If I were atheist what would keep me from...

[lazylong6]

"First, it’s just not true that an athiest can’t find good if he/she looks for it. Natural Law. But if you reject all things that go against what you’re trying to hide then you might even reject “good”. Good becomes what feels good for me, not others. I’ve worked for men that were on their 6th marriage… Were they athiest …no. My currentl boss says he’s not religious. I suspect that deep down he’s either egnostic or athiest. I beleive the inteligent love to act smarter than religion and even God. It’s part of the combat for success or being “better” than anyone else. Engineering school was extremely competative and frankly produces some of the worst personalities of people trying to “prove” they are better than anyone else. I see it everyday. I’m not interested.

And to answer the question “what did they do to you”. I went to the seminary. My spiritual director made an attempted pass on me while I was asleep. Long story short I ran. over time I bagan to doubt the existence of God. I toyed occasionally with wondering if God really existed to allow such carnage …havoc in the world. I joined the army and experiences some of the worst people you’ll ever come across. I nearly got court martialed over a lie. Thankfully, I was "squared away enough that a high ranking NCO admitted that he lies about confirming the appearance of a junior officer that lied about his whereabouts after I let the cat out the bag that I dropped him off and tried to talk him out of jumping the fence in the field to go see a girlfriend…he was married. The CSM told the commander what the 1st Sergeant admitted to and they let me off the hook and tried to redeem me. My reputation was tanted anyhow and I left the military with honors but with a very bad taste with knowledge how easy it is for men to abuse their power and authority. Interestingly, I experienced the same it seemed at the time to be the same in Catholicm and was the main reason I doubted the Catholic Church as being the one true Church. Long story short I cam back after a lot more education and simply stumbling into historical documents that pointed to either Catholic Church or Eastern Orthodox Church. I struggled with that and now have accepted that I’m Catholic but working on reconciling opposing positions on this issue.

During the times I nearly rejected God I became very depressed and believed strongly that I need to believe in God. First because I grew up in an abusive home, tossed around between parents, grandparents and step parents. I’ve seen the worst of people. My oldest brother got so close to the end of his rope that he commited suicide. My youngest who does not know God…tried at least twice and talked about it recentlfy. I talked him out of that thinking. He’s lost. It seems that life has no purpose without God and thus to talk people out of believing in a God is just simply cruel and selfish. So a proselytizing athiest would be top on my long list of “hits”. I’m not that crazy…just trying to make a point.

In the area I live in, athiests have started their own “church”. They sing, study and do similar things that Christians do at church for fellowship. It seems that they too need a god and have dubbed that God “Science”…teaching evolution etc as a mere accident that brought about their existence. How meaningless of a life can you get. Without God there is no real purpose in living. Sex is not that great. Travel is a pain and learning a waste of time… So why not just die and while I’m doing it I might as well do something good and get rid of the people that hurt me, my wife and my family over the years.

Have you seen the series “DEXTER”? This is the life of an athiest that just gets his kicks out of killing serial killers…as if that’s okay… This is where atheism leads us…programs that justify killing for “the common good” or just for fun. Look at the video games out there. Look at the children that are commiting suicide in our society. Look at the massive justification for allowing people to die in wars…Iraq War for example…Look at AbuGrave [spelling?]. Look how women are flocking to stipping, drugs and porn. Look at abortion…partial birth abortion??? How could anyone justify killing a child that is about to be born. Sure all abortion is wrong, but partial birth abortion is just sick. We joke in criticism of this that we think about aborting our children…they are walking now. Look how quick we are to put people under and away to make our lifes easier. Just putting “organ donor” on your drivers license could be lethal. Take it off by the way unless you don’t mind someone making a wrong decission whether you’re gonna make it or not.

The list is just endless. No, atheism is just another religion that serves only Satan. Be kind if you will, but it is the killing of God that has brought us to many of these problems."

yes true, sensory enjoyment does not last long, doing things the first time may be great, but trying to create the past experience by doing it again and again only brings misery in the long run. butI don’t think it is the killing of God that has brought us these problems but rather where your preception lies, true, this world may have many problems but because of your strong focus in these “problems” it also became a problem for you causing you sorrow. There is no need to look elsewhere but here and now. What steps can you take, how can you proceed to become closer to god should be your main focus, by helping yourself you help others.

 

[AgnosTheist]

I can’t even come close to relating to atheism. To accept such a religion I’d be an awfully dangerous man.

I think a person like you would be dangerous whether you are an atheist, a christian or especially a muslim.

