If God is love; God is anger too?

[laocmo]

Not necessarily. We human beings don’t have the right to destroy other human beings, while God, as the creator, has the right to create life and take life whenever he desires.
It is wrong for humans to kill infants. It is not wrong for God to kill infants. We humans naturally have less authority than God himself has. What may be acceptable for him to do or think may be unacceptable for us to do or think.

No one, no being, God included has the right to kill another innocent being. The above underlined quote sounds like something from a sick mind. Is it any wonder that people who really believe this cause others to doubt the existence of such a horrible being?

 

[Aloysium]

Does that means that God is above morality? Because he has the highest authority? So authority is more important than morality?

Love is the basis of all morality. Love is Beauty and Existence itself is Truth is the eternal ultimate Good, from which creation springs, is the Triune Godhead. All that God does is good. He would be considered the highest authority as the source of morality - Love.

The assertion that God is above morality has little meaning, true only in the sense that He is above your judgement of Him.

To come to know God one needs to abandon the reinforcing of those barriers we have created to block Him. Prayer is essential, as is contemplation of sacred writings and charitable works. Jesus made it simple and available to everyone through the establishment of His church on earth.

 

[o_mlly]

Well, Jesus Christ overturned the tables of the money-changers who were camped within the temple.

Jesus Christ is fully God and fully Men. As a man, he has the human nature that we ourselves have. It’s not far-fetched to think that Christ is able to feel human emotions due to his human nature.

Yes, Christ wept, sang and sweated drops of blood. Christ’s anger at the temple was properly directed at the evil effects of those who profaned the temple with commercial enterprises and he acted to end the evil.

 

[Aloysium]

No one, no being, God included has the right to kill another innocent being. The above underlined quote sounds like something from a sick mind. Is it any wonder that people who really believe this cause others to doubt the existence of such a horrible being?

I am guessing that your feelings are that it is better that there be no god than a cruel one.
A true God would be Love. As the Source of everything, He should be beauty and truth. To know Him would mean joyous eternal life.
Since that is in reality the case, your task would now be to rebuild your relationship with Him. To do so would require a return to prayer, focussing on your charitable works, going to mass if you can stomach your anger. Trust Him and have faith; it is and will be alright. You haven’t been well catechized and you should seriously consider going back to review the church’s teachings.
The “problem” of suffering and death is something that all humanity struggles with. There are many points of view, even within the same faith. A lot has been written from a Catholic perspective and is available on this site.
If your interest lies in arguing, you may wish to reflect on why that is.

 

[Wesrock]

Anger may be exercised in love. I may protect my family, despise what is contrary to goodness and love, or even discipline my children out of love for then.

That said, love is more than just a feeling or passion, as anger is. God properly IS love. While we may refer to God’s anger, he truly doesn’t suffer such passions like anger in the way we do.

 

[Faxero]

Does that means that God is above morality? Because he has the highest authority? So authority is more important than morality?

God is the source of morality, so he would naturally be above it.

The ten commandments are made by God for humans. God is not obligated to obey rules he made for others.

As the creator, God is exempt from the rules we humans must abide by, including the 5th commandment: Thou shalt not kill.

No one, no being, God included has the right to kill another innocent being. The above underlined quote sounds like something from a sick mind. Is it any wonder that people who really believe this cause others to doubt the existence of such a horrible being?

Uh… it might be best to refrain from assuming that God’s enemies are innocent.

I am guessing that your feelings are that it is better that there be no god than a cruel one.
A true God would be Love. As the Source of everything, He should be beauty and truth. To know Him would mean joyous eternal life.
Since that is in reality the case, your task would now be to rebuild your relationship with Him. To do so would require a return to prayer, focussing on your charitable works, going to mass if you can stomach your anger. Trust Him and have faith; it is and will be alright. You haven’t been well catechized and you should seriously consider going back to review the church’s teachings.
The “problem” of suffering and death is something that all humanity struggles with. There are many points of view, even within the same faith. A lot has been written from a Catholic perspective and is available on this site.
If your interest lies in arguing, you may wish to reflect on why that is.

