If Catholicism is true why there are still Jews?

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I was discussing with my friends about the church, and one of them is trying to convert to catholicism, but he have some doubts, he asked me: "Hey, if Catholicism is true why there are still jews?
Because He want’s us to seek Him. He knows that if it is too easy we will simple invent questions. Onlly those who sincerely seek to find the answers will find the Truth.
What is he converting from? Is he Protestant? Jewish? Muslim. Athiest?
 
Most of the ambiguity results from modern interpreters attempting to impose the writing styles and techniques of today on ancient texts. The more that these texts are read from the point of view of the writers with a sympathetic and not critical eye, the more they come to life in the larger context of their purpose in salvation history. It is surprising how consistent and informative Scriptures are when read with the eyes of faith, but how truly confounding but rich for “quote mining” they are to the cynic. That in itself speaks something of their “divine” quality.
PP this is pure assertion the truth of which is even harder to demonstrate than the difficulties this assertion is meant to bolster 🤷. In other words its no more than a re-stating of the original issue (albeit in a different scenario) from the same point of view yo have re the original issue.The only difference is that , presumably, those who don’t agree with this allegedly “objective” justification are subtely lampooned and derided as “critical”, “not sympathetic”, “without faith”, “cynical”.

Its the typical circular reasoning of a “true believer”. Surely we can do better than that :confused:.
 
PP this is pure assertion the truth of which is even harder to demonstrate than the difficulties this assertion is meant to bolster 🤷. In other words its no more than a re-stating of the original issue (albeit in a different scenario) from the same point of view yo have re the original issue.The only difference is that , presumably, those who don’t agree with this allegedly “objective” justification are subtely lampooned and derided as “critical”, “not sympathetic”, “without faith”, “cynical”.

Its the typical circular reasoning of a “true believer”. Surely we can do better than that :confused:.
Sure we can. This was an observation not a conclusion or even a premise. I never claimed it was anything more than that, but thanks for your sober reminder.
 
Because He want’s us to seek Him. He knows that if it is too easy we will simple invent questions. Onlly those who sincerely seek to find the answers will find the Truth.
Boy, do I have a lot of answers to find…
 
The Church Fathers would not be considered en par with Scripture, but who precisely suggested that to be the case and why?
This is a Catholic board. Of course the Church Fathers, as the keepers of Sacred Tradition and compilers of Sacred Scripture are regarded as reliable on the same.

However, as the identity of the Antichrist as a discrete person is neither in Tradition nor Scripture, I agree with the objection in principle.
 
St. Paul’s Epistle to the Romans, chapter 11, deals with the question in the OP. Here’s a sample:

Romans 11: [25] For I would not have you ignorant, brethren, of this mystery, (lest you should be wise in your own conceits), that blindness in part has happened in Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles should come in. [26] And so all Israel should be saved, as it is written: There shall come out of Sion, he that shall deliver, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob. [27] And this is to them my covenant: when I shall take away their sins. [28] As concerning the gospel, indeed, they are enemies for your sake: but as touching the election, they are most dear for the sake of the fathers. [29] For the gifts and the calling of God are without repentance. [30] For as you also in times past did not believe God, but now have obtained mercy, through their unbelief; [31] So these also now have not believed, for your mercy, that they also may obtain mercy. [32] For God hath concluded all in unbelief, that he may have mercy on all.
 
I was discussing with my friends about the church, and one of them is trying to convert to catholicism, but he have some doubts, he asked me: “Hey,* if Catholicism is true why there are still jews? Think about it, God chose a people and created a religion, Judaism, then he promised a messiah to his people and he sent this messiah, but he was not very specific in his scriptures and there are still people who find in his own scriptures that this messiah did not accomplish this pre-requirements to a messiah, and therefore they are still jews, so how could he create a religion, but he was not very clear in his own scriptures and left astray his own people waiting until today the messiah? Why he did not make very clear to don’t left astray his own people, the jews and left them waiting until today the messiah?* And Still, if catholicism is true, why he was not very specific that he wanted to create one, and one single church, one pope, so we would not have hundreds and hundreds of protestant nominations? Why he did not make specific in the bible that he would only make one Church, and just one instead to leave us astray?”

I tried to say that God would not force us to follow his religion, and he would try to freely attract us to the true church and religion, but i’m not into this business of Old Scriptures, and Early Christianity, someone could help me with this one? Thank you!👍
Mt 15:23 Jesus did not answer a word. So his disciples came to him and urged him, “Send her away, for she keeps crying out after us.” 24 He answered, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel.” 25 The woman came and knelt before him. “Lord, help me!” she said. 26 He replied, “It is not right to take the children’s bread and toss it to their dogs.” 27 “Yes, lord,” she said, “but even the dogs eat the crumbs that fall from their masters’ table.” 28 Then Jesus answered, “Woman, you have great faith! Your request is granted.” And her daughter was healed from that very hour.

Here was someone who obviously saw and was not part of the tribe Jesus was trying to reach.

