Identify Documents by the Pope that are infallible

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OK kids, I’m not sure where the idea that OS or HV either one were examples of infallibility, I know some commentators thought it might have been, but according to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, neither meet the requirements of PAPAL INFALLIBILITY…the last such Document was in 1950 with the definition of the Dogma of the Assumption of Mary. However, there is another type of infallibility that isn’t quite as set in stone as Papal Infallibility, and that is the Infallibility of the Ordinary and Universal Magesterium…the Pope in Bishops teaching together…and this is the NORM…There is no definite list of either Papal or OUM infallible pronouncements…but if you had a question on a specific one you could write to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith to ask…they’ve published a partial list.
 
That was very thorough and all, Manny, but it did not even begin to answer the question I asked.

Thank you anyway.

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Atemi said:
If you have a source of where the RC Magisterium has infallibly listed all past infallible papal pronouncements, please post it here. I would love to see it.

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Why do you need a list? We, as Catholics, are expected by God to obey all the teachings of His Church.
 
  • **The teaching office **
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888 Bishops, with priests as co-workers, have as their first task “to preach the Gospel of God to all men,” in keeping with the Lord’s command.415 They are “heralds of faith, who draw new disciples to Christ; they are authentic teachers” of the apostolic faith "endowed with the authority of Christ."416
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889 In order to preserve the Church in the purity of the faith handed on by the apostles, Christ who is the Truth willed to confer on her a share in his own infallibility. By a “supernatural sense of faith” the People of God, under the guidance of the Church’s living Magisterium, "unfailingly adheres to this faith."417
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890 The mission of the Magisterium is linked to the definitive nature of the covenant established by God with his people in Christ. It is this Magisterium’s task to preserve God’s people from deviations and defections and to guarantee them the objective possibility of professing the true faith without error. Thus, the pastoral duty of the Magisterium is aimed at seeing to it that the People of God abides in the truth that liberates. To fulfill this service, Christ endowed the Church’s shepherds with the charism of infallibility in matters of faith and morals. The exercise of this charism takes several forms:
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891 “The Roman Pontiff, head of the college of bishops, enjoys this infallibility in virtue of his office, when, as supreme pastor and teacher of all the faithful - who confirms his brethren in the faith he proclaims by a definitive act a doctrine pertaining to faith or morals. . . . The infallibility promised to the Church is also present in the body of bishops when, together with Peter’s successor, they exercise the supreme Magisterium,” above all in an Ecumenical Council.418 When the Church through its supreme Magisterium proposes a doctrine "for belief as being divinely revealed,"419 and as the teaching of Christ, the definitions "must be adhered to with the obedience of faith."420 This infallibility extends as far as the deposit of divine Revelation itself.421
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892 Divine assistance is also given to the successors of the apostles, teaching in communion with the successor of Peter, and, in a particular way, to the bishop of Rome, pastor of the whole Church, when, without arriving at an infallible definition and without pronouncing in a “definitive manner,” they propose in the exercise of the ordinary Magisterium a teaching that leads to better understanding of Revelation in matters of faith and morals. To this ordinary teaching the faithful "are to adhere to it with religious assent"422 which, though distinct from the assent of faith, is nonetheless an extension of it.
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scborromeo.org/ccc/p123a9p4.htm
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(continued in next post)
 
(second part of post)

The Catechism of the Catholic Church is a statement of our beliefs. The beliefs contained therein are INFALLIBLE TEACHINGS of the Catholic Church. In the beginning of the * Catechism * is an apostolic letter “Laetamur Magnopere” written and signed by Pope John Paul II, in which he states his approval and promulgation:

“Drawn up by the special Commission of Cardinals and Bishops established in 1986, the Catechism was approved and promulated by me in the aforementioned Apostolic Constitution, which today retains all its validity and timeliness, and finds its definitive achievement in this Latin typical edition.”

Pope John Paul II wrote that is a “full, complete exposition of Catholic octrine, enabling everyone to know what the Church professes, celebrates, lives, and prays in her daily life … it faithfully repeats the doctrinal content which I officially prseented to the Church and to the world in December 1992.”

“With today’s promulgation of the Latin typical edition, therefore, the task of composing the Catechism, begun in 1986, is brought to a close and the desire of the aforementioned Extraordinary Synod of Bishops is happily fulfilled. The Church now has at her disposal this new, authoritative exposition of the one and perennialapostolic faith, and it will serve as a ‘valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion’ and as a ‘sure norm for teaching the faith,’ as well as a ‘sure and authentic refrence text’ for preparing local catechisms (cf. Apostolic Constitution Fidei Depositum, no. 4).”