Are you talking to me?

 

[Aloysium]

. . . Are you talking to me?

Nope. It is a response to the quote shown in my post from the same guy you are rsponding to.

I could.

And, what I’d say is that while
I agree with your statements about God being above and therefore exempt by the rules He established for us,
I don’t think that people whose understanding is based on the mundane realities of power and death on which it derives its strength,
will see God as anything but a tyrannt.

The Source of true power, that which creates, brings life and joy, is Love.

The Serpent in the garden lost his limbs. He is incapable of truly doing anything. All he does is squirm in the dust, to which we will turn again, feeding on it, as do those who follow him. People look at the world and see he whom it follows. That isn’t God. Satan has been vanquished; we are free. We can know God; we need only open our hearts.

 

[laocmo]

The following comments taken from this thread all need to be looked at with a little logic and common sense.

“We human beings don’t have the right to destroy other human beings, while God, as the creator, has the right to create life and take life whenever he desires.” This statement about God makes him the worse kind of tyrant. He could give lessons to Hitler. If indeed he created life with all its complexity, for some good purpose then he has the obligation to assist it in fulfilling that purpose.

“It is not wrong for God to kill infants.” What a load of @#$%. He can kill innocent infants just because he wants to do so?? I don’t want to associate with such a God.

“As a man, ( Jesus) he has the human nature that we ourselves have. It’s not far-fetched to think that Christ was able to feel human emotions due to his human nature……Christ wept, sang and sweated drops of blood.” If Jesus is indeed God then he must have God’s attributes one of which prohibits him from being angry. Conclusion maybe Jesus was not God, or at least he had different attributes than the real God ?? If he is God he must have all God’s attributes.

“While we may refer to God’s anger, he truly doesn’t suffer such passions like anger in the way we do.” Then why refer to his anger at all? We make a big mistake by using analogies relevant to humans when talking about God. God is happy, God is sad, God is pleased, all are silly statements.

“God is the source of morality, so he would naturally be above it.” The Tasaday people of the remote Pacific islands who were discovered in the last century, having never seen other humans, had no weapons, no agriculture, no art, no religion, no belief in a God, and no words for bad, enemy, war or kill. For good and beautiful they used the same term. They had a very high standard of morality and it didn’t come from a God. The children learned it from their parents generation after generation.

“God is not obligated to obey rules he made for others. As the creator, God is exempt from the rules we humans must abide by, including the 5th, commandment, Thou shalt not kill.” Sounds like our tyrant again. “These are rules for you, don’t question them, just follow them. I don’t have to obey them because I’m making them. I can do whatever I want.”

“The Serpent in the garden lost his limbs. He is incapable of truly doing anything. All he does is squirm in the dust, to which we will turn again, feeding on it, as do those who follow him.” Does any intelligent human still believe in that Garden Of Eden fairy tale?

 

[Wesrock]

Does that means that God is above morality? Because he has the highest authority? So authority is more important than morality?

It’s not a matter of simple authority but of the nature of a being. The way we must behave is derived from our nature and our own ends. God is not “above” morality (this could be a more nuanced point), but his nature and being and ends are not the same as ours.

 

[Wesrock]

“We human beings don’t have the right to destroy other human beings, while God, as the creator, has the right to create life and take life whenever he desires.” This statement about God makes him the worse kind of tyrant. He could give lessons to Hitler. If indeed he created life with all its complexity, for some good purpose then he has the obligation to assist it in fulfilling that purpose.

Of course he does. And he has.

“It is not wrong for God to kill infants.” What a load of @#$%. He can kill innocent infants just because he wants to do so?? I don’t want to associate with such a God.

God doesn’t have such whims. If God were to take such actions, it’s part of his purpose in his single, divine plan. The human soul is immortal. The end of this life is not the end of the person, and I entrust any innocent soul to God’s mercy and trust that he will judge accordingly as a just God.

“As a man, ( Jesus) he has the human nature that we ourselves have. It’s not far-fetched to think that Christ was able to feel human emotions due to his human nature……Christ wept, sang and sweated drops of blood.” If Jesus is indeed God then he must have God’s attributes one of which prohibits him from being angry. Conclusion maybe Jesus was not God, or at least he had different attributes than the real God ?? If he is God he must have all God’s attributes.

