If God is infinitely important, then why is fanaticism bad?

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That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all? For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses? If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
 
That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all?
Life is important because it is a Gift from God Himself.
Health is important because we should take care of the Gift of Life.
Monetarily speaking, wealth is not important, but it is necessary to maintain our health.
For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses?
This is a little confusing here. Why would we crawl on our bellies in Church?
And the double negative makes that last line say, “would we exempt people from the Sabbath due to illness?” The answer is we are exempt from the Sabbath if we are sick enough. My wife missed Mass because she gave birth to our daughter on a Saturday.
If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
No, a good God would not insist that. A good God would give us free will to choose freely to love and serve him, or reject him because free will is the ultimate gift of Love.
 
That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all? For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses? If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
God is love and Justice. He wants a relationship with us not just a blind obedience with an instant punishment if we don’t. God makes the sun to shine on the just and unjust. Because you might not see non-believers struck by lightening doesn’t mean God is not working on them or calling them etc. God calls us friends, He laid His life down for us. This is not a matter of importance. If this is how you view God, that is pretty sad.
 
That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all? For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses? If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
Because God does not believe in force-feeding. :cool: I think this also applies for human fanaticism (sitting on a high horse and claiming to speak for God while aggressively damning everyone else up and down), if we go by the story of Job. 😉
 
That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all? For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses? If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
To twist your question around, fanaticism is bad because G-d is so important. IOW, fanaticism does not help us love and worship G-d since it is responsible for draining us of love for others as well as ourselves.
 
There’s nothing about God’s importance that requires that He instantly punish all offenses. “Is it my will that a sinner should die, saith the Lord God, and not that he should be converted from his ways, and live? … For I desire not the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord God, return ye and live” (Ezechiel 18:23, 32). Since God is merciful, He gives us time to repent and do penance for our sins.
 
Hey there,

Yes, this is what our lord wants from us! We must deny ourselves in his name and give everything to him! Look at the saints, did they compromise? not once! Padre Pio, St Francis of Assisi never left anytime for themselves but for God! Do NOT listen to those who say God would never have us do this because only the saints were fanatic and they are the only ones in heaven, the others are lost! Remember that God is a harsh God too, otherwise why would there be hell for the majority of mankind? please ignore the people who try to sugercoat everything, fear God and his terrifying wrath!
God Bless!!!
 
Hey there,

Yes, this is what our lord wants from us! We must deny ourselves in his name and give everything to him! Look at the saints, did they compromise? not once! Padre Pio, St Francis of Assisi never left anytime for themselves but for God! Do NOT listen to those who say God would never have us do this because only the saints were fanatic and they are the only ones in heaven, the others are lost! Remember that God is a harsh God too, otherwise why would there be hell for the majority of mankind? please ignore the people who try to sugercoat everything, fear God and his terrifying wrath!
God Bless!!!
Forgive me, but I must ask whether you seriously believe this reflects Catholic teaching: in particular, your statement that only the saints are in heaven and hell is for the majority of mankind? Or are you joking with the OP? It doesn’t sound like the Catholicism I learned about on CAF and elsewhere. It is true that G-d is a G-d of justice but He is also a G-d of mercy. Both Catholicism and Judaism teach this.
 
To those who feel they need to convert others with the “fear his terrifying wrath” or something close to that stuff.

The 1800’s called and asked for you to stop using their schtick.
 
Because it leads to this.
And this.
And this.
And this.
And this.
Murder, holy war, subjugation of women, execution and discrimination of homosexuals, xenophobia, ignorance, Mosaic Law…need I go on?
 
Forgive me, but I must ask whether you seriously believe this reflects Catholic teaching: in particular, your statement that only the saints are in heaven and hell is for the majority of mankind? Or are you joking with the OP? It doesn’t sound like the Catholicism I learned about on CAF and elsewhere. It is true that G-d is a G-d of justice but He is also a G-d of mercy. Both Catholicism and Judaism teach this.
“Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it”. This is taught in catholic doctrine, and it tells us that many more people find hell and destruction rather than paradise! Catholicism is sugar-coated these days!! many people dont want to believe where they are going (to hell) even priests, so they mislead alot of people on CAF, in mass and other places, just like the pharisees!! Fear God!
 
