i used to be a Catholic, i'm now an atheist, i'm much happier now

[CHRISTINE77]

The point of believing in God, is that you don’t have to go through life all alone. God is always near you. Even if you have good family and friends, you will find yourself alone. But with God, you are never alone. He is always by your side. And He will be there at the hour of your death.

 

[distracted]

no such thing as “used to be Cahtolic”…

Once Catholic, always Catholic… (in at least some ways…)

And more importantly:

those who are happiest in this life are those who are on their way to Hell… As the bible says “they have their portion in this life”

Have you read st. Faustina’s Diary, # 741? (Vision of Hell) :hypno: uch:

 

[uncommon_sense]

The point of believing in God, is that you don’t have to go through life all alone. God is always near you. Even if you have good family and friends, you will find yourself alone. But with God, you are never alone. He is always by your side. And He will be there at the hour of your death.

I AGREE

 

[reen12]

angelfrogfish

…else go bankrupt on some very erroneous beliefs that had to simply be worked out due to my upbringing (hanging on to believing because of how i was raised).
…I am obviously sharing this subsection of my life, because I feel that there is beauty in realizing that you’ve been wrong all or some of your life, and its always a good thing to be able to admit wrong to yourself, so that you can grow from it.

Absolutely, angelfrogfish. It took me over 50 years to arrive at, basically,
a similar conclusion - not identical, rather similar. See if this makes any sense to you -

I note both the complexity and the beauty in the world, and see a designer. The design of the human eye, alone, brings me to this conclusion. And even if I believed that human beings were the random ‘product’ of evolution, I look at my cat, and her dear ways, and think:
Pussycat is no ‘accident’ of nature. I could not state otherwise, and have any integrity whatsoever. To me, a designer exists.

So what does this mean? I say that I believe that a designer exists,
and that he is creator. Period.

I can still be puzzled by the evil that one sees or encounters in the world. The explanations offered by the major religions in the world make absolutely no sense to me. They create far
more questions. There is a needless complexity to religion.

I can say thank you to the designer for all that is good and beautiful. But you know what?
The designer, whom I think of as God, became clearer, not less clear.

One of the questions that I’ve asked, for 50 years, is this:
What’s the point of prayer, in the sense of wanting the designer to help? Does the designer need notification, from limited human beings, as to what is transpiring? Doesn’t the designer know that help is needed, especially when the innocent are suffering dreadfullly?

I can see this designer as benevolent = bene volare - “willing the good,” -
because now I don’t have to drum up complicated
explanations for why suffering is sometimes - often - not relieved.
I no longer have to jump through the hoops of doctrinal
faith statements, which just got me all the more confused.

What I do not understand I trust Him to know, the way a child trusts.

reen12

 

[sola_scriptura]

no such thing as “used to be Cahtolic”…

Once Catholic, always Catholic… (in at least some ways…)

like John Wesley’s “call to backsliders” … does this mean the church buys into OSAS?

 

[distracted]

like John Wesley’s “call to backsliders” … does this mean the church buys into OSAS?

no just that you are always Catholic, even in Hell…

 

[sola_scriptura]

no just that you are always Catholic, even in Hell…

So members of the body of Christ can be tossed in hell?

 

[Josh316]

I do believe that in your telling me that following Christ isn’t about feeling good, that you feel very good having a refutation that other Catholics will have little issue with on this forum. I am not compelled to believe something, out of fear of burning in hell or spending an eternity in church in the afterlife. I am compelled to believe something because all evidence points that it is true.

I believe I only said I was happier as an atheist in life, not that I was after a “feel good” experience. I am not after any experience at all, I’m wishing to see reality as it is. If I feel good in the process would that make it wrong? not in the least.

I understand that many of the people who followed up to this thread will similarly have knee-jerk reactions, maybe quoting from the Bible as if that were proof in itself, it isn’t. if faith means i will believe something despite all evidence to the contrary, then i certainly wouldn’t want to have faith. If i had faith when all evidence to the contrary suggested it wasn’t so, then i couldn’t so much for one second claim I was intellectually honest.

When people choose to be intellectually honest with themselves and the world, it makes the world a better place.

What evidence points to your version of truth? Certainly not science! If you want to look at it from a scientific stand point what created the very first “thing”? (atom or air or star or quark or whatever the very first thing was) it was made up of something. And when you give me an answer, if indeed you can, then I will say “and what was that molecule made up off”? over and over again until you see the reality that we will go in circles until you admit to yourself and me that something had to create it! To believe that the universe just popped into existence, or that it has always existed takes more faith than believing in God.