He must also have all the attributes of a man. To be honest, on this point, you show a large lack of understanding in Christ’s divine and human nature, and the will of the son and the will of the man. His divine nature was unchanging, but his human nature was within time, subject to feeling emotions. This point was an issue of incredible discussion in the early church. It’s not like you’re the first person to stumble upon this apparent contradiction.

“While we may refer to God’s anger, he truly doesn’t suffer such passions like anger in the way we do.” Then why refer to his anger at all? We make a big mistake by using analogies relevant to humans when talking about God. God is happy, God is sad, God is pleased, all are silly statements.

Well, we’re always encouraged to “write what we know” in creative writing, are we not? Human experience is full of emotions, and yes, sometimes it’s easier to refer to God analogously with them. But analogy is not without its uses.

“God is the source of morality, so he would naturally be above it.” The Tasaday people of the remote Pacific islands who were discovered in the last century, having never seen other humans, had no weapons, no agriculture, no art, no religion, no belief in a God, and no words for bad, enemy, war or kill. For good and beautiful they used the same term. They had a very high standard of morality and it didn’t come from a God. The children learned it from their parents generation after generation.

God is the source of morality and goodness. That doesn’t mean morality was handed down only in divine revelation.

“God is not obligated to obey rules he made for others. As the creator, God is exempt from the rules we humans must abide by, including the 5th, commandment, Thou shalt not kill.” Sounds like our tyrant again. “These are rules for you, don’t question them, just follow them. I don’t have to obey them because I’m making them. I can do whatever I want.”

I disagree with the notion that morality is simply arbitrary commands, though not all Christians do, of course. Human morality is based on human nature. We are obliged to act according to our nature. God’s nature is something else entirely. God acts in goodness, but it would be wrong to constrain God to human nature and standards of goodness. It’s not what he is.

“The Serpent in the garden lost his limbs. He is incapable of truly doing anything. All he does is squirm in the dust, to which we will turn again, feeding on it, as do those who follow him.” Does any intelligent human still believe in that Garden Of Eden fairy tale?

I haven’t gone back to the source quote, so I don’t know if he was merely being poetic or allegorical. Certainly the story is true, though that doesn’t mean it’s literal history. Your bitterness and scorn does you discredit, though.

 

[Faxero]

Calm down. Control your emotions.

The following comments taken from this thread all need to be looked at with a little logic and common sense.

“We human beings don’t have the right to destroy other human beings, while God, as the creator, has the right to create life and take life whenever he desires.” This statement about God makes him the worse kind of tyrant. He could give lessons to Hitler. If indeed he created life with all its complexity, for some good purpose then he has the obligation to assist it in fulfilling that purpose.

“It is not wrong for God to kill infants.” What a load of @#$%. He can kill innocent infants just because he wants to do so?? I don’t want to associate with such a God.

“God is the source of morality, so he would naturally be above it.” The Tasaday people of the remote Pacific islands who were discovered in the last century, having never seen other humans, had no weapons, no agriculture, no art, no religion, no belief in a God, and no words for bad, enemy, war or kill. For good and beautiful they used the same term. They had a very high standard of morality and it didn’t come from a God. The children learned it from their parents generation after generation.

Comparing God’s rights and human rights is like comparing apples and oranges, or comparing dogs and cats.

“God is the source of morality, so he would naturally be above it.” The Tasaday people of the remote Pacific islands who were discovered in the last century, having never seen other humans, had no weapons, no agriculture, no art, no religion, no belief in a God, and no words for bad, enemy, war or kill. For good and beautiful they used the same term. They had a very high standard of morality and it didn’t come from a God. The children learned it from their parents generation after generation.

Take a look at this article, written by Leon J. Suprenant.
catholic.com/magazine/articles/more-than-a-feeling

 

[Monica4316]

God would not do something evil. That is not in His nature.

