I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion

[Solomonson]

I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion via intinction. Rather than hold a ciborium filled with hosts and then dipping them into a chalice of the Precious Blood held by someone else, he held the chalice and the other person handed him the hosts, one by one. In a few cases he picked the host out of the neighboring ciborium. Good way to arrest any dripping of the Precious Blood. It worked out very well.

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

 

[Phemie]

I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion via intinction. Rather than hold a ciborium filled with hosts and then dipping them into a chalice of the Precious Blood held by someone else, he held the chalice and the other person handed him the hosts, one by one. In a few cases he picked the host out of the neighboring ciborium. Good way to arrest any dripping of the Precious Blood. It worked out very well.

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

An ounce of prevention…

 

[peter26]

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

So the fact that they were not used once means they are of limited use?

 

[Chatter163]

Symbolic? I hardly think so. If you could see the particles of the Host on a paten or corporal up close, you might see the value of the paten.

 

[paperwight66]

Symbolic? I hardly think so. If you could see the particles of the Host on a paten or corporal up close, you might see the value of the paten.

I have rarely seen any particles on a ciborium after use, and I don’t see how you see particles on a corporal, because surely, being white, they would not stand out? When would there be altar-breads/Hosts directly on a corporal anyway?

Does your parish use unusually dark altar-breads? The only ones I’ve encountered have been pure white. Or do they crumble easily/ It seems to me tat perhaps a change of supplier is indicated.

 

[FrDavid96]

I have rarely seen any particles on a ciborium after use, and I don’t see how you see particles on a corporal, because surely, being white, they would not stand out? When would there be altar-breads/Hosts directly on a corporal anyway?

Does your parish use unusually dark altar-breads? The only ones I’ve encountered have been pure white. Or do they crumble easily/ It seems to me tat perhaps a change of supplier is indicated.

That is exactly the purpose of the corporal. That’s why it has that name. It is a cloth that hold the body, the corpus. Currently, the paten is between the corporal and the host (consecrated or not), so that does eliminate most of the issues, but still, the notion that some particles might be on the corporal is hardly unusual.

As for the ciborium, yes, there are always particles in a ciborium once it’s been used. Even if it was only used a short time (1 Mass as opposed to being in the tabernacle for a week or more). Depending on who manufactures the hosts, one will see more, less, or in between. Other factors also have influence, such as whether or not the minister needs to break consecrated Hosts, or if any were already broken (those tend to “shed” quite a bit). At my parish, we use hosts from a company that truly does have minimal particles coming from the hosts. For us, it is a trade off. I occasionally buy hosts from small suppliers (ie the good Sisters). Theirs shed crumbs. Supporting them financially makes it worthwhile to use their hosts.

Likewise with the paten. Far less particles than a ciborium, but still there is always the possibility that some particles will fall. Using a Communion-paten is very important. Recent Church documents have lamented it’s disuse and called for its return.

 

[FrDavid96]

So the fact that they were not used once means they are of limited use?

Like the spare tire in my trunk.

I haven’t used it in quite a while, so maybe I should get rid of it.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion via intinction. Rather than hold a ciborium filled with hosts and then dipping them into a chalice of the Precious Blood held by someone else, he held the chalice and the other person handed him the hosts, one by one. In a few cases he picked the host out of the neighboring ciborium. Good way to arrest any dripping of the Precious Blood. It worked out very well.

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

Do you pray for our Holy Father ?

 

[Crusaderbear]

I imagine the Easter service at the Vatican is the single largest ‘Mass Mass’ in the christian world! If anyone can run an efficient communion service it would be the Vatican!

 

[Ubenedictus]

I remember looking at the paten used at the easter vigil as I was about to receive, I distinctly remember seeing crumbs of the sacred host.

To me the paten does have very important and practical use.

 

[Phemie]

I remember looking at the paten used at the easter vigil as I was about to receive, I distinctly remember seeing crumbs of the sacred host.

To me the paten does have very important and practical use.

It’s definitely not there just for show.

 

[Solomonson]

An ounce of prevention…

So true. It’s almost as if Francis (or someone else) stopped and said “let’s simply re-engineer this process to make it safer for the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.” He also didn’t have too much Precious Blood in the chalice. It was very cool to see.

The communion patens are a waste. Worse than a waste – they get in the way and facilitate precisely what they are supposed to be preventing. Their only redeeming value is their sign value which can be considerable to some.

If there really is a concern, I would recommend what I saw other communion distributors doing at this Mass – as they distributed communion on tongue, they simply placed their ciborium under the chin of the communicant. When receiving in one’s hand, our hands are the patents.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

From what I have read, the Pope has a Concelebrant hold the Paten and the Ciborium in many Masses.
So still used. Still very important and having a function.

You just didn’t see it perhaps? Ever been in one of his Masses?

Pray for Our Pope and clergy.