In a second letter published within the Catechism,* Fidei Depositum*, Pope John Paul II proclaims:

"Guarding the Deposit of Faith is the mission which the Lord entrusted to His Church, and which she fulfills in every age. The Second Vatican Ecumenical Council, which was opened 30 years ago by my predecessor Pope John XXIII, of happy memory, had as its intention and purpose to highlight the Church’s apostolic and pastoral missiona nd by making the truth of the Gospel shine forth to lead all people to seek and receive Christ’slove which surpasses all knowledge (cf.* Eph*. 3:19).

"The principal task entrusted to the Council by Pope John XXIII was to guard and present better the precious deposit of Christian doctrine in order to make it more accessible to the Christian faithful and to all people of good will…

“The Catechism of the Catholic Church, which I approved June 25th last and the publication of which I today oder by virtue of my Apostolic Authority, is a statement of the Church’s faith and of catholic doctrine, attested to or illumined by Sacred Scripture, the Apostolic Tradition, and the Church’s Magisterium. I declare it to be a sure norm for teaching the faith and thus a valid and legitimate instrument for ecclesial communion…”

October 11, 1992
 
Atemi said:
I am sorry, but is Henry Denzinger the Catholic Magisterium?

If I wanted a Catholic’s opinion on the subject, I can pick one of the 25 different ones we find in this thread alone.

I guess that list is still forthcoming. Thanks anyway.

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“but is Henry Denzinger ***the Catholic Magisterium” ***
***The Catholic Magisterium ***is the teaching authority of the Church it not a list or physical thing. Denzinger is a collection of Magisterial statements.
 
Br.Rich_SFO said:
“but is Henry Denzinger ***the Catholic Magisterium” ***
***The Catholic Magisterium ***is the teaching authority of the Church it not a list or physical thing. Denzinger is a collection of Magisterial statements.
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Does one of those Magisterial statements include an infallible list of all the past infallible papal pronouncements?

If not, we are still dealing with the differing opinions of Catholic after Catholic.

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Atemi said:
Does one of those Magisterial statements include an infallible list of all the past infallible papal pronouncements?
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What the past Popes have ma/de are repeated statement by their successors.
If not, we are still dealing with the differing opinions of Catholic after Catholic.
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When teaching moral and faith, they aren’t different opinions. They only affirm that already been revealed by Word of God, which include Sacred Scripture and Sacred Tradition.
 
Atemi said:
I am sorry, but is Henry Denzinger the Catholic Magisterium?

If I wanted a Catholic’s opinion on the subject, I can pick one of the 25 different ones we find in this thread alone.

I guess that list is still forthcoming. Thanks anyway.

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The Magisterial Teaching isn’t a laundry list. If you want a list, take a look at our Ten Commandments.
 
Mannyfit75 said:
The Magisterial Teaching isn’t a laundry list. If you want a list, take a look at our Ten Commandments.
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Are you saying that the Catholic Magisterium does not know which past papal pronouncements are infallible?

Or are you saying they refuse to tell us?

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Atemi said:
Are you saying that the Catholic Magisterium does not know which past papal pronouncements are infallible?
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No I did not say that. The Magisterial Teachings is based on the writings of the earlier Popes, and Church Councils.
Or are you saying they refuse to tell us?
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Where did you get that conclusion? If you thoroughly look into the history on doctrinal development you would probably get some idea.
 
Mannyfit75 said:
I can note two, the Ineffabilis Deus by Pope Pius IX which defined the Immaculate Conception (December 8, 1854) and Munificentissimus Deus (Nov 1, 1950 by Pope Pius XII which defined the Assumption of Mary.

Humanae Vitae, On Human Life Encyclical Letter of Pope Paul VI is also infallible because within contains moral teachings on the issue of human life from its natural birth to natural death.
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The document, whatever it is, that defines papal infallibility isn’t considered infallible? Oh the irony 😃
 
Atemi said:
Does one of those Magisterial statements include an infallible list of all the past infallible papal pronouncements?

If not, we are still dealing with the differing opinions of Catholic after Catholic.

