I Speak In Toung

[DJgang]

I Awoke Speaking In Toung . The Dream I Was Having Was About .a Half Man Half Horse He Had Sade Sometime To Me And I Got Mad And Garbed Him And Put Him On The Floor And I Started To Pray The Our Father And Started To Speak In Toung And Someone Sade To Me That I Was Looking In To His Pass. I Saw Some Pic Of Pyiam And Some Funny Looking Letter Too .man Had Tattoo’s Of Funny Symbols All Over His Body.

Everyone, I personally do not think the speaking in tongues is the situation here, the vision that the OP had seems demonic to me and very worthy of caution. Doesn’t sound like a Holy Ghost moment, of course, I am no expert and I do believe Edgar needs to seek pastoral counseling on this issue.

God bless.

 

[LilyM]

Show me the Church teaching that says I must believe in gibberish tongues.

There isn’t one, neither is there a Church teaching that says that you must believe that 2+2=4. Nevertheless you must believe in the truth of the math, if you are a reasonable and logical person who doesn’t want people constantly cheating you of money at the supermarket.

Tongues of course isn’t on the same level of certitude, no-one would say you must believe it. But even a casual reading of St Paul would seem to indicate that he believed in a gift of tongues which was unrelated to regular human language and the interpretation thereof, and I wouldn’t be quick to dismiss anything St Paul has to say.

 

[Godlovestrength]

HI all.
I am not sure why you are wondering about something that is such a beautiful gift as all gifts of God are.
God gives any person a gift and it is in His wisdom that we should relate to it, as to why and how we are to impliment it or they for the building up of the church.

For instance one may be given a gift of servanthood the other the gift of speaking in strange toungs that no one seems to know, then there may be another who has the gift of cleaning the floor while the other the gift of leading others and another the gift of healing.
Are we to say one is better than another or one has a place while another has none?
No, we know that God’s word tells us that even though I may be one part of the body while another is a more outgoing part it does not mean that one has the right over the other.

There are places for all. Big or small. For the truth is that God gives us all should we ask and allow, the Spirit of God to lead us. To have the gift that surely goes with God’s plan for His church and as an integril part of all gifts. We should then ask for the gift of discernment.

ALL gifts have a right and I for one use discernment before all situations are settled. In many occasions along with my wife, we both also pray in toungs and this brings the spirit closer when we may become toung tired, or want to go deeper into the spirit, or pray against some spirit that might be lingering during our prayer and there are other reasons why we use toungs as well.

So discern and give the glory to God.
I myself have heard of others who have woken and been in toungs because they went to sleep thinking and praying to God in toungs and they woke with the thought on their mind.

God bless

 

[thistle]

There isn’t one, neither is there a Church teaching that says that you must believe that 2+2=4. Nevertheless you must believe in the truth of the math, if you are a reasonable and logical person who doesn’t want people constantly cheating you of money at the supermarket.

Tongues of course isn’t on the same level of certitude, no-one would say you must believe it. But even a casual reading of St Paul would seem to indicate that he believed in a gift of tongues which was unrelated to regular human language and the interpretation thereof, and I wouldn’t be quick to dismiss anything St Paul has to say.

I believe what Paul says but I just happen to disagree with your interpretation of what he says. I am not saying you are wrong. You have a view and so do I and as long as the Church does not tell me I must believe in gibberish tongues then I am free to disbelieve them.
By the way in the past I have spoken to priests in several countries and many of them are extremely sceptical about gibberish tongues so its not just the laity who have doubts.

 

[Godlovestrength]

This is not aimed at persons buit at the use of the term gibberish.

You should differenciate between gibberish and a language that may not be understood by those around.
You will understand that there is no gibberish in toungs only a language that is a gift God gives to that person at that time to edify the body and or to glorify God in which ever way He decides.

Godbless.

 

[thistle]

This is not aimed at persons buit at the use of the term gibberish.

You should differenciate between gibberish and a language that may not be understood by those around.
You will understand that there is no gibberish in toungs only a language that is a gift God gives to that person at that time to edify the body and or to glorify God in which ever way He decides.

Godbless.

