I think Islam is a good religion.

[Cleb_Calimutan]

If Islam Is Good Then We Should Not Deprive Them The Grace Of Salvation, They Therefore Should Be Converted To The Catholic Faith. :d :d

 

[sainted]

Godlover to honestly answer your query: Islam is a bad religion fullstop

 

[sainted]

can you not see how many times have we tried with these muslims. its like mission impossible. they will say the same denial as they are saying now on Judgement Day but the Lord will say as already spoken, ’ go away I don’t know you.’

 

[JOHNYJ]

I think a lot of religious leaders are working hard to find positive aspects of Islam and are exaggerating its abrahamic associations.
A religion is judged by how its adherents act and how the religion reacts when its adherents violate it teachings.
If the IRA blows up people in belfast,the Catholic church condems them.If the Unionists do it the The archbishop of Canterbury condems them.
In Islam its the Imams who incite murder! who teach children to pu on bombs and murder other children ! No high ranking Islamic authority ever condems suicide bombings . Another nteresting point is that muslim suicide bombers rarely attack military targets in Israel .What does that say about them.

 

[jcaz]

Originally posted by JOHNYJ
A religion is judged by how its adherents act and how the religion reacts when its adherents violate it teachings.

Are you serious? Statements like this do make me wonder the sanity of some people. How can a religion be judged by its adherents, ESPECIALLY if/when the religion teaches that all adherents are sinners and will sin?

Should catholic faith be JUDGED according to the crusades or the witch hunts, where women were mutalited in the name of God? Should catholic faith be judged based on the actions of certain priests who commit lewd acts with boys? Should it?

We, as Muslims, judge a religion based on the teachings of a the religion. We judge the christianity based on the Bible. And Islam should be judged based on the teachings of the Quraan and Sunnah.

In Islam its the Imams who incite murder! who teach children to pu on bombs and murder other children !

Show us REAL, EXCEPTED imams who do this? YOU CANNOT.

No high ranking Islamic authority ever condems suicide bombings .

LIES. LIES. LIES. Either you are INCREDIBLY IGNORANT, which I hope is the case, or you are a full-fledged liar trying to defame Islaam.

Granted there is no actual “authority” in Islaam, such as the vatican for catholics, but there are well-known scholars of Islaam all over the world. Many of these scholars are even appointed, such as the Grand Mufti in Saudi arabia. So if you want to point to an “authority” in Islaam, considering saudi is one of the better Muslim countries, that might be the closest thing. You will ONLY find him CONDEMNING suicide bombs. So if you have previously been ignorant on this subject, get rid of this ignorance by educating yourself, and if you are a liar, go somewhere else with the lies.

Here are several links (all on www.fatwa-online.com) with the statements of several true/accepted scholars regarding suicide attacks for your reference:
Haram Imams Denounce Terrorist Attacks
“Don’t Abuse the Concept of Jihaad” - Grand Mufti
Imams of Makkah and Madeenah condemn “heinous crime”
Shaykh 'Abdul-'Azeez Aal ash-Shaykh says suicide bombings are un-Islaamic…
Attacking the enemy by blowing oneself up in a car
Regarding suicide bombings
Concerning suicide bombings
Saudis Stand United Against Terrorism
Regarding WTC 9/11 attacks: Shaykh 'Abdul-'Azeez Aal ash-Shaykh says attacks are an “oppression, injustice and tyranny”…
Hijacking planes and kidnapping
Grand Mufti condemns attack on U.S. consulate

Okay, at this point, I have to stop, as I have spent the last eight minutes simply cutting and pasting these links, AND THIS IS JUST FROM ONE SITE!

NOTE: the speaker in many of the links is the GRAND MUFTI of saudi arabia. So either choose to educate yourself or go away with such lies.

 

[Contarini]

jcaz,

You’re absolutely right. These statements get mentioned on this board all the time. I posted a bunch of such condemnations once myself–and like you I got them from a few minutes’ google search. Actually this happened a couple of times, and on one of the occasions the person I was arguing with actually claimed that because he had not heard of these condemnations they somehow weren’t fully public and didn’t entirely count, and anyway were just motivated by fear of the U.S.

Bear in mind that this is a public discussion board, so you get folks who will pop in and shoot their mouths off without bothering with the facts. Don’t let it get to you too much.