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The vatican does maintain a list of Magisterial or Dogmatic statements by Popes and Councils. A list of these would not be an infallible list because infallibility applies to teachings on matter of Faith and Morals to documents. Which was the same thing I said in my first post that Documents are never infallible, but that they can and do contain Infallible teaching. The Catechism as a summary of this teaching is called a “sure norm”, bit is itself not declared infallible, as a document.
 
Atemi said:
Does one of those Magisterial statements include an infallible list of all the past infallible papal pronouncements?

If not, we are still dealing with the differing opinions of Catholic after Catholic.

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Hi Atemi,

Perhaps an analogy will help.

Christians (Protestants and Catholics) believe the teaching in the Bible (various books written over almost two thousand years and compiled into a single book) is inerrant. Yet the teaching in it is not condensed somewhere into a list of separate statements giving all the inerrant doctrines contained in it - for Bible believing Christians to refer to. Even if there were such a list, the list would not be Scripture; that is, It would not have the same assurance of inerrancy as the Scripture itself.

In this analogy, the various Magisterial or Dogmatic statements compare to Scripture. {These documents have been written over almost two thousand years also, and Denzinger has collected and published them.} There are various lists that have been made but they do not have the assurance of infallibility. I don’t know how complete any list would be.

A good book is “Fundamentals of Catholic Dogma” by Ludwig Ott. It notes Catholic teachings and gives the degree of theological certainty (which are dogmatic and which are not.)

God bless,
Nita
 
Calvinator said:
The document, whatever it is, that defines papal infallibility isn’t considered infallible? Oh the irony 😃
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Let me make this clear. I am sorry in anyway that I may mislead you.

According to the teaching of the Catholic Church, the Pope can declare Ex-Cathedra as well as the entire Catholic Church, we call the Magisterial authority (the bishops in union with the Pope).

The Document that defined papal infallibility was defined is consider infallible.

Let me quote the following:
In the conclusion of the fourth chapter of its** Dogmatic Constitution on the Church Pastor Aeternus**, solemnly promulgated by Pope Pius IX, the First Vatican Council in 1870 declared the following:
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“ We teach and define that it is a dogma Divinely revealed that the Roman pontiff when he speaks ex cathedra, that is when in discharge of the office of pastor and doctor of all Christians, by virtue of his supreme Apostolic authority, he defines a doctrine regarding faith or morals to be held by the universal Church, by the Divine assistance promised to him in Blessed Peter, is possessed of that infallibility with which the Divine Redeemer willed that his Church should be endowed in defining doctrine regarding faith or morals, and that therefore such definitions of the Roman pontiff are of themselves and not from the consent of the Church irreformable. So then, should anyone, which God forbid, have the temerity to reject this definition of ours: let him be anathema. (see Denziger §1839).
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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papal_infallibility

The First Vatican Council like other Council clear doctrined much like the early Church Councils. I have also posted here, that the Church speaking through the Councils and the writing concerning faith issue are infallible. Even if they are not declared a statement.

The first Vatican Council also defined a doctrine that was already revealed but never defined much like the Trinity which took 300 yrs to develop.

The difference between the Immaculate Conception and Assumption was that it was not declared in a Church Council. It was professed by Pope’s declaration on the document which I have provided.

You need to understand that the Pope and the Magisterial can teach infallibility when it comes to moral and faith teachings.
 
Br.Rich_SFO said:
The vatican does maintain a list of Magisterial or Dogmatic statements by Popes and Councils. A list of these would not be an infallible list because infallibility applies to teachings on matter of Faith and Morals to documents. Which was the same thing I said in my first post that Documents are never infallible, but that they can and do contain Infallible teaching. The Catechism as a summary of this teaching is called a “sure norm”, bit is itself not declared infallible, as a document.
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The Vatican does maintain a list of Magisterial or Dogmatic statements by Popes and Councils. A list of these would not be an infallible list because infallibility applies to teachings on matter of Faith and Morals **NOT **to documents. Which was the same thing I said in my first post that Documents are never infallible, but that they can and do contain Infallible teaching. The Catechism as a summary of this teaching is called a “sure norm”, but is itself not declared infallible, as a document.
 
Br.Rich_SFO said:
The Vatican does maintain a list of Magisterial or Dogmatic statements by Popes and Councils. A list of these would not be an infallible list because infallibility applies to teachings on matter of Faith and Morals **NOT **to documents. Which was the same thing I said in my first post that Documents are never infallible, but that they can and do contain Infallible teaching. The Catechism as a summary of this teaching is called a “sure norm”, but is itself not declared infallible, as a document.
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Well said.
 
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