 

[MaryHelp777]

I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion via intinction. Rather than hold a ciborium filled with hosts and then dipping them into a chalice of the Precious Blood held by someone else, he held the chalice and the other person handed him the hosts, one by one. In a few cases he picked the host out of the neighboring ciborium. Good way to arrest any dripping of the Precious Blood. It worked out very well.

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

The Communion patens are there to stop crumbs of Jesus True Presence falling on floor and being stood on or hoovered.

The patens are to protect Jesus Body from sacrilege.

 

[Phemie]

So true. It’s almost as if Francis (or someone else) stopped and said “let’s simply re-engineer this process to make it safer for the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.” He also didn’t have too much Precious Blood in the chalice. It was very cool to see.

The communion patens are a waste. Worse than a waste – they get in the way and facilitate precisely what they are supposed to be preventing. Their only redeeming value is their sign value which can be considerable to some.

If there really is a concern, I would recommend what I saw other communion distributors doing at this Mass – as they distributed communion on tongue, they simply placed their ciborium under the chin of the communicant. When receiving in one’s hand, our hands are the patents.

I meant that the paten was an ounce of prevention. If it prevents one drop of the Precious Blood or one Host in 5000 from falling on the floor it has done its job.

Watching the Vigil from the Vatican I noticed that some of the priests who received by intinction held the purificator close to their chin to prevent dripping Precious Blood to the floor or onto their chasubles.

 

[FrDavid96]

…

The communion patens are a waste. Worse than a waste – they get in the way and facilitate precisely what they are supposed to be preventing. Their only redeeming value is their sign value which can be considerable to some.
…

Those are bold statements to make indeed.

So, you know better than the Church as a whole, Who insists that the patens are important.

On what are you basing your assertions?

What sort of studies have you done to come to this conclusion? Have you surveyed priests to ask how often crumbs fall at Communion-time? Have you commissioned groups of people with video cameras to capture the events and analyze the data? I’m not quite sure how such a thing even could be done. But apparently, you have some knowledge that the Church as a whole does not have. So, please share with us what method you used to come by this knowledge.

What data do you have? What method have you used to analyze that data?

The Church insists that patens are important based on centuries of combined experience by literally billions of Catholics throughout the world. Although the specific method differs from time to place (some in the East use cloths instead, or some places/times in the West for that matter; some patens have handles, some do not), the Church has concluded that patents are the opposite of “a waste” and certainly not “worse than a waste.”

So again, on what basis do you make your assertions?

 

[Solomonson]

The Communion patens are there to stop crumbs of Jesus True Presence falling on floor and being stood on or hoovered.

The patens are to protect Jesus Body from sacrilege.

I have never seen such “crumbs” (or fragments) and I have distributed tens of thousands of hosts over the years. I (and I dare so most anyone else) would never offer a host from a ciborium that was fractured and likely to shed a fragment while being given to a communicant.

What I have seen many times are altar servers trying to maneuver patens on long handles that do nothing but get in the way and confuse/complicate things. Then again they do provide the sign value that is important to some as you express.

In any event this is about Pope Francis and what I see to be an extremely simple and secure means in which to offer Holy Communion via intinction.

 

[Solomonson]

I have rarely seen any particles on a ciborium after use, and I don’t see how you see particles on a corporal, because surely, being white, they would not stand out? When would there be altar-breads/Hosts directly on a corporal anyway?

Does your parish use unusually dark altar-breads? The only ones I’ve encountered have been pure white. Or do they crumble easily/ It seems to me tat perhaps a change of supplier is indicated.

Likewise. The hosts my parish uses have a great deal of what I would call “structural integrity” – they don’t shed fragments. Fragments are produced during the fractioning rite when the large host is broken into two or more pieces, but they are visible to the person distributing communion and caution can be easily taken to ensure none end-up on the ground.

I agree, a change of suppliers (or different storage/handling) is necessary if hosts readily crumble.

The use of communion patens is ceremonial, not functional.

 

[MissRose73]

I liked how Pope Francis distributed Holy Communion via intinction. Rather than hold a ciborium filled with hosts and then dipping them into a chalice of the Precious Blood held by someone else, he held the chalice and the other person handed him the hosts, one by one. In a few cases he picked the host out of the neighboring ciborium. Good way to arrest any dripping of the Precious Blood. It worked out very well.

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

I liked the way he did that too. When I went for our Sunday Mass on pilgrimage nearly 2 years ago, our 2 priests distributed Communion the same way. The other days we simply received the host only.

 

[Brendan]

No communion patens in use. That underscores their limits of any practical value. More symbolic than anything.

I would disagree. My parish offers communion via intinction as the general mode of Holy Communion.

I also serve at our parish early morning Mass. In the last 6 months, I have caught a Host on the paten twice, and several times where a drop of the species of wine fell from the intincted Host.

Also, in your example, you did not mention if the Holy Father held the chalice below the communicant’s chin, or if he used the Chalice to follow the intincted Host to catch any drops.