That is your opinion. That is not the Church teaching. I firmly believe that speaking in tongues only refers to a person suddenly being able to speak/understand a real language they could not speak before.
For hundreds of people at meetings to claim they can speak in tongues (gibberish) is absolutely ludicrous. They are fake.
ONLY the Church can discern if anyone has the gift of tongues (whether it is the real or the gibberish type). A private individual cannot discern that.

 

[water]

They are fake.
ONLY the Church can discern if anyone has the gift of tongues

When you said “they are fake”, do you mean the language is fake or the people are faking?

 

[thistle]

When you said “they are fake”, do you mean the language is fake or the people are faking?

With regard to the actual language I do not believe the “gibberish” to be a language. It is just made up. I do not believe Paul is speaking about anything other than a foreign language (but a real one).
However, I have to say that if the Church declared it to be real I would accept it.

My primary concern is that people turn up at charismatic meetings or wherever, start spouting this “gibberish” and they and others around them declare they have the gift of tongues so my view is that such people are faking it.
Only the Church can discern if a gift is real or not. Look at private revelations, apparitions etc. The Church spends decades or even longer investigating and discerning whether they are genuine or not and overall hardly any over the centuries have ever been approved.
Yet here we have hundreds, probably many more people just get together and say they have a gift. I don’t think so. For me they are faking it and others may be caught up in the moment and think they have it.
I have attended such meetings. The leaders get everyone to open their mouths and ask them to make sounds like the ones the leaders are making. People then think they are speaking in tongues.
At one meeting (by the way this was A Life in the Spirit meeting) the leader declared that speaking in tongues is the only way to communicate with the Holy Spirit and that praying in English or a real language was no good, and he went further to say only “tongues” can be used to perform exorcisms. Talk about pride and arrogance.
I spoke to a priest the following day and he said for him the jury is still out on whether “gibberish” tongues is real or not but he absolutely said we can pray to the Holy Spirit in any language and exorcisms are done in real languages.

 

[water]

With regard to the actual language I do not believe the “gibberish” to be a language. It is just made up. I do not believe Paul is speaking about anything other than a foreign language (but a real one).
However, I have to say that if the Church declared it to be real I would accept it.

My primary concern is that people turn up at charismatic meetings or wherever, start spouting this “gibberish” and they and others around them declare they have the gift of tongues so my view is that such people are faking it.
Only the Church can discern if a gift is real or not. Look at private revelations, apparitions etc. The Church spends decades or even longer investigating and discerning whether they are genuine or not and overall hardly any over the centuries have ever been approved.
Yet here we have hundreds, probably many more people just get together and say they have a gift. I don’t think so. For me they are faking it and others may be caught up in the moment and think they have it.
I have attended such meetings. The leaders get everyone to open their mouths and ask them to make sounds like the ones the leaders are making. People then think they are speaking in tongues.
At one meeting (by the way this was A Life in the Spirit meeting) the leader declared that speaking in tongues is the only way to communicate with the Holy Spirit and that praying in English or a real language was no good, and he went further to say only “tongues” can be used to perform exorcisms. Talk about pride and arrogance.
I spoke to a priest the following day and he said for him the jury is still out on whether “gibberish” tongues is real or not but he absolutely said we can pray to the Holy Spirit in any language and exorcisms are done in real languages.

thistle, I understand your concern. However, you say that it is for the Church to discern, then why you are saying that “they are faking”? Are you helping the Church discern?

To share with you about this topic, I once was praying the Rosary at home, and all of a sudden my mouth and tongue twisted. I had no control over it, that was exactly when some strange language came out of my mouth without me knowing what it was, without me knowing what the next “sound” came out of my mouth. There were some supernatural experiences going on at that moment, but there is no need for me to go into details here.

That happened to me for the next few days. I did not force myself to do it. After 3 days, it never came back again. One thing I did was to ask the Holy Spirit that I was not so sure about this gift and I asked Him to give me something that I can feel at peace - I prayed to love to pray and to study Bible.

I can say that my spiritual life has been changed ever since. Not that I am holy, but I has begun to know myself better, to learn how to pray better, and to have a spark of love to study Bible.

One thing that I was sad about is that when the tongue did not come to me and I did not want to force myself to immitate what I heard of me praying the strange language that night, some people had different opinions about me. I learn to let it go, because I know that God let things happen to me for a good reason, and he takes it away for a good reason.