 

[Claudius]

I think a person like you would be dangerous whether you are an atheist, a christian or especially a muslim.

What a terribly hateful and judgmental statement you have here.

 

[AgnosTheist]

What a terribly hateful and judgmental statement you have here.

look, there are dangerous atheists and there are dangerous religious jihadists, catholic mafias, mormon polygamists, hate-spewing-fundamentalists, etc etc etc.

The person itself is a large factor in how dangerous he becomes regardless of beliefs or lack thereof.

 

[Mirdath]

look, there are dangerous atheists and there are dangerous religious jihadists, catholic mafias, mormon polygamists, hate-spewing-fundamentalists, etc etc etc.

The person itself is a large factor in how dangerous he becomes regardless of beliefs or lack thereof.

It’s really the ‘especially’ that does it. Nuts come in all flavors – peanut, cashew, Catholic, Muslim – given vocatio’s statement, he’d be equally dangerous no matter the flavor.

 

[vocatio]

First, I am a dangerous man, but not the way you say. Dangerous with words. True, I am a trained soldier to fight and defend. Intensity of thought comes out in the form of overstatements to press a point. The bigest enemy of the 20th Century has been atheism…This is a point that Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen pressed on about. The largest group responsible for the most deaths in all the world was actually atheism…hidden behind extreme movements that killed God. Communisim.

To say I would be dangerous in any religion is just blanketed statements to cover up the truth in what I’ve been talking about here. If someone removed my faith or belief in God, there’d be no reason for me to go onward…no hope for a better life. And saying that I need to get over it is just bazaar. That sounds like my former church of Christ faith’s belief… My mother in law made sure one of her son made it to the funeral of one of the former elders mothers so that he could “get scared to death”…real quote. Interesting thinking though. In my youth I might have bought into it. Not as an adult, husband and a father. Not to mention an excellent employee that knows his place, defends even those people from detraction or visa versa…the bosses from detraction. No I’m not perfect at it and get angry at it myself. I’d say I’m far from being a sociopath. Though a couple of people tried to go there before. But if I were a sociopath I would have easily justified that my freedom is less important that getting even. You see getting even is God’s job, not mine. It’s scriptural, ya know. As a man who has embraced a very Franciscan life early in life, I have fought to make order out of chaos. Life has brought me many hardships. A recent conversion of my entire family has opened up the floodgates of information regarding the clergy sex scandals and other faith scandals as well. This is my life’s work…fighting sex abusers for the evils against children and vulnerable adults.

So to act like you know more about me is just …crazy…to say it lightly. There is such a thing as justified anger. My anger would actually be rooted in a feeling of justified anger, not sociapathic behavior. So really I would be going against my own nature…a seeker of peace and justice…sometimes too much attention on the “justice” part. But that is caused from my personal experiences of finding worth in myself after experiencing so much abuse, whether to me or others. I’m not gonna share my life with you guys. Only a fool would do such a thing on a forum and the moderators would approach beign irresponsible for allowing it.

This is not about me anyway. It’s a message to those that think it’s okay to push their agenda of atheism. It’s not a good idea to push an agenda that is so guilty of so much carniage. And to waste time trying to pull my series of statements out of context or its loosly put intent is just plain …silly.

ISome times I poke fun. Some times I just play the “advoate”. The only good in me is the Good of God. The hope is that over time, we will all realize this. We need to empty out and let God fill us up…becoming more like Christ daily. It’s never a completed task. We do it our whole life. But if we fill our hearts full of our own demented pride we leave no room for God.

Preach the Gosepel always and when necessary use words…

 

[Harmony1988]

I think it’s an incorrect and terrible idea to make such a generalization about atheists like that. Not all atheists are like that, just like not all Catholics are good.

Personally though, if I were atheist, I am pretty sure I would be in jail by now. Luckily for me, my parents and the religion have managed to keep in me check when I was younger.

 

[Mirdath]

The bigest enemy of the 20th Century has been atheism…This is a point that Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen pressed on about. The largest group responsible for the most deaths in all the world was actually atheism…hidden behind extreme movements that killed God. Communisim.

That’d be totalitarianism. Unless it’s centered around one specific religion – just for example, Catholicism in Franco’s Spain – religion (or, in cases such as that, other religions) is something that cannot be manipulated by the government, so they see it as something that must be defeated. Totalitarianism can espouse atheism out of convenience, sure, but you’re trying to tell us Josef Stalin was some kind of atheist pope. It just doesn’t work that way.

