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Mirdath
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This thread is getting entirely too serious and angsty. Stop it. Please?
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Goth_Catholic
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bear06
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What is two halves?
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Goth_Catholic
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When I say two halves I mean in the sence that both are equally a part of me. Not divided, not seperate, equal.
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bear06
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We should have a joyful heart on both. One is just a path to the other and is a gift from God. You really can’t have it both ways. A joyful heart isn’t pessimistic and somber. All of these little lines sound like they come from a song. They sound anything but free thinking. All of this darkness, being somber and pessimistic reminds me of the story in the bible of the man who fasted and put on a long face about it so everyone would know. Do you remember what Christ’s response was to that?
Again, why do you feel you need a sub-culture. Why isn’t the Catholic Church enough? Why isn’t the Holy Eucharist enough? This is enough for this mother to be concerned about “goth”.
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Goth_Catholic
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I don’t need it, I’m a part of it. It’s who i am. Can’t change that. Did I ever say it wasn’t? I don’t think so. You assume I don’t think it’s enough because I don’t identity myself with “normal” society. I’m sorry, would you rather I be a “normal” teenager and lie, have sex, experiment with drugs, and disobey my parents?Again, why do you feel you need a sub-culture. Why isn’t the Catholic Church enough? Why isn’t the Holy Eucharist enough? This is enough for this mother to be concerned about “goth”.
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bear06
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You said you’d lose it if you weren’t goth. I’d rather have you be a teenager who focuses on the Faith not “goth”. You are born a child of God, not a “goth”.I don’t need it, I’m a part of it. It’s who i am. Can’t change that. Did I ever say it wasn’t? I don’t think so. You assume I don’t think it’s enough because I don’t identity myself with “normal” society. I’m sorry, would you rather I be a “normal” teenager and lie, have sex, experiment with drugs, and disobey my parents?
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Goth_Catholic
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God gave me the free will to be a goth. I’m a catholic and I’m a goth and theres nothing about myself I would ever change. It’s implanted in my soul. I’ve learned to serve God better now i have complete cofidence in who I am. But I don’t expect you to understand anyway. “If you were of this world, the world would love it’s own. But since you are not of this world and I have taken you out of this world, they hate you.”
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Imryl
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I don’t see most goth’s as identifying with darker or evil things. It’s essentially just a different way of dressing. I’ve had a few goth friends here and there.
I actually was witness to some heckling that was pointed at one of them, by a christian I might add, about worshipping the devil. This ‘goth’ friend of mine happened to be a theology major and a catholic. It was quite a scene to watch her polietely and calmly school this person both on why she dressed the way she did, and about god.
I had a very difficult time not laughing. I just sat their with a very big smirk on my face.
I can see why it might have offended you a bit, but it’s just one of those things you have to deal with. Unless you’ve had experience with a type of subculture, you basically have to go with what you’ve heard through the grape vine. Typically you’re left with a lot of misinformation.
I’m intimiately fimilar with that type of ignorance also and I’ve never worn all black. I’ve just chosen to keep my mouth shut, avoids a lot of unnecessary chatter and annoyance.
I actually was witness to some heckling that was pointed at one of them, by a christian I might add, about worshipping the devil. This ‘goth’ friend of mine happened to be a theology major and a catholic. It was quite a scene to watch her polietely and calmly school this person both on why she dressed the way she did, and about god.
I had a very difficult time not laughing. I just sat their with a very big smirk on my face.
I can see why it might have offended you a bit, but it’s just one of those things you have to deal with. Unless you’ve had experience with a type of subculture, you basically have to go with what you’ve heard through the grape vine. Typically you’re left with a lot of misinformation.
I’m intimiately fimilar with that type of ignorance also and I’ve never worn all black. I’ve just chosen to keep my mouth shut, avoids a lot of unnecessary chatter and annoyance.
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paradoxy
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When I was 15 (10 yrs ago), I also started wearing black all the time, adding dark red and olive green a few years later when I matured enoughCan I ask you something? Feel free not to answer if it’s too personal. Are you drawn to the Goth culture because you’ve had a lot of difficulties in life and don’t feel particularly “pink and perky” if you know what I mean? As in, you relate better to things that are darker, (not in the evil sense)more somber as opposed to “happy happy joy joy” type things. I don’t know if this is making sense.