God allowing death is not like us killing someone. Firstly He made life, we did not. Secondly human death is something that God didn’t actually intend for us. Its a result of our own freely chosen fall. God is simply allowing the consequences. But notice His response brings good - He takes the souls to Heaven (depending on our choice), and He died for us Himself to make that possible. God became Man and died. Any doubts about His goodness make no sense when we consider this.

No God couldn’t do evil if He wanted to because He would never want this, it is completely impossible. But some things He does we don’t understand. We should not for that reason call them evil. For example yes God allows death, but He has that authority, and He allows it only because of our condition, and one day we would get our bodies back in a glorious state.

Without trust in God, we would begin to see evil where there is no evil, because we have sin within ourselves. God has no sin. He doesn’t think like we do.

I wanted to also respond about that tribe of people who lived more morally, in the previous post. Their natural morality came from natural law, made and put in the heart from God. So it came from God. There are two types of law - natural and divine, but both were made by God. He wishes for us to follow natural law, which is already in us, but also Divine law as well, as our end is supernatural, not natural.

God’s Justice, does not contradict His love, because both are based on love and truth. He does not separate love and truth like we do. He is always loving and truthful, which means He can be merciful and just. The relationship of His Mercy and Justice is rather mysterious. But when God shows justice, it doesn’t mean He is unloving. He is trying to get us to change our way, for our own good, like a parent. There are reasons again based on truth.

Eternal justice is simply based on truth as well. God can not love evil and would not allow sin in union with Himself, which actually supports the reality of His goodness. Goodness ceases to be good when it unites to evil. People who say that unrepentant sinners should be in Heaven, do not know what they ask.

God cannot cease to be Himself and to be good, and this means He would not unite with sin.

 

[Monica4316]

Well, Jesus Christ overturned the tables of the money-changers who were camped within the temple.

Jesus Christ is fully God and fully Men. As a man, he has the human nature that we ourselves have. It’s not far-fetched to think that Christ is able to feel human emotions due to his human nature.

God has the human nature. Therefore, he has, or can experience, human emotions.

Not necessarily. We human beings don’t have the right to destroy other human beings, while God, as the creator, has the right to create life and take life whenever he desires.

It is wrong for humans to kill infants. It is not wrong for God to kill infants. We humans naturally have less authority than God himself has. What may be acceptable for him to do or think may be unacceptable for us to do or think.

Our Lord has emotions but He is not controlled by them. When He overturned the tables it wasn’t from an emotion He didn’t control. He freely chose to.

 

[Monica4316]

It’s many times that people from the Bible and God himself in the Bible talks about God’s anger, and God show it many times and in God level severity like in the Genesis flood and the Revelations. Sometimes it’s called God’s wrath. God’s anger is even constant:

Job 9:13 “God’s anger is constant. He crushed his enemies who helped Rahab, the sea monster, oppose him.”

So anybody here believe or at least consider that “God is anger” too?

This is basically His Justice.

God is Love and He can show either justice or mercy. He desires mercy. We receive mercy if we accept it, but if we reject it, then we are faced with justice. But God doesn’t change and is always love, which is perfect self giving supernatural charity.

 

[Monica4316]

But he kills people in anger, they can’t have chance to repent if they are killed. Tough love maybe making it difficult for the person, but not killing him.

There are several things here I believe are inaccurate. Its not like God gets angry and overcome by this feeling, kills person who offended Him, not caring for their salvation.

Rather

God has a perfect Will which is entirely free. He doesn’t have ‘passions’.

God made us immortal. We left Him and began to die. God took on our nature and died for us to give us a second chance. He gives each person a choice. He knows all the secrets of the human heart. Eventually, we die as a consequence of the fall, and God allows this but wants to then take the soul to Himself. If a person is dying in sin, God gave them chances and they said no, and He is giving them a final chance and they are maybe still saying no. God doesn’t want this, He wants them to say yes, but if He were to force them, they would not be able to love, and He made us free. There are no robots in Heaven, but free beings who are capable of love, which is in the will, not feelings. God knows the heart of that dying sinful person, and His judgement is perfect, so that the person can’t even argue it.