 

[Charlie_Zeaiter]

… If I believe and at least think I have this relationship with god would it really matter to me that I’m not also apart of a religious denomination…

Well, that would be your personal religious belief. But I think you’re wrong, because I’m of the Catholic faith. Our Catholic faith is dependent on the priesthood which can only be found in the Catholic Church via apostolic succession.

Our faith is dependent on the priest being able to i) absolve us of our sins in confession, and ii) lead a Mass and celebrate the Eucharist.

But you’re right; If you’re not of the Catholic faith, then why bother with a religious denomination.

Do you think in the Old Testament that God demanded the Israelites to be a part of organised religion?

 

[sola_scriptura]

What evidence points to your version of truth? Certainly not science! If you want to look at it from a scientific stand point what created the very first “thing”? (atom or air or star or quark or whatever the very first thing was) it was made up of something. And when you give me an answer, if indeed you can, then I will say “and what was that molecule made up off”? over and over again until you see the reality that we will go in circles until you admit to yourself and me that something had to create it! To believe that the universe just popped into existence, or that it has always existed takes more faith than believing in God.

Nice point. Indeed we know (contrary to Plato) the universe did not always exist (science has basically proven that much). As I said earlier if we reverse the bang it all collapses into nothing. So from nothing here we are! Every event has a preceding cause. This is equally true in logic, physics, and philosophy. Thus something that existed in nothingness caused the universe to exist. This much even science cannot dispute (in fact they’ve proven it for us).

 

[Swan]

When I first started coming to this forum I, too, was Catholic. I am no longer Cathoic and no longer Christian either. I do still believe in some sort of “god” - so in one sense I have a common belief with Deists in that I look at the order in the universe and conclude that there is some kind of higher power. Perhaps there are many “gods” - greater and lesser. Not sure. But I’ve had supernatural (for lack of a better term) experiences as well so I can’t just write off personal expreince (not religious and not sentimental) to conclude that there is no god of any kind.

Please note that my beliefs are based on my experiences. I have come to the conclusion that it is impossible to have a (genuine) belief in anything without relating it your personal experience. Or, perhaps I should say, having it grow and evolve out of your personal experience. I am bipolar and I guess the gist of my problem with God is the utter lack of his presence during my darkest periods. Either he (1) wouldn’t help me, or (2) couldn’t help me. The result was the same either way. It’s not about prayer being a letter to Santa, not about getting everything you want, but, for me, about getting peace and that sense that God is with you even in suffering (comfort, I guess). I didn’t.

Before anyone quotes scripture let me also say that I’ve done some research in the compliation and history of the Bible/scripture and have come to the conclusion that it is simply not something I can accept the claims about. Too many fingers in the pie, editing, oral stories, various versions, various agendas, etc.

Many people like to presume that people like myself just didn’t try hard enough to soul search enough or pray enough. But this is not a decision I come to lightly. It has taken my entire 49 years to get here. And it’s sad. It sounds so good on paper.

 

[notself]

Nice point. Indeed we know (contrary to Plato) the universe did not always exist (science has basically proven that much). As I said earlier if we reverse the bang it all collapses into nothing. So from nothing here we are! Every event has a preceding cause. This is equally true in logic, physics, and philosophy. Thus something that existed in nothingness caused the universe to exist. This much even science cannot dispute (in fact they’ve proven it for us).

Scientists hypothesize that the Big Bang came from a singularity, an incredibly small dense something. I am unaware of any physicist claiming that the universe came from nothing. In fact there is a hypothesis that the universe came into being through two “branes” banging into each other.

Here is a link to Nova’s “The Elegant Universe”.

pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/program.html

 

[notself]

What evidence points to your version of truth? Certainly not science! If you want to look at it from a scientific stand point what created the very first “thing”? (atom or air or star or quark or whatever the very first thing was) it was made up of something. And when you give me an answer, if indeed you can, then I will say “and what was that molecule made up off”? over and over again until you see the reality that we will go in circles until you admit to yourself and me that something had to create it! To believe that the universe just popped into existence, or that it has always existed takes more faith than believing in God.

Why does believing that the universe always existed [in various forms] take more faith than believing in a divine being that always existed?

 

[reen12]

quote: Swan

It has taken my entire 49 years to get here.

