Idols

[Wholly_Spirit]

What a croc. Someone REALLY had to work to come up that excuse…and it’s not even in the Bible.

 

[Church_Militant]

What a croc.

 

[planter654]

No.

In the case of Catholics, we don’t need statues to pray to God. Idol worshippers do, because the idol is their literal god. In the case of the Greeks, what source are you citing to corroborate your contention that the Greeks did not consider their statues to be actual gods?

Above… Your Quote…“We as Catholics don’t need statues to pray to God, idol worshippers do”. No! we as Catholics don’t worship them. We just make them, put them in OUR Churches, cover them in Gold, Sell them, Bless them, kiss them, kneel, Bow before them etc. Bring a Statue of the Blessed Mother all the way from Rome to Canada etc etc. But after we done all that, “Were not responsable” if people get hooked on them and worship them. No! were Catholics. But myself as a Catholic we don’t worship them… NOoooooooooo we do not worship the

Yah right we got this practice out of the bible. I better go back and read I know God said this time he will destroy the earth by fire not a flood… The stone painted with black to make eyes is NOT GOD. Stones are used for driveways etc. Hello…

 

[Church_Militant]

The truth is that the man made images of the Lord Jesus on the cross are false. These false man made images of the Lord Jesus show a lack of reverence and respect for the blessed Lord Jesus.

Bunk! You cannot show any truth to such a statement. It might be valid as your personal opinion, but it ion no way reflects anything that the Word of God says.

If anything, your remarks seem to display an inclination to place your own interpretations and opinions higher tan the Word of God, regardless of what other ways in which you might assert otherwise.

The reason I say this is because no man made image can recreate the awesome sacrificial death of the blessed Lord Jesus on the cross.

And yet the very words of the Gospel accounts are indeed the writings and “images” created by men. Will you now proceed to the next logical conclusion that they too are inadequate and then deride them as well?

The Lord Jesus is truly awesome and what the Lord Jesus did on the cross is so, so truly awesome. When I read the God inspired account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross in the Sacred Scriptures im truly amazed at His great awesome sacrifice.

And no Catholic will have an issue with that and in fact most faithful Catholics (like myself) find the same experience, and yet there is nothing lessened by the various reverent artistic expressions of Our Lord’s suffering.

There is no biblical support for your position.

The false man made images of the Lord Jesus on the cross are a gross insult to our blessed Lord Jesus and to what He did on the cross.

In your very limited and biased opinion, which is not supported by the Word of God.

I mean how dare any feeble man make a false image of the Lord Jesus on the cross and take away from what the blessed Lord Jesus did on the cross.

This is rhetorical propaganda without substance. You cannot provide even the remotest scriptural support for this or even that these crucifixes do indeed “take away from what the blessed Lord Jesus did on the cross”. It’s just not there.

I have seen false man made images of the Lord Jesus on the cross and they’re all so sanitized, they don’t show the true terrible suffering and agony that the Lord Jesus endured on the cross.

Sanitized? Then you have not seen all the ones that I have seen. Personally, every crucifix I see is overwhelming in the terrible sacrifice that My Lord suffered for me, and I take offense at your derision of them. You need to have some respect for those of us who contemplate all that sacrifice was.

The truth is no man made image can recreate what the Lord Jesus did on the cross and any attempt by any person to do this is a gross insult to the blessed Lord Jesus. The God inspired 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross tells us what actually happened to the Lord Jesus on the cross. God’s 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross truly gives honor and glory to the Lord Jesus.

Yet it is all the writings of mere men. Their best efforts to convey, even as any artist might, the power of the crucifixion.

There’s no need for false man made images of the Lord Jesus on the cross to help people to remember His perfect sacrifice because God has give us His inspired 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross in His written Word, the Sacred Scriptures.

There’s nothing in the New Testament that ever says that there is any need for even the written account that you are so pleased with, and the Lord certainly never commissioned any such accounts any more than He commissioned such images in other media.

Your whole tirade and position is grossly errant and specious.