I am not praising myself here, but my main point is God will take care those who are honestly searching for Him. We can do so little or nothing to correct the way these people seek God or Praise Him if what you do are not in God’s will. If the Church does not condem it, then let it be. You can tell your concern, but you cannot say that people are faking – you end up judging others and playing the Church role yourself.

God bless.

 

[thistle]

thistle, I understand your concern. However, you say that it is for the Church to discern, then why you are saying that “they are faking”? Are you helping the Church discern?

God bless.

Okay this is my position in summary:

The Church does not have a doctrine that teaches I must believe in gibberish tongues. Therefore we are free to believe it or not. As I don’t believe it it logically follows to me that the people who say they have this gift are faking it.

However, the Church also does not say it is not true so if such people claim to have this gift then they should submit to the Church to discern if they do indeed have the gift of tongues. They cannot have it both ways. If they think they have the gift then ask the Church to verify it. If not they should keep quiet.

 

[Godlovestrength]

**

That is your opinion. That is not the Church teaching. I firmly believe that speaking in tongues only refers to a person suddenly being able to speak/understand a real language they could not speak before.

** I wonder why you say that “this is not the teaching of the church” and then you say that “you firmly believe” You should decide if it is the teaching of the church or it is your belief, or if maybe your belief is the one all should relate to, maybe we could pray about it?

*For hundreds of people at meetings to claim they can speak in tongues (gibberish) is absolutely ludicrous. They are fake.
ONLY the Church can discern if anyone has the gift of tongues (whether it is the real or the gibberish type). *
Yes you could be right since that started at Pentecost with the people who were first touched by the Holy Spirit, I think Mary the diciples and about fourty others were there. They all started speaking as you relate, in a large number of people, at a meating claiming to speak in toungs ( gibbrish) which those outside thought was absolute ludicrous.
Please read:
1Corrinth 14. 2 states: the one who speaks in strange toungs does not speak to others but to God, because NO ONE understands them. He/she is speaking secret truths *****by the power of the Spirit. *****Paul also stated that "I would like you all to speak in strange toungs…

Please read 1 Corinth 12. 12: 31. epecially “If the foot were to say because I am not a hand I don’t belong to the body… that would not keep it from being a part of the body”.

Please, there are different gifts for different people to make up the body of Christ.
My Catholic Bible states these points, I have not made up any point here. I have not stated "It is my belief without statiing biblical point of fact that is truth, especially in the Catholic church.

A private individual cannot discern that.
You are right that is the very reason why we are given the gift of “dicernment” from the spirit of God, all others would not be discernment but guess work unfactual and unGodly Discernment keeps the individual away from the fleshly thoughts.

God bless
God’s peace forever.

 

[water]

Okay this is my position in summary:

The Church does not have a doctrine that teaches I must believe in gibberish tongues.

I don’t know if there is anyone on CAF or someone you know forces you to believe it?

 

[Godlovestrength]

I don’t know if there is anyone on CAF or someone you know forces you to believe it?

I am not wanting to argue fruitlessly but I wonder why for one…there are no references to toungs in the catechism while there are many references to toungs in the catholic bible?

If I were to agree to either it would have to be under the church and under the word of God that I relate firstly to the bible.
If one were to argue about that then I would say that it is because the catechism was relatiing to all the writings in the bible.
Therefore we are bound to relate firstly to the catholic bible surely?
With the ability to ask priests why certain points are not referenced in the catechism.
Godbless

 

[water]

I am not wanting to argue fruitlessly but I wonder why for one…there are no references to toungs in the catechism while there are many references to toungs in the catholic bible?

If I were to agree to either it would have to be under the church and under the word of God that I relate firstly to the bible.
If one were to argue about that then I would say that it is because the catechism was relatiing to all the writings in the bible.
Therefore we are bound to relate firstly to the catholic bible surely?
With the ability to ask priests why certain points are not referenced in the catechism.
Godbless

Somehow I couldn’t relate your reply to my reply. Could you make it clearer?

 

[Godlovestrength]

Somehow I couldn’t relate your reply to my reply. Could you make it clearer?