I understand. [my post # 64.]
I have been severely mentally ill, for 50 years.
I am sorry that you endure Bipolar, Swan.

reen12

 

[redrosetea]

Well we all have to do what we think is best…I would be crushed to lose my faith…I’m glad it doesn’t seem to upset you…Fr Groeschel has atheist friends and he says most of them are nice people…it is just the certain few that are like Christopher Hitchens

 

[sola_scriptura]

Scientists hypothesize that the Big Bang came from a singularity, an incredibly small dense something. I am unaware of any physicist claiming that the universe came from nothing. In fact there is a hypothesis that the universe came into being through two “branes” banging into each other.

Here is a link to Nova’s “The Elegant Universe”.

pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/program.html

Thanks for the link. I wouldn’t exactly characterize it as you did. The formula’s break down as we reverse the bang more and more, to the point where the results become unintelligible. So indeed the big bang itself remains a riddle as the Nova series tells us. I like the discussion of string theory; just goes to show how much we have yet to discover.

Frankly the idea of parallel universes seems a bit like science fiction rather than science – but it remains interesting, we’ll have to wait & see.

I’m still hoping for quantum computing and nano-technology. However, religion need not impeded our quest in these areas.

Being a Calvinist is a great religious perspective because when you understand that nothing happens without the will of God concerned it can make us more courageous and less wedded to medieval superstition. After all we invented the protestant work ethic & without us imagine what the west would look like?

However, without order we have no continuum. Society in constant chaos can never grow, we would keep repeating past mistakes. In such a state of chaos physics could have never moved from Newtonian to quantum mechanics as an example. We would continually move backwards, as we did in the dark ages. The Catholic Church to its credit preserved some semblance of the West during that period. So even atheists owe religion its due.

I suppose you think as Nietzsche did that we no longer need God. However, I couldn’t disagree more. In fact God reveals Himself in every age and pushes us forward, as He has since the beginning. Every time man becomes mired in error and stagnation He gives us new men. When we become mired in chaos He finds a way to bring us new order.

 

[ribozyme]

You might be happy now since you are no longer bound by the moral rules of the Catholic Church, but being a godless liberal, I can say that many times that I am not happy. Too many problems in the world and too much suffering. It actually makes me feel so hopeless.

I suppose there is the hedonic treadmill. Your happiness while you are an atheist will fall.

 

[Sublime_Prince]

You know I have had my bouts of athiesm too. I remember as a kid shortly after finding out there was no santa clause I was convinced that well God must be made up to to make us feel good. And I thought this for many years as a kid.

Then in high school God found me and rescued me and I started going to church again for a few years. I joined a bible study group and participated in many church activities

Then in college i got brainwashed by college professors who believed in evolution and left little room for God creating the earth in the picture. After taking anthropology and religous studies classes I was convinced there was no God and it was stupid to think there was one.

I also got suckered into all the data professors feed you about statically speaking religious people have lower IQ’s then atheists or people with little faith in God. They would say that 97% of all IVY league Science and Math professors who are members of Mensa and have IQ’s in the 140+ range don’t believe in God. And so I figured since all the geniuses in the world don’t believe in God there must not be one. So if I want to be smart I should be an atheist.

Unfortunately I really didn’t know the bible back then and didn’t know what it said. Not until I met my girlfriend who saved me from my atheist thinking. Had me re-baptized and renounce my faith in Jesus Christ as my savior. After I have read the lords words no matter what statistics or I learned at college I just can’t deny Christ. Its as plain as day to me. And now I am more happy then I have ever been because I found God in my life again.

 

[sola_scriptura]

You might be happy now since you are no longer bound by the moral rules of the Catholic Church, but being a godless liberal, I can say that many times that I am not happy. Too many problems in the world and too much suffering. It actually makes me feel so hopeless.

I suppose there is the hedonic treadmill. Your happiness while you are an atheist will fall.

Who knows why God creates suffering in this world, but know it will work out for the good. It can’t not … God is God!

 

[Josh316]

Why does believing that the universe always existed [in various forms] take more faith than believing in a divine being that always existed?

Why? are you serious? Think about that question. There has to be an explanation as to how the universe came into existence! The alternative would be that everything (life on earth) just so happened to “pop” up out of no where, with oxygen on only this planet, the sun perfectly aligned (which, by the way the universe must of just said "hey, I think I’ll create oxygen and a sun and all the necessary molecules and particles that don’t exist yet so Billions of years down the line a planet can pop up from what humans will call the big bang theory, and everything will fall into line nicely) etc etc (I honestly could go on and on) And can you imagine some loony (I don’t believe Jesus was loony, just hypothetical) called Jesus getting everyone to believe everything in the bible instead of just being able to get drunk and do what you want! The idea of a man being able to do that without divine intervention is absurd! (Of course being the second being in the Trinity doesn’t hurt)