I love my asexual wife

[Nick90]

I’m sorry but some of the comments on here are highly disturbing.
You do realise that people all of the world can view this forum? As far as many people are concerned, some of the people in this forum promote rape as an act of love. Please, please be careful what you say or just don’t say anything at all!

 

[tafan]

I’m sorry but some of the comments on here are highly disturbing.
You do realise that people all of the world can view this forum? As far as many people are concerned, some of the people in this forum promote rape as an act of love. Please, please be careful what you say or just don’t say anything at all!

Why is it that everytime the subject of the marriage debt comes up, people say it is the same as promoting rape. You did not read the material I posted, nor my posts. In post 63 I wrote:

Nothing gives a spouse the right to force/coerce sex on the other; not even the unreasonable denial of sex. The church has always been clear that sex is both unitive and procreative, ie it is a matter of love.

If you are going to make the very serious allegation that someone is promoting rape, you should provide exact references. I have never seen it promoted on this forum. So please provide the quote or retract your accusation.

 

[lianhua]

I recently told my wife of 15 years that she should stop checking her fertility (Clearblue method) as I would rather live celibately by choice than by force.

You see I couldn’t keep watching Phase I and Phase III go by with the constant rejection and avoidance. Then it dawned on me that it wasn’t the sex that I want, I want her to want me like I want her. I realized that she never has been that person. For 15 years it was always me who initiated and about 4 times a year she would give in. While she is very fit and beautiful she has never been a physical person.

Since I couldn’t explain my feelings without choking up several with tears I wrote her a note telling her how I felt and so forth.

The problem is she hasn’t responded in any way and it has almost been a week. We have a 9 year old and 7 year old so we don’t have much free time to ourselves.

Please pray for my situation. I don’t know if I can bring this subject up without getting emotional but I have decided to suffer with the Lord on this topic since I can’t have what I really want.

you are a really gentleman！Cheap Prada Shoes
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[Pfaffenhoffen]

You are wrong, and in my opinion somewhat of a misogynist. Women have great desire. I have a much more active libido than my husband. I want it and he does not. How do you manage that? A woman’s sex drive often gets intense in her 40’s and a man’s sometimes decrease after 30’s.

I am sure that you mean well but your blanket statements can come off as chauvinistic,

Me Tarzan You Jane.

Please give more consideration to your words, unless of course you really are a chauvinist. Then I guess you are just being yourself.

I think I have got a collection of names. Now, a misogynist !!! And a chauvinist !!! God, what more?
Of course, it was a general statement. I know a lady who tells his husband every night (I know that through commons friends, ladies whom she talks to about that): “Stop watching TV and come to bed!” And the fellow (a Spanish bullfighter !!) there he goes to fulfill his marriage debt. And no talk of refusing because she tells that as an order…

I want it and he does not. How do you manage that?

OF COURSE THERE ARE WAYS to get him into it. I googled it and went to the first find about the erogenous points of man: goo.gl/po3JW and wikipedia’s goo.gl/3A8P and more 2,370,000 results. One of them is goo.gl/PL4If and it is meant for men, it is about women’s erogenous points.

Now, your husband reaches home over-tired. Marriage has gone for many years. You gains used to such and such sex-routine. (I AM SPEAKING AS A MAN and it is one of my problems) I know that ladies want is nice and beautiful, champagne and roses and who do not feel like doing that. And at the same time, you want to please your wife and so, you’re stuck. Moreover, as you said, maybe his libido has gone down.

May, and i put a paragraph, that could be a disease problem. Do you know that people who need Viagra also need treatment of the arteries? That lack of erection may mean blocked arteries and a health problem?

Anyhow, please do not give up. Do not feel that as an insult to you. There are many reasons for that. You are in a bad position for women want romance before sex and a passive husband hurts more (generally, I would say!) than a passive woman (generally).

Go for him, discover his switch on points, start by the least sensible and go up to the more sensible and have nice endings. He will thank, you will the well. It is not ideal for he should have started. But there is nothing ideal in this world.

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

Does your wife touch you spontaneously? Does she embrace you back when you hug her? Does she snuggle into you when move close to her in bed (non sexual situations) or does she roll over and move away?

