I was told that suspending the common cup was out of fear & ignorance, & I was ignorant too

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Rasoleil

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Wow! I explained to a non-Catholic minister, a Lutheran ( Lutherans believe in the Real Presence), about how my church and archdiocese, as well as other archdioceses throughout the world, including the Church of England and Methodists, for example, have suspended the use of the common cup out of caution and safety of the church members due to the Coronivirus.
He informed me of my ignorance of the sterilization properties of the silver and gold of the chalice, as well sterlizing properties of the alcohol, that would kill the virus. And that we have to take both species as Christ commanded. He also said that the Precious Blood, by it’s very nature as being Christ’s blood, that it, too, would kill the virus. The wine/Blood of Christ is not a cesspool, he also said.
Additionally, he knows me and knows that I am an EMHC, so his calling me ignorant is especially hurtfull, treating me like I’m stupid, particularly when it comes to the Chalice & Precious Blood. I take my duties as a EMHC seriously. It’s a tremendous honor.
 
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I’m so sorry you experienced that sort of reaction. Trust your bishop and know that God recognizes your efforts and attitude toward the Precious Blood.
 
Rasoleil said:
Wow! I explained to a non-Catholic minister, a Lutheran ( Lutherans believe in the Real Presence), about how my church and archdiocese, as well as other archdioceses throughout the world, including the Church of England and Methodists, for example, have suspended the use of the common cup out of caution and safety of the church members due to the Coronivirus.
He informed me of my ignorance of the sterilization properties of the silver and gold of the chalice, as well sterlizing properties of the alcohol, that would kill the virus. And that we have to take both species as Christ commanded. He also said that the Precious Blood, by it’s very nature as being Christ’s blood, that it, too, would kill the virus. The wine/Blood of Christ is not a cesspool, he also said.
Additionally, he knows me and knows that I am an EMHC, so his calling me ignorant is especially hurtfull, treating me like I’m stupid, particularly when it comes to the Chalice & Precious Blood. I take my duties as a EMHC seriously. It’s a tremendous honor.
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First, AFAIK, Lutherans do not believe in the real presence as Catholics do. Catholics believe in transsubstantion; if I recall correctly, they believe in consubstantion.

Second, gold and silver have sterilization properties?

Third, the whole thing about Christ’s Blood killing the coronavirus, while sounding pious, is not a guarantee. It sounds almost like those snake-handling churches that make you feel that you are not a Christian if you don’t handle poisonous snakes, and if you do get bitten and suffer harm, it’s because you didn’t have enough faith. Also, the accidents of the wine remain, and as I recall the wine used in consecration is 12-15% alcohol; however, to kill the coronavirus, experts recommend that the alcohol percentage be at least 60%, which is why one vodka company asked that people stop saying that its vodka can be used in homemade hand-sanitizer recipes.

So, if there is anybody ignorant, it certainly is not you or the bishops.
 
I’ve seen Lutheran churches use those little tiny individual communion cups – would he call those Luther pastors ignorant?
Do any Lutheran churches use the common cup? I don’t believe I ever saw one.
 
Doing a google search, I came up with an article saying due to the “Oligodynamic Effect” some metals kill off bacteria. It’s from 2013.
The Oligodynamic Effect: How Some Metals Kill Off Bacteria ← it includes a link to a study paper from 2009.

On the other side of the coin, so to speak, I found two medical studies -
American Journal of Infection ControlOctober 1998 * Volume 26 * Number 5 Risk of Infectious Disease Transmission from a Common Communion Cup

BACTERIA ON THE COMMON COMMUNION CUP 1995 ← this is also found on Annals of Internal Medicene, but you need to sign up to read the full text as no abstract is available (as is usually the case).

from the Journal of Infectious Diseases: 1943; 73:180-190 SURVIVAL OF BACTERIA ON THE SILVER COMMUNION CUP ← study on bacteria, so not sure if the same would apply to a virus.
 
His church uses both, depending on who wants to drink from the chalice or the little cups.
 
I did know how the churches differ in their beliefs in the Real Presence. I used the term because the Lutheran churches uses it as well, as you know. I appreciate your post and your support. Thank you.
 
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There are two points of contact using a chalice 1) the lips to the rim of the cup and 2) the hands on the middle of the chalice.

There is probably more concern about the hand contact in the decision to not use the chalices.

In the midst of this global pandemic, who cannot understand the concern?

I"m in the highest risk category – elderly with chronic illnesses.

I went out into public during the last week and I saw people coughing and hacking every place I went, and these people were not using the slightest hygiene measures to avoid spreading their germs to others – not the slightest at all.

i made a decision based on public health recommendations to not go to Mass - to avoid being around sick people in such close quarters.

Containment is the first strategy that is being used in this pandemic, and I’m using the best medical advice. The virus will be in my town before anybody knows it is here. They said to “get ready” NOW.
 
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I’m sorry you experienced that. He wasn’t very polite.

Ironically I just had a safety training at work where they informed us alcohol doesn’t actually kill bacteria. It just keeps it from growing or something like that.
 
Poor Lutherans! Did they mention the selling of indulgences?
 
strita said:
There is probably more concern about the hand contact in the decision to not use the chalices.
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That’s actually what our bishop said in his letter discontinuing Communion from the Chalice for the time being.
 
Exactly. I don’t know if the CDC or anybody has had time to research if the alcohol in wine does anything to disinfect coronaviruses. Who would want to take the chance? I don’t know why it’s so popular to make communion under both species. A lot of people are antsy about getting out of church after Mass, and I think having both species for Communion slows things down considerably.
 
Yes, CDC says people over 60 should avoid going out and about. Good call.
 
Sadly, I had a good friend yesterday refer to all of us who abide by our Bishop’s guidelines as “ye of little faith”.
 
There are more articles than one can even read on the topic. Wine has a very low content of alcohol, lower than say vodka. Wine makers sterilize their bottles and equipment. If the wine itself was enough to kill bacteria or viruses, who bother with sterilization.
 
Rasoleil said:
He informed me … that we have to take both species as Christ commanded.
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In his opinion, and perhaps the opinion of his denomination.

The Catholic Church doesn’t make the claim he does. The Church professes a belief in “concomitance” (stated simply, where the Body of Christ is, so too is the Blood, Soul, and Divinity, and also where the Blood of Christ is, so too is the Body, Soul, and Divinity). You’re “ignorant”? He’s showing ignorance of the teachings of the Catholic Church. 😉
He also said that the Precious Blood, by it’s very nature as being Christ’s blood, that it, too, would kill the virus.
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I’m sure he thinks that that’s a nice pious thought, but it’s rather superstitious. The “accidents of wine” have no such properties, nor does the Church teach that the Eucharist wards off physical ailments. Again… “ignorant”? :roll_eyes:

Say a prayer for the man. It’s probably the most charitable response you can make to his claims.
 
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Norseman82 said:
It sounds almost like those snake-handling churches that make you feel that you are not a Christian if you don’t handle poisonous snakes, and if you do get bitten and suffer harm, it’s because you didn’t have enough faith.
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