I Need Help Understanding Jewish Covenant!

[CollegeCatholic]

I’m somewhat confused about the nature of the Jewish covenant. It is my understanding that the covenant with the Jews has always been an earthly covenant, and thus, many Jews don’t even believe in an afterlife, much less have a developed theology regarding it. With that said, what is the purpose of a earthly covenant with a people who have seldom seen earthly prosperity? The destruction of the Jewish temple, twice over, and the Jewish diaspora that has lasted for many centuries seem to point to me a lack of any real earthly protection from God. Heck, from antiquity, when one spoke of a “Jew” it was almost like saying during modern times “Christian” in that you would need to specify what type to be even remotely on the same page, so even labeling someone or something “Jewish” is difficult.

Christ is the eternal covenant in the sense that it is through His death and resurrection that any of us, Enoch, Elijah, Moses, Mary, Mother Teresa, JPII, etc. are saved and delivered into eternal life with God. I see the covenant with the Jewish people being one in the same with God’s covenant with the rest of the world in that there was an older covenant that was not revoke, but expanded upon, to include all of human kind throughout all of time, including gentiles before the time of Christ, not two different covenants for two different sectors of the world population. The extra-special theology regarding the role of the modern Jew in salvation history doesn’t make sense to me.

To clarify, outside of circumcision, a matriarchal Jewish bloodline, and the following of the Mosaic law, what is required of a member of the so-called “Old Covenant.” Also, what is the nature of the covenant between God and the Jews if it is neither eternal salvation nor earthly prosperity? (Well, at least for me, the evidence shows that God has not been too concerned about the Jews earthly status). What differentiates a devout Jew vs. a devout Muslim? Heck, even a devout Buddhist or Animist?

Sorry, a lot of topics and questions but I’m getting kinda’ confused and frustrated as I keep hearing this special place that we hold for modern Jews in our theology yet I see no difference between them and the rest of the non-Catholic population of the world. Please help!

 

[dosdog]

CATHOLICISM COMPLETES COVENANT FOR JEWISH CONVERT Marty Barrack
ewtn.com/library/ANSWERS/COMCOVE.htm

Host - Kris Franklin and Rosalind Moss
Hosts Kristine Franklin and Rosalind Moss discuss the obstacles to conversion to Catholic Church by sharing their personal stories. Each brings a different perspective – Franklin from an evangelical background and Moss from a Jewish one – and deals with their former objections to Catholic doctrine.
ewtn.com/vondemand/audio/file_index.asp?SeriesId=6124&pgnu=

 

[fellowChristian]

Dr. Scott Hahn might be able to help!

salvationhistory.com/online/Beginner/WalkGen.cfm

 

[Deconi]

Firstly, you need to find which Covenant people are speaking of when they say “Old Covenant.” A reading of Holy Writ will show you that there were several Covenants between God and His people.

Predominantly, when people speak of Old Covenant, they refer to the Mosaic Laws because this is the one that ends up being discussed.

Many Christians, including some of the high prelates of Catholicism, it sometimes seem, have a misunderstanding of the Mosaic Law. Modern thought is that the Old Covenant (Mosaic Laws) have not been revoked or abolished. In this, they begin to depart from what The Church holds: That there is no “Old Covenant” with regards to the Mosaic Laws.

From it’s infancy, Catholicism has always taught that everyone needs to be under The New Covenant to be saved. That means, the Jews who began The Church and passed it onwards towards us, had already understood that Jew and Gentile are under The New Covenant. This is still the position of The Church today.

Judaism and its adherents continue to cling to the Mosaic Laws because it was decreed by God! In not recognizing Christ as the Promised One to come, they continue as though He never existed. Because God did decree it, even some Christians are arguing their case!

Against that is St Paul’s teachings and painstaking efforts to explain what has happened with the Mosaic Covenant. The Jews who began Christianity understood. The arguments that only God can abolish or ‘change’ His Eternal Word is valid. But it was “The Word of God” (His Holy Son) that explained it when He said that He came to fulfill it. So “it is acomplished”

JP2, (probably) in unifying language, alluded to a **"…covenant, never revoked by God,…" between God and His people. JP2, a Pope, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, cannot teach error or speak an untruth! Therefore he must be speaking of the salvation Covenant promised by God to His people, especially, the Jews to whom it was given. A Pope cannot contradict St Paul, so he cannot be speaking of the Mosaic Laws! He must be refering to the salvific Covenant given by God right from the beginning, to Abraham! This was given to Abraham when he was still a Gentile (uncircumcised)

The “Old Covenant” unrevoked is that given to Abraham.

Hope I didn’t add to the confusion.

**

 

[Kaninchen]

With that said, what is the purpose of a earthly covenant with a people who have seldom seen earthly prosperity?

Well, we’re still around which is more than can be said of the various peoples who surrounded us in biblical times.

To us, of course, non-Jews fall under the covenant with the sons of Noah.

I expect that Christians have about the same sort of regard for the legitimacy of the Qur’an and Muslim commentaries on Christianity as we have for the legitimacy of the ‘New Testament’ and Christian commentaries on Judaism.

 

[CollegeCatholic]

JP2, a Pope, with the guidance of the Holy Spirit, cannot teach error or speak an untruth!

Pope can certainly speak wrongly about any number of things, faith issues included. It is only when they are speaking in the fullness of their authority, ex Cathedra, “from the Chair [of St. Peter]” that they are protected from any and all error. You probably know this already but this small snippet seems misleading to me. Thanks for the other info, though!

 

[Valke2]

The purpose is to sanctify God’s name, and the Jewish people here and now. Through our actions we sanctify ourselves, our people, the world, and God. THat is the purpose and the reward.

We do of course have a theology about the afterlife. But we don’t have set dogma on the issue to the same extent Christians do.

The focus with Jews is on sanctification, not individual salvation.