I think it is worthwhile to discuss, especially with Catholics, how authority functions in Islam and how things are determined to be the consensus of Muslims as a whole. This can look very confusing to Catholics who are used to a more centralized authority structure. And also, many folks here are reacting to inane PC comments in our society like “Islam is a religion of peace” or “Osama Bin Laden isn’t really a Muslim.”

Both extremes ignore the real complexity not just of Islam but of all major religions. Neither Christianity nor Islam is a “religion of peace” in the sense that it has consistently promoted what secular folks can recognize as peace, or that all its teachings even today do so. Christianity has had a lot of trouble accommodating itself to the modern secular state (even though the said state was in many ways a Christian creation), and we still have a lot of issues in that regard (such an accommodation is not in my view an unmixed blessing, BTW). Islam, on the whole, has more such problems I think, because you see the Islamic community as a unified society embracing civil and religious matters, rather than as a Church in the Christian sense. (The closest we’ve ever come to the Islamic view was the view of Richard Hooker and other early Anglicans, actually.) Christians have always made some distinction between church and state, and this has in fact played a large role in the development of modern democratic society.

So I think there are issues about which non-Muslims need to be concerned with regard to Muslims’ ability to coexist with a pluralistic society (the same was true of Catholicism until Vatican II, and as the Roberts hearings show, many people still have worries). It would be helpful if we could discuss some of those issues rather than continually rehashing silly anti-Muslim claims like “imams never condemn suicide bombings.” But unfortunately the current paranoid climate makes this very difficult.

Edwin

 

[meedo]

Contarini you are very right.

 

[JOHNYJ]

RE : JCAZ / 63
It was ineresting reading the list of condemnations by these Islamic leaders.Regretfuly one thing stood out. A diference seems to exist in murdering muslims,and christians and murdering Jews.
To a christian ,murdering children is murder, what ever religion they are. It would seem that in arabic Islam they are not.
The famous pizza pie restaurant bombing was carried out by a 14 year old girl told she would be a martyr and go to heaven for killing jews,that they were children like herself was unimportant.
Again you will note that these murderers rarely attack military sites.

 

[Topher]

GodLover:

I think Islam is a good religion. Muslims are religious and that is good. We christians not always follow what god tells us, but many muslims follow better what Jesus taught. I think these terrors are done by our governments secretly and the muslims are blamed for it. Also Islamic concepts of women and war are wrongly presented by the media. This is not good. Our catholic catechism accepts muslims as part of the plan of salvation, as they worship the same God as us. I personally have a lot of muslim friends and I have been in Algeria. The muslims there are very hospitable. I was surprised by comparing them with the concept i had about Islam. They are quite different. I think as we are struggling with AIDS and drugs today, the muslim concepts of strong morality should be followed. For that we don’t necessarily need to convert. May Jesus Christ have mercy on us all. Amen.

While many muslims may be good people, and they may believe alot of things that are true, the fact of the matter is that their reigion is still heresy and heresy does not come from God but from satan. The reasonable conclusion is that Islam is not good.
Again, the people may be good, but their religion is not.

 

[Topher]

GodLover:

I think religions can’t be bad, what’s bad must be the governments, because its either they falsely accuse a religion, or at the other extreme use religious sentiment as a tool to gain support. In the early history of our religion, weren’t it the governments that persecuted us? Didn’t emperor nero start a fire in Rome, blamed the Christians for it and fed them to the lions? Jesus bless us all. Amen.

You think that religions can’t be bad? What about satanism? Or what about the ancient aztec paganism that demanded human sacrifice. In fact, in one night the aztecs sacrificed about 80,000 people to their pagan god. And this relegion demanded such things.

 

[Hospitaller]

Topher:

You think that religions can’t be bad? What about satanism? Or what about the ancient aztec paganism that demanded human sacrifice. In fact, in one night the aztecs sacrificed about 80,000 people to their pagan god. And this relegion demanded such things.

Nicely put.

 

[Topher]

Contarini:

This is completely illogical. There are structures of authority other than those recognized by hyper-papalist Catholics such as you seem to be. (I use that offensive term to distinguish you from the majority of thoughtful Catholics who have far deeper concepts of authority.) Sunni Islam (like Eastern Orthodox Christianity and Orthodox Judaism) has functioned for centuries with a consensus-based model of authority. If it doesn’t make sense to you, that’s your problem, because it obviously works well enough to suit them.

Edwin

Wow what an insult to all good Catholics who actually follow the teachings of Christ.