 

[Cling2Cross]

CHAPTER TWO: “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF”

ARTICLE 4: THE FOURTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [The Family in God's Plan](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a4.htm#I)
     II. [The Family and Society](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a4.htm#II)
    III. [The Duties of Family and the Kingdom](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a4.htm#III)
     IV. [The Family and the Kingdom](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a4.htm#IV)
      V. [The Authorities in Civil Society](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a4.htm#V)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 5: THE FIFTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [Respect for Human Life](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a5.htm#I)
     II. [Respect for the Dignity of Persons](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a5.htm#II)
    III. [Safeguarding Peace](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a5.htm#III)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 6: THE SIXTH COMMANDMENT

      I. ["Male and Female He Created Them . . ."](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#I)
     II. [The Vocation to Chastity](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#II)
    III. [The Love of Husband and Wife](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#III)
     IV. [Offenses against the Dignity of Marriage](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a6.htm#IV)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 7: THE SEVENTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [The Universal Destination and the Private Ownership of Goods](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#I)
     II. [Respect for Persons and Their Goods](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#II)
    III. [The Social Doctrine of the Church](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#III)
     IV. [Economic Activity and Social Justice](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#IV)
      V. [Justice and Solidarity among Nations](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#V)
     VI. [Love for the Poor](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a7.htm#VI)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 8: THE EIGHTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [Living in the Truth](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#I)
     II. [To Bear Witness to the Truth](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#II)
    III. [Offenses against Truth](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#III)
     IV. [Respect for the Truth](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#IV)
      V. [The Use of the Social Communications Media](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#V)
     VI. [Truth, Beauty, and Sacred Art](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a8.htm#VI)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 9: THE NINTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [Purification of the Heart](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a9.htm#I)
     II. [The Battle for Purity](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a9.htm#II)

IN BRIEF

ARTICLE 10: THE TENTH COMMANDMENT

      I. [The Disorder of Covetous Desires](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a0.htm#I)
     II. [The Desires of the Spirit](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a0.htm#II)
    III. [Poverty of Heart](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a0.htm#III)
     IV. ["I Want to See God"](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/p3s2c2a0.htm#IV)

IN BRIEF

Now try to tell us that we don’t know what we’re talking about or that we don’t read and study the Word of God.

You have not answered my posts very thoroughly.

 

[Church_Militant]

You have not answered my posts very thoroughly.

I disagree…But I doubt you have taken the time to check all that I have offered you. The fact is that I have thoroughly answered your posts. Study for yourself.
Get the facts. Decide for yourself.

Looks like you deleted your post as I was answering it. Good idea.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

The truth is no man made image can recreate what the Lord Jesus did on the cross and any attempt by any person to do this is a gross insult to the blessed Lord Jesus.

And the Gospel was written by whom? Angels?

Really, if you trully think that the words written in the Holy Bible about our Lord’s death trully depict the reality of crucifixtion, then you’re naive. Have you seen Mel Gibson’s *Passion of Christ *? The Gospels are a tale for little children compared to the suffering depicted in this movie, yet this movie is still far from the reality. And that is especially true if you are were a person heading to the Calvary.

There’s no need for false man made images of the Lord Jesus on the cross to help people to remember His perfect sacrifice because God has give us His inspired 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross in His written Word, the Sacred Scriptures.

For about 1500 year more than 90% of people coudn’t read, suffered from poverty and had no way to read the scripture. Yet you would take away from them the crucifix and give them YOUR empty words…

 

[Jerry-Jet]

Sola scriptura is an idol.

 

[planter654]

You must not have been to one lately… they are adorned with all kids of art.

And while we’re on the subject… didn’t you ever read the description of the temple of Solomon? The one that the Jews will someday rebuild? It’s right there beginning in 1st Kings 6. Read that and then tell me that the Jews and God reject images. It’s just simply not true just as it is not true that Catholics are idolaters and worship images.

Hello! what happen to the first “one” temple in Jerusalem? I think there is one wall standing? Oh, remember, I have read alot on this site were alot of Catholics give replys that we do not go by what is in the OLd Testament, we don’t go by that now! Is there “ONE BIBLE BOOK” or is there two? Do we not seem to picking from the Old when it fits our needs.

To me the Old Temple did not work or save us, don’t you think? Jesus came and said he was going to do what in three days? In the end, what did God say and promise what is coming, a new what?

