If God Commanded You To Kill Someone, Would You Do It?

[Call_Me_V]

Many Christians consider the violence committed by the Israelites in the Old Testament to be moral because God ordered them to do so. My question is, if God appeared to you in a vision, and ordered you to kill someone just like he used to, would you do it? Would you refuse? Would you seek psychological help (I’m being serious)?

The reason I ask is because I think that it’s a lot easy to look back at ancient Bible stories, that we’ve kind of become immune to due to our familiarity with them, and say, “Yeah, that was okay because God commanded it”. But when you look at it in a modern (more real life) context, most would hesitate, I think. I’m not trying to pass moral judgment on the Old Testament (that would be hard to do, since I don’t believe in morality), I’m just trying to see what you guys think. If God ordered you to kill someone, just like the old days, would you do it? Would you consider the killing to be “moral”?

Thanks,
V

P.S. I posted this in the moral theology forum because it said that this was the place for moral dilemmas. If it’s better off somewhere else, please move it.

 

[anmend43]

In the OT Abraham was told to kill Isaac, but was stopped. Jesus not only took Isaac’s place, but all people’s so that we wouldn’t have to make a blood sacrifice.
Jesus paid the price for our sins… and He preached that we are to love and not lift up our hand against our enemies, but to pray for them, and lead to to Christ, which we do through the Gospel.
So no, if “God” is telling you to kill someone, I can assure you it is the devil, and I will pray for you.

 

[Call_Me_V]

In the OT Abraham was told to kill Isaac, but was stopped. Jesus not only took Isaac’s place, but all people’s so that we wouldn’t have to make a blood sacrifice.
Jesus paid the price for our sins… and He preached that we are to love and not lift up our hand against our enemies, but to pray for them, and lead to to Christ, which we do through the Gospel.
So no, if “God” is telling you to kill someone, I can assure you it is the devil, and I will pray for you.

Don’t worry, I’m not receiving any messages from God, I can assure you. But back on topic, Abraham is an example where God relented… but there are plenty of places where he didn’t, and ordered the deaths of men, women, and children. Your post seems to imply that God would never command sch a thing. Is that your position?

V

 

[Zatzat]

Assuming your talking about killing an innocent person and not someone like Adolf Hitler…

I’d look God square in the eye and say ‘no’.

Then, I’d commit the rest of my life to not worshiping him, making certain that when I died, I wouldn’t have to spend eternity with him.

 

[jrsmith]

As stated in 1 John 4:1-6, you first test the Spirit, to make sure it is indeed God talking. Then kill! Not that God would ever do something like that. But we indeed must obey God, even if we don’t understand.

 

[Call_Me_V]

Not that God would ever do something like that.

According to scripture, he did. But thanks for giving your (name removed by moderator)ut.

V

 

[curlycool89]

As stated in 1 John 4:1-6, you first test the Spirit, to make sure it is indeed God talking. Then kill! Not that God would ever do something like that. But we indeed must obey God, even if we don’t understand.

I don’t like any of the poll answers, but this would be mine. I have a feeling that in this day and age that God would not ask anyone to kill in His name, but I could always be wrong.

 

[Call_Me_V]

I don’t like any of the poll answers, but this would be mine. I have a feeling that in this day and age that God would not ask anyone to kill in His name, but I could always be wrong.

So God and morality changes based on the day and age? What was moral then is immoral now?

V

 

[presidentjlh]

I definitely just wouldn’t do it immediately. God had spoken to Abraham in the past, so Abraham knew it was God speaking to him when He asked Abraham to sacrifice Issac.

I have yet have God Himself directly and audibly speak to me. That’s why I would be a little suspicious if (assuming God would speak to me at some point in the future) the first thing God talks to me about is how He wants me to go kill someone.

 

[bksumm]

God isn’t the God of nonsense. He doesn’t give us free will and then take it away from us. God doesn’t command that we not kill to then turn around and tell us to kill. We are called to love God and our fellow man. Jesus tells that “whatever you do to the least of these…you do to me.”