I wish to keep away from arguments and yet keep to the point, so I might have gone off track, sorry.

The point is though that as the catechism tells us quote “the church venerqtes the scripturs as she venerates the Lords body” end of quote.
And again quote " in the sacret scriptures the church finds her nurishment" end of quote.

The readings of Paul in 1 corinth 14 are strong words, hence all catholics should be relating to all writings, gifts surely?

In which case EVERY person in the catholic church must believe in every word writen in the catholic bible. I use the American catholic and the catholic Jerusalem bibles.

If toungs is in the bible then I believe I must believe, but, then I would ask do I understand it. How ever I have no right to disbelieve because it does not suite me or my style of catholic life.

Godbless

 

[water]

If toungs is in the bible then I believe I must believe, but, then I would ask do I understand it. How ever I have no right to disbelieve because it does not suite me or my style of catholic life.

Godbless

Does the Church require one to believe the “praying in tongue” nowadays? That is the similar question I asked thistle. I believe it is up to each individual on this matter at this point in time. One should not judge those who do believe, and vice versa.

 

[Godlovestrength]

Does the Church require one to believe the “praying in tongue” nowadays? That is the similar question I asked thistle. I believe it is up to each individual on this matter at this point in time. One should not judge those who do believe, and vice versa.

God’s word CANNOT change if it could then it would not be TRUTH.
To me what you are saying is the same as my saying, I don’t believe that Jesus is the only way to the Father because I pray through the saints, would you say that I was wrong?
IF I were to say I don’t believe that Mary has any strength in gettinig people to heaven, then what would you say?
If I were to say that Communion is not the ultimate of the mass then what would you say?

This is all the same.
I may not accept the strength others (yourself) may have in their belief in some form or other about a point in the bible, but when it is writen in the bible then it is “TRUTH”, truth cannot be changed, it is the word of God.
The bible is the truth we cannot change it and in the bible it is writen that should any person try to change any word of the bible then they are damned forever.

Each person has that amount of faith , grace that God has given them.
Godbless.

My point therefore is that It is writen therefore I must believe, how ewver I maynot have the same acceptance of it’s strength as some other person may have.

 

[thistle]

God’s word CANNOT change if it could then it would not be TRUTH.
To me what you are saying is the same as my saying, I don’t believe that Jesus is the only way to the Father because I pray through the saints, would you say that I was wrong?
IF I were to say I don’t believe that Mary has any strength in gettinig people to heaven, then what would you say?
If I were to say that Communion is not the ultimate of the mass then what would you say?

This is all the same.
I may not accept the strength others (yourself) may have in their belief in some form or other about a point in the bible, but when it is writen in the bible then it is “TRUTH”, truth cannot be changed, it is the word of God.
The bible is the truth we cannot change it and in the bible it is writen that should any person try to change any word of the bible then they are damned forever.

Each person has that amount of faith , grace that God has given them.
Godbless.

My point therefore is that It is writen therefore I must believe, how ewver I maynot have the same acceptance of it’s strength as some other person may have.

It is a matter of correctly interpreting what is written in scripture. It is not sufficient to say something is in scripture so it must be the truth. It is the (Catholic) interpretation of the written word that tells us what the real truth is and what any passage means.

 

[water]

God’s word CANNOT change if it could then it would not be TRUTH.

What you said is not what I’ve been discussing. We believe what the Bible says about the events that happened in the past. My question is “are we required to believe all the events reported in the Bible must be happening today with the exact way specifically - praying in tongue”?

There are discussions about this already; some say this gift has been stopped; others say it is still going on. Now, what the Church says about this? Do you know? I believe the Church leaves this up to individual to believe.

 

[water]

Regarding the Praying in Tongue, some parts, I agree with you all, but some parts I do not. However, here is what I am always concerned about:

saint-mike.org/qa/sw/ViewAnswer.asp?QID=577
The lady posting this is embarrassed because someone (in a Charismatic group) said that she is becoming “anti-Christ”.

I am not too surprised about this since I heard it from someone who is in this movement saying the same thing about others – "God tells me he is anti-Christ".

I am not sure if this is authentic here or we are tricked by Devil in judging others and/or dividing among ourselves?

Are you all concerned about this specific discernment?