I am trying to explain to you that my wife attaches no importance to physical contact and clearly shows signs that she enjoys freedom of personal space. I am saying that marital debt aside that is what I miss. To me those are all part of sexuality not even as parts of foreplay. Even more than the rejection from lovemaking those rejections are painful.

I truly feel that I have been called to be Christ and suffer for my bride lest she undergo the test herself.

I am no longer rejected so I don’t have that sorrow, and I can sleep well at night not worrying about the what-if-this-is-the-night issues, and through increased prayer I am closer to God now more than ever.

As for our relationship, nothing is different. We have gone out to dinner and enjoyed each other’s company at home.

My problem is that I am almost 40 going on 18 and she is 40 going on 81.

I am not telling how my wife is but, sincerely, I see no problem in your wife. Boy, you have love and enjoy each other and that is the best marriage can give.

Now, as you put too well, she seems to have a “personal space” too wide in relation to you. You know, not everyone has the same personal space. I have studied the subject (I will not deal into it as it would take pages) and realize that people from cold countries have a wider personal space than people from hot countries. Besides, there are individual differences.There are people who simply do not want to be touched and others for whom touch is a matter of daily use. As a cultural thing, I remember that Julio Iglesias saw a receptionist in a hotel greeting him and he, as a Latin person, shook hand with him and banged with the other hand in the shoulder of the receptionist. That is a common Latin greeting. What he was being sued by the receptionist for assault !!!

I realize that there is a real problem between you and your wife, as you explained so well in the post. Maybe you are the “warm”, sensible, touchy kind of person and your wife is the “cold”, self-controled, independent person.

Me and my wife are similar. I like touching and I am a warm person and my wife does not like French or Italian kisses and hates when a person moves too close to her when talking.

Tell you what? Your wife NEEDS to learn from you. She will not learn by herself, for she was made like that by God. She needs to learn the warm, the touchy, the “massage” type of physical contact. I discovered that my wife loves “massage” and I love to give it to her. No sex strings attached but she just e enjoys it and I, surprisingly, for I never saw myself doing it (25 years of marriage), I like it.

I would not give up going into a bitter celibacy. God wants a happy celibacy on the service of others not your bitter and acid celibacy. Try, try, try, try. Insist, even over her turning around (I am hearing the crows screaming: “rape!”). Teach her how to enjoy touch. Sorry for telling you this, MAYBE, I repeat, MAYBE, she is underdeveloped or else, an an-alphabet of TOUCH. She needs a teacher who teaches her that.

I have a theory about this. I have a lot of experience on dealing with people and on knowing people. But I am not going simply to tell nothing about me.

If this makes sense, follow it. If not, I would not give up and I would try another way. You have got a wonderful marriage (you spoke about the warm dinner) with a dark spot. I believe that that dark spot has a remedy.

As much as the scientist who have been fighting for 20 years to defeat AIDS. And do not give up.

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

You have obviously not read the references I posted, and have little understanding of the marriage debt. No it is not a way of saying things between a husband and a wife. But it is a very good way of understanding obligations between a husband and a wife. We owe each other ourselves, completely and unreservedly. And we owe it in love.

Excellent: “We owe it in love”. Not in debt.
The problem is not yours. The church spoke that way. But it should change the wording, that is all I told. Your wording is better…

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

I’m sorry but some of the comments on here are highly disturbing.
You do realise that people all of the world can view this forum? As far as many people are concerned, some of the people in this forum promote rape as an act of love. Please, please be careful what you say or just don’t say anything at all!

Would you mind to name people who promote rape? To say that way, all are guilty and it is not a way of saying things.
My name is Pfaffenhofen.

 

[GraceDK]

So, your wife can atone for these sins now, in this life, or later in purgatory; it is somewhat up to you to decide, IMO. And while she struggles with all of this, again, you very well may be right to not place on her the burden of further decisions along these lines.

Wow, I’m happy that Jesus Christ atoned for my sins I’m pretty sure He atoned for the sins of OP’s wife too if she believes in Him, so don’t you worry about it.

 

[tafan]

Wow, I’m happy that Jesus Christ atoned for my sins I’m pretty sure He atoned for the sins of OP’s wife too if she believes in Him, so don’t you worry about it.