That is, if God is so important then why is life, health, wealth, etc. even important at all? For if God was so important wouldn’t we crawl on our bellies in Church, or wouldn’t we not except people from the Sabbath on account of their sicknesses? If God was so important, then wouldn’t he insist on being literally always obeyed w/ instant punishment for any offense? And yet, we don’t see that non-believers are constantly struck by lightning 🤷.
You are being foolish with this post. Did Jesus live like that? Did any of the saints?
:rolleyes:
 
I’d also like to point out that you don’t know 100% for sure that God actually exists. So just for the sake of that tiny unsurety I’d say fanaticism is bad. What if this life really is all we’ve got? Religious fanaticism would literally ruin everything the entire human race experiences.
 
I’d also like to point out that you don’t know 100% for sure that God actually exists. So just for the sake of that tiny unsurety I’d say fanaticism is bad. What if this life really is all we’ve got? Religious fanaticism would literally ruin everything the entire human race experiences.
Why would it ‘ruin everything the entire human race experiences’??? no i tell you that it will ruin everything satan has worked for!! All our saints were called fanatics and had many enemies because of this! this is not the only life we have got, hell exists for people like yourself in which 99% of its inhabitants never believed in its existence!! God help you!!!
 
Because God does not believe in force-feeding. :cool: I think this also applies for human fanaticism (sitting on a high horse and claiming to speak for God while aggressively damning everyone else up and down), if we go by the story of Job. 😉
As everyone knows, the whole gist of the book of Job is that: Job is a righteous man who lived in comfort. God allows the Accuser (haśśāṭān, Satan) to take away all of Job’s wealth, family, and even his health. Three friends of Job, Eliphaz, Bildad, and Zophar, come to console him. They attempt to defend God’s moral universe by arguing that Job must have sinned to incite God’s punishment. The narrative itself somewhat encourages this interpretation, since the boils that Job gets (Job 2:3-7) are precisely, word for word, what Deuteronomy describes as punishment for disobedience to God’s commandments (Deuteronomy 28:15, 35). In other words, contrary to the image in Deuteronomy, which offers a vision of a perfectly moral universe governed by God, where keeping the commandments will bring down blessings and disobedience brings down punishment and puts you out of sync with the moral universe, Job’s exceptional righteousness does not earn him a blessing but a curse - all this with God’s assent.

The funny thing is, when God finally appears in the story, it soon turns out that the one who has argued with Him has spoken rightly, while the ones who have defended Him have not. Job’s friends are trying to answer for God against Job’s accusations, but they are ultimately scolded because they did not “speak rightly” to or about God. In a way, God is saying, “Who do you think you are? Who asked you to answer for me?” God gives a long poetic reply to Job’s complaints, he ultimately does not give him the clear answers he wants. However, He does take Job’s side over against the three friends: “look who I have to defend me!”

There is a play called The Trial of God by Holocaust survivor Elie Wiesel. The play is set in a 17th century eastern European village named Shamgorod after a massacre of local Jews at the eve of the festival of Purim. The last remaining survivors of the disaster, Beresh the inkeeper and his daughter Hanna, are holed up in Beresh’s tavern: when three travelling Purim minstrels arrive at the inn, Beresh decides to stage a play in which they put God on trial for what has happened to their community and others throughout history, with Beresh as persecutor. The only problem is, no one in the room is willing to represent God. Just then, an “intelligent, cynical, extremely courteous, diabolical” stranger named Sam shows up and agrees to take on the role of God’s defense attorney.

Many have commented upon the thematic similarities between this play and the book of Job. Beresh is very much the Job character: like Job, he places God on trial in connection with the classic theodicean question - how can God allow the innocent to suffer? - and refuses to justify Him in the face of this undeserved suffering. Sam, on the other hand, sounds very much like Job’s three friends: he defends God’s moral universe by questioning the need to blame God for the killings, and in fact suggests that those who were killed should thank God “for dying without prolonged suffering or shame.” Furthermore, Sam piously affirms that he must choose God over suffering, dying Jews because “I’m his servant. He created the world and me without asking for my opinion. He may do with both whatever He wishes. Our task is to glory Him, to praise Him, to love Him - in spite of ourselves.”

These two trials are eventually both cut short, but in radically different ways. In Job as mentioned, God finally shows up and condemns Job’s friends for their ignorance and lack of understanding while commending Job for his righteous words. In Wiesel’s play, the mock trial is postponed as the bloodthirsty villagers break through the tavern door and proceed to murder everyone at the inn, as Sam reveals who he truly is: Satan.
 
