a ON/OFF repetitive condition.

NFP is great and wonderful for many couples, I agree. But lets not pretend it is not difficult for many or act like someone is somehow morally flawed or without virtue when it is difficult.

Afterall, there is a reason why a couple must have serious reasons to practice NFP and why BOTH spouses have to agree on these serious reasons. Since we all agree that someone practicing NFP is, by definition, open to life; why does the Church place this requirement on its use? Perhaps because the Church realizes it can be morally challenging to a lot of people? Just speculating.

 

[Moore11]

WHAT!!! natural state of married life includes times of abstinence like in sickness or first six weeks post partum etc. what’s not natural about nfp there is no artificial hormones, spermicide, rubber, or surgery to change a perfectly functioning body part into a none functioning one (sterilization).

Lets not freak out here. What the poster meant was just that we are not designed to govern our marriages by NFP. Some couples may have no other choice for medical or mental needs, others may use it for a time to space but it isn’t the intended norm for marriage as defined by God and his plan. Go forth and multiply never meant go forth and calculate. But since there can be circumstances (grave) that warrant a certain way to use God’s design of our bodies to protect us and our families SOME couples may use NFP.

 

[SummerSmiles]

WHAT!!! natural state of married life includes times of abstinence like in sickness or first six weeks post partum etc. what’s not natural about nfp there is no artificial hormones, spermicide, rubber, or surgery to change a perfectly functioning body part into a none functioning one (sterilization).

I think what tafan meant about it not being the natural state for a marriage is that NFP shouldn’t be the “default” for sex. Marriage is for raising families; the default in marriage is having sex and accepting babies that come from it. There are times when most marriage can not operate in this way, so NFP is available to them to use, even though it is not the ideal. (The ideal being having sex and accepting babies when they come.)

 

[Moore11]

What you’re experiencing sounds pretty normal. You’re basically going from having sex available to you whenever you like to not having it available as much. It’s definitely going to take some adjusting and getting used to.

I’m in the camp that feels that NFP has strengthened my marriage; it’s brought us closer together and it’s helped us treasure the other more. Was it always this way? No. Was it easy to begin with? No. Most good things in life will not be handed to us on a silver platter; they will require serious hard work and sacrifice.

You’ve received some good advice already about focusing on chastity within your marriage. Self-sacrifice is a spiritual muscle that will take time to grow. Don’t expect it to be easy overnight, it does take some time to develop. Focus on shifting the way that you view sex within your marriage. Sex is a beautiful gift to share with your wife; treat it like a gift and not like something that you are entitled to. Praying together will definitely help you. But again, it’s not something that you can pray about tonight and expect everything to be completely resolved in the morning. Give God time to work in your marriage.

You’re right that NFP can be used with a contraceptive mentality. Couples who must use NFP are called to reevaluate every cycle whether they still have a serious reason to avoid. If that serious reason still exists, the abstinence will be easier than if that serious reason does not exist anymore. If there is not a serious reason to avoid a pregnancy, there usually comes a time when the sacrifice of abstaining during the fertile time just gets to be more of a headache/stress than another child. We should always be prayerfully considering if we have a serious reason to avoid a pregnancy. NFP is not an alternative to ABC, it is an alternative to complete abstinence when you feel that you can not accept another pregnancy.

I hope that helps.

Exactly. While our experience with NFP was less harmonizing than yours, It is a valid point that if you have serious reasons then it is easier to abstain. Imagine if you will if a husband knew that his wife would die if she got pregnant. It would be a lot easier to abstain if you knew you could be killing your spouse. If you dont want to have another kid because of a 10 year gap and are basing your decision on some random age difference of the would be siblings then it may be a tad harder to use NFP for the remainder of your fertile time.

 

[tafan]

Thanks for the defense guys (yea, I obviously knew I was getting in hot water when I posted it). On further reflection, I whould rephrase my original post from “this is very understandble since it is not the natural state of married life” to “this is very understandble since it is not the normal state of married life”.

I think we can all agree that NFP is not the norm for how married life should be excercised, but a way that is allowable with serious cause. I know that there are many couples who find themselves, justifyably so, in a state of practicing NFP on a permanent basis. Often times, this is for legitimate for financial purposes. But that does not make it normal, it is simply a reflection on our corrupted economic and social system that families find themselves needing two incomes to support a small number of kids.

 

[Moore11]

Certainly not going to argue with your examples being completely and utterly unnatural. And yes, it is natural for there to be normal periods of abstinence due to examples you listed. But , having a set period of time, every month, with possibly no end in site, where you can’t have sex is NOT natural (but not wanting to compare with your examples at all!!!)

I would even argue it is MORE difficult than the examples you listed, even if one of your examples became a permanent condition. If a spouse, due to illness becomes permanently unable to have sex (or even in the event of death), one has the ability to get accustomed to no sex. Its not a ON/OFF repetitive condition.

NFP is great and wonderful for many couples, I agree. But lets not pretend it is not difficult for many or act like someone is somehow morally flawed or without virtue when it is difficult.

Afterall, there is a reason why a couple must have serious reasons to practice NFP and why BOTH spouses have to agree on these serious reasons. Since we all agree that someone practicing NFP is, by definition, open to life; why does the Church place this requirement on its use? Perhaps because the Church realizes it can be morally challenging to a lot of people? Just speculating.

I dont want to derail the thread here and it could just be the semantic devil in me but I cannot concede that everyone who uses NFP is “open to life” NFP can be used and is sometimes used for just reasons as something that is more closed to creating new life than any barrier method. Used by a knowledgeable person, in its most conservative way with someone who has ideal cycles, NFP is virtually fail proof. No one posts on boards how they are struggling with how to figure out how a condom works. It is NFP that has the fear and uncertainty that comes with trust in God. I know from experience with my wife that she was closed to life way more with NFP after our third than she was when we didnt know better and used ABC.
ABC gets a societal pass when it fails. I know TONS of kids that lived through the war zone of the pill, or the iron curtain of a condom. But somehow when NFP fails (usually through a lack of education or lack of willpower) then it is some how less effective than ABC and gets blamed and not trusted.