You are correct, I used the wrong wording for that. I will rephrase the sentence “So, your wife can loose the attachment for these sins now, in this life, or later in purgatory; it is somewhat up to you to decide, IMO”

I think that is certainly more in line with Catholic thought on the matter. Sorry.

 

[tafan]

Excellent: “We owe it in love”. Not in debt.
The problem is not yours. The church spoke that way. But it should change the wording, that is all I told. Your wording is better…

If we owe someone something, we have a debt. By definition. No, the Church’s wording is better.

owe   /oʊ/ Show Spelled [oh] Show IPA verb, owed, ow·ing.
verb (used with object)

1. to be under obligation to pay or repay: to owe money to the bank; to owe the bank interest on a mortgage.
2. to be in debt to: He says he doesn’t owe anybody.
3. to be indebted (to) as the cause or source of: to owe one’s fame to good fortune.
4. to have or bear (a feeling or attitude) toward someone or something: to owe gratitude to one’s rescuers.

The Church’s wording is much better, as the word debt seems to do a better job at stressing the importance of the matter.

And that is not all you said, you said “The theory of marriage debt should be abolished. It has been already”. Again, it is not a theory, it is a teaching; and it has not been abolished. But I will admit that the terminology of debt is not used as often anymore. Nor is it talked about as much anymore by the Church. That is obviously shame, judging by responses, it appears that many people do not know about it and certainly do not understand it properly; but it is a very important part of a happy marriage.

 

[Smugleaf]

I’m sorry but some of the comments on here are highly disturbing.
You do realise that people all of the world can view this forum? As far as many people are concerned, some of the people in this forum promote rape as an act of love. Please, please be careful what you say or just don’t say anything at all!

This! Also note the convenient erasing of asexuality

 

[tafan]

This! Also note the convenient erasing of asexuality

If you are supporting the accusation of promoting rape, you should back it up with references. It’s a serious accusation, so do not make or support it without evidence presented.

Convienient erasing of asexually? Well, I dont know what asexuality is. I am not a psychiatrist or doctor. If it is an actual mental or physical illness, it could possibly be a valid reason for the refusal of the marriage debt, I would consult with my confessor about that.

If, on the other hand, it is nothing more than a lack of any desire for sexual activity, I do not think it is really pertinent to the discussion. I have lots of obligatory tasks in life I don’t desire to do; it doesn’t give me an excuse to not do them; it does not even mean I do not want to do them. With some of them, I take great joy in doing them.

 

[AnaTurin]

I am so sorry for you.

This is one time when I wish I could read minds and figure out what is going on inside hers. I have periods of time when I felt “asexual” but I always knew the reasons (usually hormone changes during the month). Maybe she has a hormonal imbalance that she doesn’t even know about. Maybe it’s psychological.

When men have lack of desire, the first thing everyone thinks is for him to get some Viagra. But what about women? I’m sure there are things out there for women too.

The key is that she has to want to want to, and that is the biggest issue of all.

My advice is to write ANOTHER letter. A letter that is even more gentle, even more honest, but most of all that shows her it is not just about sex or about having your needs met, but about connecting, intimacy, and being “one” with her.

I have to say that you deserve a medal for being able to be patient with this situation through all these years. You must truly love your wife.

 

[Nick90]

If you are supporting the accusation of promoting rape, you should back it up with references. It’s a serious accusation, so do not make or support it without evidence presented.

“Start by a massage and never give up not even when she says no she may not mean no.”

“Some people just cannot stand to eat vegetables and they are necessary to your health.
Some people just have a short variety of food BECAUSE THEY DO NOT LIKE BUT DONUTS. That is bad.
If you do not like cauliflower, just eat it, eat it, eat it. Sometimes you are going to like it. It is a question of tradition and using it often.
Chinese eat dogs, Hindus do not eat beef, Jewish and Muslims feel it is dirty to eat pork, some people eat rabbit others not, many Africans eat ants (delicious, I tried!) or flies.
Sex is the same thing. Just do it. Just dot it. Just do it.
In a short time, you will feel the need for it. It is a question of habit and use, like a muscle which is not trained.”