The genesis of the whole play was:

*nside the kingdom of night, I witnessed a strange trial. Three rabbis – all erudite and pious men – decided one winter evening to indict God for allowing his children to be massacred. I remember: I was there, and I felt like crying. But there nobody cried.

To which Robert McAfee Brown elaborates:

The trial lasted several nights. Witnesses were heard, evidence was gathered, conclusions were drawn, all of which issued finally in a unanimous verdict: the Lord God Almighty, Creator of Heaven and Earth, was found guilty of crimes against creation and humankind. And then, after what Wiesel describes as an “infinity of silence,” the Talmudic scholar looked at the sky and said “It’s time for evening prayers,” and the members of the tribunal recited Maariv, the evening service.

Wiesel makes a distinction between questioning God and blaspheming God. The latter is a blasphemous prospect, but for him the former is perfectly natural:

So my problem, my crisis – there was a crisis in my faith – a came much later. I think two or three years later. I began wondering: what was the meaning of all that? – which is the question of all questions. What does it all mean?

Once you ask this question, of course, God enters into the picture. Where was God? But I’m asking the question from within faith, not outside faith. If I didn’t believe, where would be the problem? But if you do believe, then you have these painful questions. And these questions remain open to this day.

===

We Jews don’t blame God. We question God. I can blame human beings. And I do, and we should blame human beings when they do something wrong to other human beings. But to blame God, that’s quite an act of arrogance. And we don’t do that. But we question God.

===

We cannot accuse God of things we do. Cain and Abel were brothers: God did not ask the one to kill, nor the other to let himself be killed. God did not order Auschwitz, nor did He order submission to Auschwitz. God may say, and He probably does, that He wanted peace, for His name is peace. But if war breaks out, do not blame Him. On the contrary, pity Him, feel sorry for Him who is made to see what His creatures are doing to His creation.*
 
Because it leads to this.
And this.
And this.
And this.
And this.
Murder, holy war, subjugation of women, execution and discrimination of homosexuals, xenophobia, ignorance, Mosaic Law…need I go on?
Why would it ‘ruin everything the entire human race experiences’??? no i tell you that it will ruin everything satan has worked for!! All our saints were called fanatics and had many enemies because of this! this is not the only life we have got, hell exists for people like yourself in which 99% of its inhabitants never believed in its existence!! God help you!!!
This is why.
 
Life is important because it is a Gift from God Himself.
Health is important because we should take care of the Gift of Life.
Monetarily speaking, wealth is not important, but it is necessary to maintain our health.

This is a little confusing here. Why would we crawl on our bellies in Church?
And the double negative makes that last line say, “would we exempt people from the Sabbath due to illness?” The answer is we are exempt from the Sabbath if we are sick enough. My wife missed Mass because she gave birth to our daughter on a Saturday.

No, a good God would not insist that. A good God would give us free will to choose freely to love and serve him, or reject him because free will is the ultimate gift of Love.
If life is the ultimate gift of God, then why can we give it up (especially why can we give it up in favor of God)?

Again, if God is so important, then the most homage should be given to him, so we should crawl around as a sign of respect instead of walking.

And to another post, if God is so important, then the real question is why shouldn’t we be slaves? For slaves are unimportant people who serve the interests of the important people.

Unless somehow having these things is a means to God, and a necessary means to God, then there would be no reason IMO to think them important at all (and this even applies to the importance of mankind itself :eek:).

Here is my paradox: whatever is important is preferred to something else. Now religious stuff per se seems (to any believer) to be the most important things (the substance of God, churches, doctrines, evangelical counsels, etc.). So why would we choose and prefer our health to going to mass, or civil order to correct doctrines, or (to be logical in a swiftian manner) why would we even want to exist since God is infinitely important implying that he must be infinitely beloved which of course, would preclude any other choice?
 
“Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it”. This is taught in catholic doctrine, and it tells us that many more people find hell and destruction rather than paradise! Catholicism is sugar-coated these days!! many people dont want to believe where they are going (to hell) even priests, so they mislead alot of people on CAF, in mass and other places, just like the pharisees!! Fear God!
You are to “speak the truth with love”. Ephesians 4;15. You also need to read 1Corinthians 13 about love. “if I have not love, I am nothing”. To have such a hard edge and think this is what the Church teaches and the Saints practice is very misguided at best. You desire to speak the truth but you do not have love. That is a big difference. People are not converted or charged by a club but real love.
 
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