Let’s not forget, the Church in the beginning, which Jesus established and gave all His promises to, was 100% Jewish. He put His entire effort into trying to convince the Jews. Just look at all His miracles He performed for them. And as we saw, He reached many.

Conversion is by choice not by force. [Jn 6:66]
 
If evolution is true, why are there still monkeys? 😛

Just because Jesus came along doesn’t mean that everyone believed what He said. We still have free will.

History is full of examples of this type of thing. Every time there is dramatic change, there is a group that wants things to stay as they were.

Of course, this is a somehwat oversimplified way to speak of complex historical phenomena. But you get the idea.
 
Hmmmn, I don’t think so. We of course glibly promote minor/obscure “prophecies” to top level if they can be in any way applied to Jesus and demote even the apparantly clearer ones if they cannot. An obvious case of victors (re-)writing the history.
I am not saying Jesus wasn’t prophecied in the OT. But there’s a lot of smoke and mirrors.

Isn’t life just the same? Which is why sincere Jews can be found in Judaism and sincere Protestantsd can be found in Protestantism and sincere Buddhists in Buddhism and sincere Muslims in Islam… and insincere Catholics in Catholicism. It isn’t rocket science 🤷.

Jesus prophecied no stone would be left upon a stone in the destruction of Jerusalem…so what is the Jewish “wailing wall” then? Prophecy is tricky isn’t it 👍.
Wall =/= Temple; moreover, Jerusalem and the Temple underwent at least three forms of destruction: once especially the Temple was ruined by the Romans in the 1st century, then all of Jerusalem and the surrounding area in the 2nd century, then a natural disaster under Julian the Apostate that destroyed and consumed the Temple area when they were trying to rebuild it - for Julian he was doing it for no other reason than to spite the Christians and reverse Christ’s prophecy or try to disredit it. Today the wailing wall at most attests to the historical reality of the Jerusalem Temples (1st/Solomon and the 2nd after the Exile and enlarged massively by one of the Herods).

The destruction of Jerusalem as such was a different prophecy realized only after the 2nd Jewish rebellion in the 2nd century AD; in fact, not only Jerusalem was razed but enormous tracts of land all around it was so wasted by the Romans that no vegetation remained. It was made as inhospitable as possible. The Romans were furious and, as typical, merciless and brutally efficient in their punishments: we get the word “decimation,” e.g., from the Roman punishment for simply resisting their attempts at conquering you which refers to the slaying, mutilation, emasculation or enslavement of one out of every ten males (hence “deci-”: a tenth) of military age or quality of an entire tribe/country/nation. That’s how the Romans did business; it’s not an accident that they invented crucifixion.

And God is not a magician. Prohecy is not smoke and mirrors. Pretty difficult to mistake a pregnant virgin for something other than a pregnant vigin, e.g.
 
messiahtruth.yuku.com/
JewsforJudaism.org

These places will sufficiently explain the reason.

This was actually my first stop before Atheism when transitioning out of Christianity. The Jews make a very good case in my opinion.
There are various prophecies in the OT. Of the Messianic, some deal with the first coming of Christ, others the second coming and the new heavens and earth. The Apostles were aware of this difference and hence emphasized in their preaching Christ’s Second Coming also, which later some (Christians even) mistook as their believing that Christ’s second coming was necessarily temporally/chronologically immanent, though in a sense it is for each invidual simply because we are mortal and death can come at any moment. Of the OT prophecies touching on what we today would call the Apocalypse, these are most easily interpreted as Christ bringing in his first coming a very earthly and very human utopia; whereas, we understand this definitive transformation of creation as being rather more radical. The “gap” between the two events is, for the Christian, a time to rake in as many souls as possible to the glory of God.

There are other prophecies touching specifically on the ressurection and regeneration. These also are easily confused. There is one ressurection of the soul where by grace (via baptism) we are restored to spiritual life; not all, however, participate in this. Then there is the second ressurection of the body, in which all humanity will participate thanks to Christ’s redemption of our nature: that’s why the Apostle St Paul speaks of Adam bringing death to everyone human (“the many”: i.e., the multitude of sinful humanity) and Christ - the second Adam - bringing life to all; the first Adam caused death to enter the world, and we all have to suffer it even though not individually/morally responsible for it; the second Adam (Christ) brings us the ressurection of the body (and the soul too) even though we didn’t earn, deserve or merit it.

All of this is less or more hinted at in the OT. Trying to determine which is what is practically impossible without help/a guide; ergo, the promise of the Holy Spirit and Christ being the one to first “open the scriptures” to us.
 
messiahtruth.yuku.com/
JewsforJudaism.org

These places will sufficiently explain the reason.

This was actually my first stop before Atheism when transitioning out of Christianity. The Jews make a very good case in my opinion.
Hmm… one of these is a forum.

The other makes rash presuppositions about Jesus and the Apostles.

I don’t think either of them qualifies as unbiased scholarly research (though the latter seems to at least make an attempt).
 
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