“He isn’t entitled to have sex with her whether she likes it or not, but she isn’t entitled to say “no” indefinitely, either.”

“If, on the other hand, it is nothing more than a lack of any desire for sexual activity, I do not think it is really pertinent to the discussion.* I have lots of obligatory tasks in life I don’t desire to do; it doesn’t give me an excuse to not do them*; it does not even mean I do not want to do them. With some of them, I take great joy in doing them.”

I’m sorry are seriously comparing sex, a sacred bond between two CONSENTING adults, to say doing a chore? REALLY? Wow. Just, no. No.

I showed these comments to the people on my asexual blog, who all agreed that it was insinuating or promoting forceful sex for the sake of the husband and for God.
Like I said, be careful what you say, because people all over the world can interpret this in a way that’s disturbing or even triggering, even if it’s not meant to be.

 

[Pfaffenhoffen]

“start by a massage and never give up not even when she says no she may not mean no.”

“Some people just cannot stand to eat vegetables and they are necessary to your health.
Some people just have a short variety of food BECAUSE THEY DO NOT LIKE BUT DONUTS. That is bad.
If you do not like cauliflower, just eat it, eat it, eat it. Sometimes you are going to like it. It is a question of tradition and using it often.
Chinese eat dogs, Hindus do not eat beef, Jewish and Muslims feel it is dirty to eat pork, some people eat rabbit others not, many Africans eat ants (delicious, I tried!) or flies.
Sex is the same thing. Just do it. Just dot it. Just do it.
In a short time, you will feel the need for it. It is a question of habit and use, like a muscle which is not trained.”

“He isn’t entitled to have sex with her whether she likes it or not, but she isn’t entitled to say “no” indefinitely, either.”

I showed these comments to the people on my asexual blog, who all agreed that it was insinuating or promoting forceful sex for the sake of the husband and for God.
Like I said, be careful what you say, because people all over the world can interpret this in a way that’s disturbing or even triggering, even if it’s not meant to be.

Funny. That is all for me !!! I AM AN IMPORTANT PERSON !!!
Uff… Let us explain this:

1. “she may not mean no”. what do you have to say to this? “She May”: what does that mean in English?
2. What have the vegetables to to with it ?
3. So, a short variety of food is good for health? Eating only donuts is good for your health? What studies to you have?
4. If a doctor says that eating cauliflower is good to your health and you do not like it, what do you do?
5. How do you start liking a kind of food that you do not like but is good for your health? How do you start liking oranges when you do not like oranges?
6. If you were raised as Chinese, and your family would eat dog, would you eat dog?
7. As much sex as much you desire. I am advocating rape, no? Or are you insulting me? If I was in the USA, maybe I could sue you are receive a lot of money. Let us see: goo.gl/E0vHb; goo.gl/YHsY goo.gl/9432C ;
   goo.gl/7rRu4
   As I said, accusing someone of defending rape is a serious matter; were I in the states, and would I know you, and you would be in court.
8. I care about the opinions about your so-called blog fans as much as you care for mine.
9. "“He isn’t entitled to have sex with her whether she likes it or not, but she isn’t entitled to say “no” indefinitely, either.” Who said that? I did not say that. You are a liar if you say that i said that.
10. Quote me as defending "forceful sex " ! When? How? Slander is a sin.
11. Quote me when I said that! When? Slander is a sin.
12. " people all over the world can interpret this in a way that’s disturbing or even triggering". You and you and you and you and you and you… Already makes 6 slander people.

It is utterly coward to quote somebody not saying His name. You hide behind the Forum anonymity to accuse people and say things that you would not dare to say in court, face to face, to me.

You just insult as rape but offer no proof. You just quote and quote badly !!! No University Teacher would accept you way of anonymous cowardly quotation.

Did you go to confession for saying that I defend rape when I DO NOT DEFEND RAPE of any kind? Did you go to confession for slander?

 

[tafan]

“If, on the other hand, it is nothing more than a lack of any desire for sexual activity, I do not think it is really pertinent to the discussion.* I have lots of obligatory tasks in life I don’t desire to do; it doesn’t give me an excuse to not do them*; it does not even mean I do not want to do them. With some of them, I take great joy in doing them.”