 

[Joseph_Alison]

their religion is still heresy and heresy does not come from God but from satan. The reasonable conclusion is that Islam is not good.
Again, the people may be good, but their religion is not

I have read many of our Christian Brothers and Sisters say that Islam is from satan, I have pulled some verses from the Holy Qur’an where satan is the subject.

“Verily Satan is an enemy to you: so treat him as an enemy. He only invites his adherents, that they may become Companions of the Blazing Fire”. Qur’an 035.006

“ When thou dost read the Qur’an, seek Allah’s protection from Satan the rejected one” 016.098

”If a suggestion from Satan assail thy (mind), seek refuge with Allah; for He heareth and knoweth (all things)”. 007.200

“ Those who fear Allah, when a thought of evil from Satan assaults them, bring Allah to remembrance, when lo! they see (aright)! 007.201

"Did I not enjoin on you, O ye Children of Adam, that ye should not worship Satan; for that he was to you an enemy avowed?- (Qur’an 36:60)

” O ye who believe! follow not Satan’s footsteps: if any will follow the footsteps of Satan, he will (but) command what is shameful and wrong: and were it not for the grace and mercy of Allah on you, not one of you would ever have been pure: but Allah doth purify whom He pleases: and Allah is One Who hears and knows (all things). 024.021

“ O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling, (dedication of) stones, and (divination by) arrows, are an abomination,- of Satan’s handwork: eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper.” 005.090

“ Satan’s plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allah, and from prayer: will ye not then abstain? 005.091

" But Satan promises them nothing but deceit. 017.064

“ Say to My servants that they should (only) say those things that are best: for Satan doth sow dissensions among them: For Satan is to man an avowed enemy”. 017.053

“I will mislead them, and I will create in them false desires; I will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by Allah.” Whoever, forsaking Allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest. 004.119

"O my father! serve not Satan: for Satan is a rebel against (Allah) Most Gracious. 019.044

“ O ye Children of Adam! Let not Satan seduce you, in the same manner as He got your parents out of the Garden, stripping them of their raiment, to expose their shame: for he and his tribe watch you from a position where ye cannot see them: We made the evil ones friends (only) to those without faith.” 007.027

“Eat what Allah hath provided for you, and follow not the footsteps of Satan: for he is to you and avowed enemy” 006.142

“ And Satan will say when the matter is decided: “It was Allah Who gave you a promise of Truth: I too promised, but I failed in my promise to you. I had no authority over you except to call you but ye listened to me: then reproach not me, but reproach your own souls. I cannot listen to your cries, nor can ye listen to mine. I reject your former act in associating me with Allah. For wrong-doers there must be a grievous penalty.” 014.022

After reading the above, will any fair person say that Islam is from satan?

Salaam.
Joseph.

 

[exoflare]

For the record, I have never stated that Islam is most certainly a direct result from Satan. Although have it be known that one of Satan’s favorite tactics is to propagate falsehood by mixing it in (disguising it) with a bunch of truths.

 

[Hospitaller]

exoflare:

Although have it be known that one of Satan’s favorite tactics is to propagate falsehood by mixing it in (disguising it) with a bunch of truths.

True enough.

 

[cute2904]

Jesus said that false prophet would come into the world and deceive many. Being deceived by a false prophet does not bring paradise, it brings hellfire.

 

[Joseph_Alison]

exoflare:

Although have it be known that one of Satan’s favorite tactics is to propagate falsehood by mixing it in (disguising it) with a bunch of truths.

Salaam exoflare;
Can you enumerate some of the falsehood and some of the truth satan is supposedly mixing in the teachings of Islam to lure Muslims? Thank you for your time.

Salaam.
Joseph.

 

[exoflare]

Joseph_Alison:

Salaam exoflare;
Can you enumerate some of the falsehood and some of the truth satan is supposedly mixing in the teachings of Islam to lure Muslims? Thank you for your time.

Salaam.
Joseph.

I didn’t say that he was personally doing this with Islam for sure, although I think it may be a possibility. Read my post a little more carefully… All I said was that it is one of his favorite tactics, and that is why you have to be careful of everything people claim even when you do recognize some truth in it.

 

[Joseph_Alison]

exoflare:

All I said was that it is one of his favorite tactics, and that is why you have to be careful of everything people claim even when you do recognize some truth in it.

The same applies to everyone and we are carefull not to follow the steps of satan as commanded by Allah (SWT) in the Holy Qur’an.

Joseph.

 

[exoflare]

NM… Joseph Alison edited his post, so I edited mine because I quoted him. Don’t worry, it was trivial stuff anyway.