Remember Jesus got angry and where, for the first time? Was it not in the temple. MY FATHERS HOUSE IS A HOUSE OF PRAYER. Jesus even made a cord and turn what over and what were they selling? I don’t remember reading that Jesus carried in or craved a statue or brought it into the temple to teach them about God. Who by the way, they did not see God either? Nor did Jesus tell the Apostles to do such evil practices.

Jesus also came to reteach the laws etc. For they were being lead astray by whom in the temple? Also to release those held underbondage for practicing their faith. Jesus said: Not ONE title of the law or jot have I come to change, but even added a new commandment.

Jesus even referred to Isaias…what did Isaias say have you not read, have you not heard, have you not studied what was said? Jesus did not say ignore it and now it no longer is important. God is not a foolish God.

God does not change he is the great I AM.

Look at all the idols we have in this world? Are we not slaves to them?

 

[Wholly_Spirit]

I don’t remember reading that Jesus carried in or craved a statue or brought it into the temple to teach them about God. Who by the way, they did not see God either? Nor did Jesus tell the Apostles to do such evil practices.

I don’t recall Jesus commanding his apostles to hand out bibles so every one could read the word of God…but that’s not stopping you.

 

[planter654]

And the Gospel was written by whom? Angels?

Really, if you trully think that the words written in the Holy Bible about our Lord’s death trully depict the reality of crucifixtion, then you’re naive. Have you seen Mel Gibson’s *Passion of Christ *? The Gospels are a tale for little children compared to the suffering depicted in this movie, yet this movie is still far from the reality. And that is especially true if you are were a person heading to the Calvary.

For about 1500 year more than 90% of people coudn’t read, suffered from poverty and had no way to read the scripture. Yet you would take away from them the crucifix and give them YOUR empty words…

I think they were alot poorer in Moses time and he did not make them a statue.

Could you please explain your last paragraph, please I am a bit confused? Thanks

 

[Wholly_Spirit]

I think they were alot poorer in Moses time and he did not make them a statue.

Snake on a stake.

 

[Church_Militant]

Hello! what happen to the first “one” temple in Jerusalem? I think there is one wall standing? Oh, remember, I have read alot on this site were alot of Catholics give replys that we do not go by what is in the OLd Testament, we don’t go by that now! Is there “ONE BIBLE BOOK” or is there two? Do we not seem to picking from the Old when it fits our needs.

I don’t know where you come from with all this, but you sound more protestant than Catholic.

The point is that since a-Cs use the OT to attack the Catholic use of images, it is appropriate to show them that even in then the prohibition was not as they allege against the Catholic Church.

To me the Old Temple did not work or save us, don’t you think? Jesus came and said he was going to do what in three days? In the end, what did God say and promise what is coming, a new what?

I don’t recall saying that it did nor would any knowledgeable and faithful Catholic because it would be untrue.

Remember Jesus got angry and where, for the first time? Was it not in the temple. MY FATHERS HOUSE IS A HOUSE OF PRAYER. Jesus even made a cord and turn what over and what were they selling?

This is pretty well irrelevant to this topic…

I don’t remember reading that Jesus carried in or craved a statue or brought it into the temple to teach them about God. Who by the way, they did not see God either? Nor did Jesus tell the Apostles to do such evil practices.

Again… irrelevant, but I’d love to know just what “evil practices” you refer to there???

Jesus also came to reteach the laws etc. For they were being lead astray by whom in the temple? Also to release those held underbondage for practicing their faith. Jesus said: Not ONE title of the law or jot have I come to change, but even added a new commandment.

Relevance?

Jesus even referred to Isaias…what did Isaias say have you not read, have you not heard, have you not studied what was said? Jesus did not say ignore it and now it no longer is important. God is not a foolish God.

More cosmic irrelevance…

God does not change he is the great I AM.

Wow! Something I can agree with! That’s nice. Still… this seems to lack relevance again.

Look at all the idols we have in this world? Are we not slaves to them?

Not the point at all and therefore largely irrelevant. We are talking here about images in the Catholic Church and not the insanity and idolatry of the society around us.