I’m sorry are seriously comparing sex, a sacred bond between two CONSENTING adults, to say doing a chore? REALLY? Wow. Just, no. No.
.

Everyday I have to cook meals for my kids, today I have to do laundry, they are obligations. my joyful burdens. I have no desire to do them, but I do them glady, out of love. Are these obligations as important as sex between a man and wife, I don’t know. Let say you are right, ok, I will give you another example.

Today was Sunday. This morning, the bed was very warm, it was cold outside, I could have stayed in bed all morning. I had no desire to get out of bed, get the kids to ready for mass, and load them all up and go to mass. But even without the desire, I wanted to, because that was my OBLIGATION. I cannot dispense with my obligation just because of lack of desire. Now, if I would have been sick, and unable to get out of bed because of the illness, then the obligation would have been removed. But as it was, I had no reasonable cause to not abide by my obligation; which is an obligation out of love to God. And I am so glad I didn’t. Mass was great.

Back to chores:
The OP wrote a letter to his wife about this. Lets assume a mother received a letter from one of my kids. "Mom, We decided we are just going to quit asking you to make our meals. You only feed us 4 or 5 times a year, and all the other times we ask you say no. It is just too painful to hear you say no. Don’t worry, the neighbors feed us every day or two, so we don’t go to bed hungry every night. "

Seems like a decent anaology to me, not perfect, but decent. We have obligations, founded in love, that we committed to a long time ago, freely. For whatever reason, we don’t have a desire to do so anymore. That does not relieve us of the obligation.

 

[Smugleaf]

The point is, for many asexuals sex is an upsetting and/or scarring experience. It is not the same as just performing an unpleasant chore, it can lead to feeling violated and hurt. It is Catholic teaching that sex should be a unitive act, and I don’t see how anything can be unitive when one feels pressured into it.

I think many in this thread may benefit from reading Asexuality: Myths, Misconceptions and Other Things That Are Just Plain Wrong. I doubt any of you will, but it’s a very useful and concise summary of asexuality.

To the OP, my partner wants to tell you you are a nice person Many asexuals suffer from feelings of guilt and inferiority because they feel pressured by society and/or their partners to have sex, when many do not feel comfortable with doing so.

 

[Shostakovich]

I signed up to respond to this thread.

Asexual, great friend, shared activities, loyalty but no intimacy, everything looks fine and it doesn’t make sense that there’s a problem, there’s no doubt that you love each other but there’s a key part you feel like you’re missing, talk therapy doesn’t help, outsiders would never guess, physical exams come out fine, no trauma or abuse or anything that “caused” it and little to no recognition from the spouse that the lack of intimacy is not typical, and one woman here even said she found out that the key for her was that she has a visual mind and can identify with images over abstract ideas.

It sounds to me like you’re all talking about adults with autism/aspergers.

There’s a saying that goes, “When you’ve met one person with autism, you’ve met one person with autism.” Women with autism are a minority of a minority and not uncommonly have an even harder time of things because their autism is more likely to be overlooked while their awkwardness is less likely to be excused away. Every person has his or her own personality and experiences which interact with the autism, but there are consistent experiences that those who love people with autism bring up and that people with autism experience. This thread hits almost all of the common ones.

 

[Smugleaf]

Asexuality is not the same as autism.

 

[Oh_Charlotte]

Asexuality is not the same as autism.

That’s for sure! I have lived that way long and not of my choice. And its the same for many of us and God provides for those of us in difficult situations, whatever the situation is.

But to enjoy intimacy with your spouse is normal. I started this thread and I hope it will help others to have hope whose spouse (usually the wife) is disinterested. I think the article I link is one that would really give you hope that you can replace your nothing with a great bonding kind of sex much better than any other experience you’ve had (they have a forum, I think, and you could ask what to do in a situation such as yours where your wife has lost interest; they will tell you how to approach lovingly)…

Because, probably if you feel so deeply sad about the absence of intimacy its because God is telling you that in your state in life its not normal, and not what He wants for you! Well, I have no experience with this whatsoever, only just read from that website, so, here is my thread with the linked article at the bottom:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=8951366#post8951366