I have a theory about those that are drawn to Goth culture. When I was a teen (back in the day
I was more of the head banger variety, listened to music like Metallica, Guns n Roses an such. My hubby (who was my boyfriend at the time) was pretty much the same but was into harder stuff like Danzig, The Mistfits, and bands like Tool etc.
We both came from difficult homes that were abusive. My theory is that kids that experience a lot of pain growing up are drawn to somber (even angry) type music and culture because that’s is what they relate to.
Just wondering if that has been your experience. (By the way I read your signature, thought was interesting cause my hubby has a black rose tattoo.)
. I listened to “dark” music and wrote poems about death and evil and doom and gloom. It wasn’t a subculture or belonging somewhere. It didn’t have a name, that was just what I felt like and I was the only one I knew who did it.And I didn’t come from an abusive home, FAR from it. If anything, I am (a bit) spoiled. Maybe this phase happened because I just realized, after all of my grandparents (5) and a friend died within a few years, that death is real and all I know is vanity. It was silly and frivolous and shallow to be “pink and perky” and pursue a normal, successful life. I spent my 15th birthday alone in my room, contemplating the fact that I had one year less to live
.I read A LOT, experimented with drugs in the hope that I would receive wisdom from the inner recesses of my subconscious (I never did), drank a lot in the hope that I would receive wisdom etc. (only managed to get unconscious quite a few times) and went out to headbanger nightclubs where I tried to “dance” (ha!) myself into nonexistence in the hope that I would etc.
This was a search, and eventually I found Christ. A lot of monastics in the Serbian Orthodox Church have a similar past. Fr Georgije from the monastery of Djurdjevi stupovi sent me some lyrics of songs he used to listen to in his youth to translate for him, and I froze: I’d never been close to such nihilism and despair. The next logical step, after realizing there is NO hope or real, lasting joy, or real meaning to be found in this worldly existence, is finding Christ. It is simply logical. Pop culture is much more dangerous.
I still prefer black, dark red, and olive green and still have a problem with women who wear pink (I HAVE to get over this…), but I have become the most “normal” person: I live in the countryside with my husband and baby and am an MA student of Literature. All this is actually NOT normal among people my age in Europe, but in my “dark” phase I learned to be independent and not care what the world thinks.
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Nevarlander
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Um… false dichotomy? You can, of course, be neither a goth nor a rebellious “normal” teenager. They exist. It’s not a big deal to me that you’re goth, but in terms of practical morality, it’s impossible for me to tell the difference between goths and vanillas as a group. Goths just like cloves and faux-absinthe and “vanillas” like beer and marijuana.I don’t need it, I’m a part of it. It’s who i am. Can’t change that. Did I ever say it wasn’t? I don’t think so. You assume I don’t think it’s enough because I don’t identity myself with “normal” society. I’m sorry, would you rather I be a “normal” teenager and lie, have sex, experiment with drugs, and disobey my parents?
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edwest2
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Merely natural? There is no “one size fits all” way to look at this. In the sub-culture I was involved in, there were different types of people with different levels of involvement. As a parent, you get to decide how deeply and possibly, negatively involved your child is. I could’ve committed a lot of sins while involved but, thank God, I left it after a while.It’s merely natural for parents to reject when children chose pointless “subcultures” just to make a scene of themselves. It’s conformity to the idea of “teenage rebellion” to the point of stupidity. Across the pond kids are dressing up like skinheads to “stick it to the man” and be shocking. There are, of course, always a collection of losers and assorted misfits that never grow out of this.
Oh wow, you wear black and paint yourself pale white, how shocking and controversial.
God bless,
Al
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bear06
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This is all a bit dramatic. God gives us the free will to do many things not all of which are good. I highly doubt God “implanted” goth into your soul. It’s not a vocation. You may not expect me to understand but just because I don’t agree with you, doesn’t mean that I don’t understand. It might just mean that I disagree with you. I’m simply trying to get you to understand my point of view on the “goth” situation and why the AAA person may have answered the question the way they did.
I’m very interested in knowing how being a “goth” has helped you to better serve God and has given you confidence. I’d also like to know why you don’t feel that the Sacraments alone were doing this for you.
And as far as the hate thing goes…I’m far from hating you for being a “goth”. This too is a bit dramatic. Maybe you have a perception of people hating you because you are “goth” which doesn’t exist. I know it doesn’t exist here.