To say I would be dangerous in any religion is just blanketed statements to cover up the truth in what I’ve been talking about here. If someone removed my faith or belief in God, there’d be no reason for me to go onward…no hope for a better life.

Then let me put one question to you: if Jesus – no demon in disguise, but Jesus son of Mary – appeared to you and asked you to kill me, told you that my death would bring further glory to the kingdom of heaven, told you that you would assure your salvation as a warrior-saint by removing me from this world… would you do so?

So to act like you know more about me is just …crazy…to say it lightly. There is such a thing as justified anger. My anger would actually be rooted in a feeling of justified anger, not sociapathic behavior. So really I would be going against my own nature…a seeker of peace and justice…sometimes too much attention on the “justice” part.

One man’s ‘justified’ anger is another’s job to sentence to prison. And I must say, you seemed… awfully eager… to act on it if only it weren’t for those pesky morals – morals which plenty of us heathen happen to have as well.

This is not about me anyway. It’s a message to those that think it’s okay to push their agenda of atheism. It’s not a good idea to push an agenda that is so guilty of so much carniage. And to waste time trying to pull my series of statements out of context or its loosly put intent is just plain …silly.

Know what, vocatio? I can’t think of a single religion or other theological stance, theist, atheist, or whateverthehell that doesn’t have blood on its hands from someone. Hell, I’m agnostic, and I’m pretty sure some wacko who shares my basic thinking on the question of the existence of God has gone and killed someone else over a petty argument. I know some Catholics thrive on guilt – it’s a classic cliche, after all – but it doesn’t do much to impress anyone else.

So, yeah, we’re all kinda sucktastic. What makes your way of doing things better, o you whose faith is founded in blood, continued in blood, and subsists in a weekly human/divine sacrifice? If you’re going to argue that the statement ‘nope, don’t believe in a god’ is actively dangerous, you should probably think about the fact that every Sunday at your church you essentially participate in ritual cannibalism. Carnage? Let’s talk about human flesh and blood being fed to a billion people every weekend!

‘Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you’ – it ain’t a metaphor, and it ain’t pretty.

And if you will kindly notice, I have left the – ah, historical foibles – of the Church well alone. Let us continue not to get into those, for however much you think they may have been justified, nobody else will see it your way.

Preach the Gosepel always and when necessary use words…

Whooooole lotta words, guy

 

[notself]

Its kinda ironic that the atheist could be a “better” person than a Catholic, when put in this perspective.

It would be interesting to see how a former devout Catholic lives compared to an average person who has been atheist since childhood.

The Dalai Lama is an atheist. There is no Creator God or Creations story in Buddhism. Granted HHDL is not an average person, but he is a recognizable example. When asked what the core of his religion was, he answered Kindness.

The OP would do well to have kindness as his benchmark for behaviour rather than the fear of hell.

 

[AgnosTheist]

It’s really the ‘especially’ that does it. Nuts come in all flavors – peanut, cashew, Catholic, Muslim – given vocatio’s statement, he’d be equally dangerous no matter the flavor.

Beliefs play a big factor too. And religions are not created equal.

I stand by my point. Nothing is more dangerous than a man who is willing to sacrifice his own life to kill a lot of people. And Islam is more capable of creating such individuals than any other belief systems (or lack thereof) COMBINED.

 

[AgnosTheist]

First, I am a dangerous man, but not the way you say. Dangerous with words. True, I am a trained soldier to fight and defend. Intensity of thought comes out in the form of overstatements to press a point. The bigest enemy of the 20th Century has been atheism…This is a point that Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen pressed on about. The largest group responsible for the most deaths in all the world was actually atheism…hidden behind extreme movements that killed God. Communisim.

I agree. But religion still comes close to being the leading cause of death.

To say I would be dangerous in any religion is just blanketed statements to cover up the truth in what I’ve been talking about here.

If you are not dangerous now, i doubt you would be when you become an atheist. All your theories work well on paper but not in reality. As proof of that, consider the fact that there are many nice athiests out there. Its the human nature, man. We cannot change what we are. As an athiest you would still feel love, and you would still value your life. Because of these two things, the last thing you would want is to be shunned by the society and get in trouble with the law.

 

[AgnosTheist]

The Dalai Lama is an atheist. There is no Creator God or Creations story in Buddhism. Granted HHDL is not an average person, but he is a recognizable example. When asked what the core of his religion was, he answered Kindness.

The OP would do well to have kindness as his benchmark for behaviour rather than the fear of hell.

hep hep hooray! thanks for that wonderful reminder!