 

[Asa]

And yet the very words of the Gospel accounts are indeed the writings and “images” created by men. Will you now proceed to the next logical conclusion that they too are inadequate and then deride them as well?

Yet it is all the writings of mere men. Their best efforts to convey, even as any artist might, the power of the crucifixion.There’s nothing in the New Testament that ever says that there is any need for even the written account that you are so pleased with, and the Lord certainly never commissioned any such accounts any more than He commissioned such images in other media.

Your response clearly demonstrates the fact that when someone doesn’t show reverence and respect to the Lord Jesus by using false man made images of Him on the cross to remember His perfect sacrifice. Then they will also fail to show reverence and respect to God for giving us His 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross in the Sacred Scriptures.

God is perfect and His written Word is 100% true!

Man made images of the blessed Lord Jesus on the cross are false and an insult to the Lord Jesus and what He did on the cross to save sinners!

 

[planter654]

… and to the guy who mentioned the Jews: the making of the cherubim images was a command of God. I don’t know why, but i know it wasnt because he wanted the Isrealites to worship the cherubim… Go into a synagogue and hunt around for images. You won’t find any.

I am a Catholic and I agree with this one, it was a “COMMAND” of God and had great meaning.

God Bless

 

[Church_Militant]

Snake on a stake.

Yep made of brass and lifted up for those who looked to it to be healed from the snake bites and live. Pointed out in the New Testament as a type and foreshadowing of Our Lord on the cross.

As for poorer in Mose’s day? Don’t think so…seeing as the Israelites had just pretty thoroughly plundered Egypt before leaving. I don’t think someone knows their Bible quite as well as they think they do.

 

[Church_Militant]

Your response clearly demonstrates the fact that when someone doesn’t show reverence and respect to the Lord Jesus by using false man made images of Him on the cross to remember His perfect sacrifice. Then they will also fail to show reverence and respect to God for giving us His 100% true account of the Lord Jesus’ death on the cross in the Sacred Scriptures.

And your response shows a contempt for the Catholic faith that violates the forum rules.

Furthermore, You cannot show, and have not shown so far a single scripture that supports your remarks to me above. You have only offered your own errant interpretation as if it is gospel truth when in fact it is not. Your opinion, is not divinely inspired though perhaps you think it is.

God is perfect and His written Word is 100% true!

To which I and all the knowledgeable and faithful Catholics here at CAF will say AMEN and ALLELUIA!

Man made images of the blessed Lord Jesus on the cross are false and an insult to the Lord Jesus and what He did on the cross to save sinners!

As if restating your personal interpretation and opinion (again) gives it more validity than it had all the other times.

No substantive scriptural support means it’s just noisy gongs and clanging cymbals.

 

[Asa]

Yep made of brass and lifted up for those who looked to it to be healed from the snake bites and live. Pointed out in the New Testament as a type and foreshadowing of Our Lord on the cross.

As for poorer in Mose’s day? Don’t think so…seeing as the Israelites had just pretty thoroughly plundered Egypt before leaving. I don’t think someone knows their Bible quite as well as they think they do.

He removed the high places and broke the sacred pillars, cut down the wooden image and broke in pieces the bronze serpent that Moses had made; for until those days the children of Israel burned incense to it, and called it Nehushtan. 2Kgs 18:4

 

[Church_Militant]

I am a Catholic and I agree with this one, it was a “COMMAND” of God and had great meaning.

God Bless

And no one here has asserted that anyone did worship them, even as no one here has asserted that we adore any image.

 

[planter654]

I don’t know where you come from with all this, but you sound more protestant than Catholic.

I am on topic, it is about Idols.

Images ok lets talk images my friend!

Why are there ONLY A “WHITE IMAGES IN THE CATHOLIC” CHURCH, AND YES I AM CATHOLIC BUT LATELY I WOULD LIKE TO RATHER CALL MYSELF… A LITTLE CHILD OF GOD.

I ask you why A white God "all WHITE images, all WHITE STATUES, ALL WHITE PAINTINGS, ALL WHITE GOD I am white, but did God not create Black children, Mexican children, AFRICAN children etc etc.?

God Bless I serve him first…a little child of God