 

[Call_Me_V]

God isn’t the God of nonsense. He doesn’t give us free will and then take it away from us. God doesn’t command that we not kill to then turn around and tell us to kill.

But according to your scriptures, he did. Most people justify this by saying that God commanded it. I’m just wondering if those same people who say that this was justified due to God’s commands would also be willing themselves to kill someone if God ordered them to (why not? if they truly believe that killing is justified so long as God gives the command, why should they hesitate to carry out his orders?).

V

 

[TomD123]

I am not saying the OT is false, however, it can be taken too literally, it was inspired but it was written by flawed humans-God uses flawed humans all of the time to accomplish his mission. You have to remember that Judaism was relatively new and surrounded by pagans. The pagans were very harsh and violent. In the OT we can see that the Jews (especially the older the stories get) had a somewhat pagan image of God–of course not as bad with human sacrafice, but still a much harsher view of God than the Christian view today. Also remember that if God commands a killing it may not be murdering the innocent. The Church allows for war, which involves killing, in some situations when it is the only possible way to defend yourself. What I am saying is that killing someone in self defense can be justified, it is not the same as if God ordered a massacre of a city.

As an answer to the original question:

1. If God commanded killing of the innocent I would know it was the devil because God cannot command something like this- it is not in his nature which is love
   2)If God commanded me to kill someone in defense of myself or another person like in a situation, I would of course do it

 

[curlycool89]

So God and morality changes based on the day and age? What was moral then is immoral now?

V

No, it more of a comment on history. If God were to actually tell someone to kill then it would still be a moral action because all life belongs to God.

I just don’t think it will happen again. Back then it was for the most part (I’m only about half way through the Old Testament, so I can’t speak of the other half) it was when Israel was fighting another kingdom. Fight for your kingdom type of warfare. We would still call that moral if you’re defending your land against an invader.

You also had when all the first born of Israel were slain by the Levites, which was so ordered by God. You also had Elijah ordering the killing of the Baal priests after the “duel”, but he was a prophet so you can safely assume where he got it from. Same with Elisha and the bears. Same with Judith. It’s all very targeted against evil people.

 

[Call_Me_V]

1. If God commanded killing of the innocent I would know it was the devil because God cannot command something like this- it is not in his nature which is love

Out of curiosity, are you saying that every firstborn in Egypt was guilty? Are you saying that when God told the Israelites who had just defeated the Midianites to slay all of the male children, and all of the females that had had intercourse, but to keep the virgins for themselves, that all of those little boys that were killed were guilty? (Numbers 31:17-18)

2)If God commanded me to kill someone in defense of myself or another person like in a situation, I would of course do it

Well, I don’t think that anyone would even need a command from God in that case. If my life was in serious danger, I’d probably be like, “Don’t distract me God, I’m fighting for my life here!”

No, it more of a comment on history. If God were to actually tell someone to kill then it would still be a moral action because all life belongs to God.

I just don’t think it will happen again. Back then it was for the most part (I’m only about half way through the Old Testament, so I can’t speak of the other half) it was when Israel was fighting another kingdom. Fight for your kingdom type of warfare. We would still call that moral if you’re defending your land against an invader.

You also had when all the first born of Israel were slain by the Levites, which was so ordered by God. You also had Elijah ordering the killing of the Baal priests after the “duel”, but he was a prophet so you can safely assume where he got it from. Same with Elisha and the bears. Same with Judith. It’s all very targeted against evil people.

See above. I find it hard to believe that all of the people he killed were deserving of death.

V

 

[curlycool89]

See above. I find it hard to believe that all of the people he killed were deserving of death.

V

You can’t say that for sure either. If God ordered it, then it’s our assumption that they did.

In the end, all life belongs to God and is His to call back at any second. Why do children die in the womb or soon after birth? They’ve done nothing wrong personally, yet they die anyways? Why? I don’t know. None of us do. All we know is that all life belongs to God. Catholics, heretics, schismatics, non-Catholics, and non-believers, it doesn’t matter who they are, they all belong to the same God.