 

[Pete_1]

Then let me put one question to you: if Jesus – no demon in disguise, but Jesus son of Mary – appeared to you and asked you to kill me, told you that my death would bring further glory to the kingdom of heaven, told you that you would assure your salvation as a warrior-saint by removing me from this world… would you do so?

The Christian God commands ‘thou shalt not kill’ (innocents)
so why would Jesus, whilst appearing to the OP command the killing of an innocent, when it is Jesus that commands us not to do it?

• God tells us that he remains the same forever.

Therefore the only conclusion is that the apparition is not Jesus, and the hypothetical question makes little sense.

peace,

 

[IvanKaramozov]

Vocatio, I know what you mean though, I have often wondered why atheists seem to be so “decent” considering that they do not have a fear of God or eternal punishment. I think that the belief that we are all born in the image of God is the reason. To an extent we are all born with a sense of morality and godliness.

Perhapse they just do what they feel is right for the sake of doing the right thing?

 

[LaMar]

Perhapse they just do what they feel is right for the sake of doing the right thing?

Most of us enjoy a civilized life. I’m pretty sure there is no God, but if there was, he wouldn’t scare me into doing anything different.

Homo Sapiens has existed for close to a million years (depending upon how you want to define humans, it could be closer to 2 million years). Ideals like being kind to others and delaying gratification precede religion by a long way. Christianity/Islam/Mormonism are just the latest constructs human beings have created to put our natural inclinations into a social context.

 

[vocatio]

I think it’s an incorrect and terrible idea to make such a generalization about atheists like that. Not all atheists are like that, just like not all Catholics are good.

Personally though, if I were atheist, I am pretty sure I would be in jail by now. Luckily for me, my parents and the religion have managed to keep in me check when I was younger.

then I looked at your age and faith…Isn’t this a contradiction? Who said all atheist are alike? And then you say the same thing I was saying as something to think about. Life’s not so simple that you can easily classify all of some group in to …one group.

There are Catholics that have and practice orthodox [correct] Catholic teachings. Those the pick and choose, some know, some don’t, etc. Same with Protestants. So why not the same with atheists.

 

[vocatio]

Mirdath

Don’t know huh…don’t have time for people that don’t believe or think they can get away with leaving it up to chance… So then…why would you even bother to be here? You have a serious personality flaw.

I’ve listen as many Agnostics and atheists as the next guy and all I see is people who are self seeking and exploitative…no exception yet to my experience. I see a lot of carnage coming from religious folks and most coming from those that try to “kill” God. Like in the Golden Compass… I have news for you…God is not dead and he is real…even worst…He’s Catholic.

 

[vocatio]

I agree. But religion still comes close to being the leading cause of death.

If you are not dangerous now, i doubt you would be when you become an atheist. All your theories work well on paper but not in reality. As proof of that, consider the fact that there are many nice athiests out there. Its the human nature, man. We cannot change what we are. As an athiest you would still feel love, and you would still value your life. Because of these two things, the last thing you would want is to be shunned by the society and get in trouble with the law.

Wishful thinking… but the truth remains the same…don’t have time nor care to blab out statistics from the “evidence”. But you probably don’t have a correct number on the statistics. The anti-Catholic propogranda is gear at making us believe that the Catholic Church killed around 65 million in the Inquisition… That’s remarkable…when that was about all that existed intirely in Europe. So I gues the fact that you and I are here is evedence to the contrary. But no…you’re smarter than God…and smarter than the real numbers… Rubber statistics. Not very academically honest.

 

[brycelaliberte]

I agree. But religion still comes close to being the leading cause of death.

Huh? Perhaps bad has been done in the name of religion, but this would only be a misuse of it. Unless of course, we shall accept that religion has been misused like atheists have misused the fact that there can be no way to define good or bad for them?

 

[vocatio]

hep hep hooray! thanks for that wonderful reminder!

So who really cares? Buhdists are not Christian…and that’s their religion…they believe in themselves as God. …like you apparently. As far as “nice” atheists…never met one. But it’s okay for you to decieve yourself, but to hang out on a Christian forum pushing your kill God agenda speaks much about your character…what type of person you are. This is equivalent to proselytizing…something no far from where I used to be spiritually. Now that I’m practicing Catholicism, we just place other in God’s mercy praying for the repose of their souls as they die and preferrable their conversion. But we have given atheist far to much room to grow pushing science, sex, money, power, etc as their gods.

What a depressing life. Someone hand me a rope…I gotta get out of here.