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Goth_Catholic
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I know who I am and who God wants me to be. And that’s all that matters.
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anthony022071
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Maybe we should get her a pink burqa.
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Goth_Catholic
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Yeah…nobody google that
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wjp984
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I think that the apologist has it exactly right with the word unhealthy interest as other posters have mentioned. However, although I don’t really know much about goth or what is and not considered goth and whether dark is always associated with goth, in my opinion stuff that is dark can be really neat. I almost always prefer something in a minor key than a major key since it sounds cooler and I guess darker. Also, in my opinion dark as in night can be more mysterious and fun with stars and stuff. Same reasoning goes why winter is neat as well as harsh weather and storms. I would say people in general like stuff that is dark or at least find awe in it. There probably are church songs that could be categorized as dark.
I think you are just among a group though whose members have at times associataed themselves with stuff contrary to the Catholic Church and Christianity so you will be stereotyped a lot and therefore you will become defensive a lot because of it. You’ll probably always have to continuously be on the defensive and show you are not the stereotypical anti christian goth but it seems worth it to you to remain a goth and just understand that people will stereotype just like people do for anything else so don’t be upset.
I think you are just among a group though whose members have at times associataed themselves with stuff contrary to the Catholic Church and Christianity so you will be stereotyped a lot and therefore you will become defensive a lot because of it. You’ll probably always have to continuously be on the defensive and show you are not the stereotypical anti christian goth but it seems worth it to you to remain a goth and just understand that people will stereotype just like people do for anything else so don’t be upset.
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bear06
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What’s up?
You’re going to do what you’re going to do. Got it. I’m just trying to understand a little better.Again:
I think these are legitimate questions and I’m sure you’ll get them again when this topic comes up.
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rayne89
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Bear06 since you keep asking GC questions I really don’t think you do get it. God gave us free will, he made us each unique. We don’t all have to be cookie cutter shirt and tie people to be good Catholics. This implanted in your soul stuff isn’t anymore different than lets say a person who loves horses, raises them, rides them, spends their life around them. A person like that could say horses are in their soul, it’s part of who they are. That doesn’t make them a worse Catholic or say God isn’t enough.
It’s obvious GC’s interest has not drawn her (I think GC is a her?) away from the church. It’s not harming her relationship with God. Could it have that effect on some people -sure, but so could many other things.
I got married at 18. I was a rebellious kid. I knew I wasn’t going to walk around in leather jacket and heavy black eyeliner all my life. My hubby was the same, rebellious as heck. Only when we married and then had our daughter I wanted to fit in to that cookie cutter mold and I spend years trying to get my husband to change and be like everyone else. I was the one that was stupid and I hurt him terribly. I finally opened my eyes and realized I don’t want him to be like everybody else. I want to him to be the unique person that he is. And he is an amazing person.
Sure he doesn’t wear rock tees and jeans to Mass, he conforms when it’s appropriate. And his outward appearance isn’t as dramatic as it used to be. But he is who he is, and he’s a fantastic husband and a wonderful father. My daughters friends love him because he is so much fun. He doesn’t have to wear a polo shirt to be a good Catholic. And neither does GC -why do you keep picker her apart?
It’s obvious GC’s interest has not drawn her (I think GC is a her?) away from the church. It’s not harming her relationship with God. Could it have that effect on some people -sure, but so could many other things.
I got married at 18. I was a rebellious kid. I knew I wasn’t going to walk around in leather jacket and heavy black eyeliner all my life. My hubby was the same, rebellious as heck. Only when we married and then had our daughter I wanted to fit in to that cookie cutter mold and I spend years trying to get my husband to change and be like everyone else. I was the one that was stupid and I hurt him terribly. I finally opened my eyes and realized I don’t want him to be like everybody else. I want to him to be the unique person that he is. And he is an amazing person.
Sure he doesn’t wear rock tees and jeans to Mass, he conforms when it’s appropriate. And his outward appearance isn’t as dramatic as it used to be. But he is who he is, and he’s a fantastic husband and a wonderful father. My daughters friends love him because he is so much fun. He doesn’t have to wear a polo shirt to be a good Catholic. And neither does GC -why do you keep picker her apart?
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bear06
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