 

[mdgspencer]

God wouldn’t command something beyond our powers, so he would not command something beyond someone’s psychological power to do something.
If I had such a vision, I would not go out and act on it promptly, because while visions can come from God, “visions” can also come entirely from our own mind or from Satan. This would call fo discernment. Generally if someone did not know positively such an experience was from God, that person should ignore it. This includes any “vision.”

 

[Call_Me_V]

You can’t say that for sure either. If God ordered it, then it’s our assumption that they did.

So if God commanded you to kill someone, you would have to assume they were guilty, and deserving of death? And would you carry out this fully justified sentence?

In the end, all life belongs to God and is His to call back at any second. Why do children die in the womb or soon after birth? They’ve done nothing wrong personally, yet they die anyways? Why? I don’t know. None of us do. All we know is that all life belongs to God. Catholics, heretics, schismatics, non-Catholics, and non-believers, it doesn’t matter who they are, they all belong to the same God.

So if God ordered you to kill someone, you would say, “Well, all life is in God’s hands, so it’s his call, I’ll carry out his orders.”? I’m not questioning that decision (I actually think it shows consistency for someone who justifies the murders in the Old Testament via God’s commands to agree to murder on his command. Why not, after all? If God commanded it, it’s clearly justified.), I just think that most people who justify the killings in the Old Testament by saying it was God’s will don’t really think through the implications of what they’re saying. If they did, and they truly believed that it was okay if God commanded it, they would have no hesitation in killing on his command. The fact that they do have such hesitation makes me think that they don’t really mean it when they say God’s will justifies murder, it’s really just an easy apologetics response that they can use.

God wouldn’t command something beyond our powers, so he would not command something beyond someone’s psychological power to do something.
If I had such a vision, I would not go out and act on it promptly, because while visions can come from God, “visions” can also come entirely from our own mind or from Satan. This would call fo discernment. Generally if someone did not know positively such an experience was from God, that person should ignore it. This includes any “vision.”

Fair enough. But how would one go about determining positively whether or not the vision really was from God?

V

 

[curlycool89]

Fair enough. But how would one go about determining positively whether or not the vision really was from God?

V

The Church. That’s why it exists. To determine what is of God and what isn’t. To lead the people in faith and morals.

It’s the same thing when someone starts claiming, say, visions of Mary. I once heard a story that there was an apparent apparition of Mary in Bayside, NY. So the Bishop let it be for a while and assigned a priest to act as a spiritual director to the people there. Then “Mary” started complaining about the priests that got sent. Finally, “Mary” complained about the Bishop and then said it wasn’t “her guy” in Rome. Now we know that’s not right, because the Holy Spirit is the one who chooses the Pope, not Mary. At that point we know it’s not Mary, and it’s not of God.

So everything supernatural always requires discernment within the Church, and of both the Scriptures and Tradition (and within that the Magisterium).

 

[Call_Me_V]

The Church. That’s why it exists. To determine what is of God and what isn’t. To lead the people in faith and morals.

It’s the same thing when someone starts claiming, say, visions of Mary. I once heard a story that there was an apparent apparition of Mary in Bayside, NY. So the Bishop let it be for a while and assigned a priest to act as a spiritual director to the people there. Then “Mary” started complaining about the priests that got sent. Finally, “Mary” complained about the Bishop and then said it wasn’t “her guy” in Rome. Now we know that’s not right, because the Holy Spirit is the one who chooses the Pope, not Mary. At that point we know it’s not Mary, and it’s not of God.

So everything supernatural always requires discernment within the Church, and of both the Scriptures and Tradition (and within that the Magisterium).

And if you determined that it was, in fact, God who was ordering you to kill someone… would you do it?! That’s the point of the entire post, if you believe that God’s commands can justify killing, you should be willing to kill for him without hesitation. That is the implication of Divine Command morality. Would you kill someone of God asked you to?

V

 

[hellopeople]

No doubt I would seek psychological help…immediately. There is no way that God would ever command someone to kill someone else. I guess it all depends on how he revealed Himself though.