I agree, we are just accepting Jesus teaching in John 6:51-58 that “his flesh is true food, and his blood is true drink.” These verses are hard to understand, as in John 6:60, but as Catholics we accept it, because it is clear to us what Jesus meant. We are staying with Our Lord on this, and not walking away as some did in the Gospel. And yet today, we still see a refusal by many to grasp what he was saying back then.
yes starting in third and fourth century there is lots of descriptions of a long process, first and second century texts are limited in their description. Most people consider 3rd century Church the “early Church”
Are not we both surmising?Apparently we need to do both.You are assuming to know the position of the early Church.
Yes, the elements are symbols/signs for the Body and Blood of the Lord.
Sounds good but we all participate in the Eucharist. Does not Eucharist, being Thanksgiving for Christ’s sacrifice, cover our views, that is both real presence /transubstantiation or spiritual/symbolic ? Can anyone *fully *apprehend the Lord and His graces, I mean even Paul did not though it was his heart’s desire.
Correct, and Wisdom, the close relative of Truth, says be careful for maybe He graces according to the heart and not the mind of the law. That is, maybe one can participate with perfect theology/law and yet receive less than one who is not in “fullness” but with a more appreciative heart>
The Lord will sift out the wheat and tares on this topic.By some definition, His, there is One Communion.
Quickly if I may.
But certainly enough.I mean the command is to baptize all nations. I think we know.
Not so with biblical examples.
Ok. Thank you for info on Justin M
Hi et,
Do Catholics also accept v.40 or just the ones that appeal to them?
Hi Ben,
This question is applicable to you as well. What we don’t do is proof texting. Do you?
I am sure it does. The graces from a Catholic or Eastern Church’s Holy Communion is much too powerful to translate. The Lord Jesus had told a Doctor of the Church, St. Gertrude that whenever someone receives Holy Communion in a state of Grace that He gives Graces to everyone on the planet (and to the departed as well). The graces from any reception of Holy Communion enables the Lord to dispense His graces as He sees fit.
It can be. The Church which celebrates the Holy Mystery of Holy Communion is not only channeling God’s Graces to the recipient but it also helps God to dispense His Graces into the world. I guess the word “banking” is a term one could use as God can reserve those Graces for any particular person. For instance when St. Therese was praying for a convicted man she had prayed for some time. I am sure the Lord was waiting for the right moment when He will send forth His Grace to change the disposition of this man from a hostile one to a repentant one. The Lord would bank these Graces until He will send them to this man at the opportune time. And so it was for this man as he did changed. Now remember this man had no faith at all (he had lost it through much sinning) but the Lord had entered him because of the faith of St. Therese.
You are referring to your evangelical experience. Perhaps what you have been taught is right with you. I am an Eastern Orthodox Christian so my teaching follows through more what the Catholic and Eastern Churches believe in. Perhaps it is difficult for you to understand what Holy Communion is within the context of what the Catholic and Eastern Churches teaches since one needs to experience it within one own’s relationship in those Churches. The evangelical experiences of Protestantism however relates on a different level than a Catholic and Eastern Christian but there is much we could learn from this side of Protestantism since the evangelical witness outside the Mass and the Divine Liturgy is somewhat lacking among many Catholics and Easterners.
“For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.” John 6:40
described by individuals, right? We do like to adhere ourselves to the official, confirmed description through the Magisterium. And still, there was no split of a valid communion until when?
Id like to say His true flesh and blood was the means which mankind received Reconciliation, eternal life, and His Holy Spirit.
No, there is one true Loaf. His Eucharist is a thanksgiving and a receiving Him into ourselves. His Eucharist is bound to all that is professes through the Mass. The veneration of the Sacred Scriptures, the Churches Apostolic Teachings, the prayers, and songs included. To reject some of these is to reject some of His Eucharist. To reject some of His Eucharist requires Reconciliation. And some rejection may be venial, while some may be mortal. What is mortal rejection of His Teaching while receiving His Eucharist is a betrayal, just like Judas.
No, we receive by faith and understanding comes by searching. Some have great understanding and other’s little.
It is not our “appreciation heart” which consecrates His Eucharist, but it is our Appreciative Heart which brings us to His Eucharist, and even worthily!
Careful, eazy.
The question becomes, is it the will of the Father to participate in His Eucharist?
It is not a sign of the covenant. It is how one is entered into the covenant. You don’t have a covenant without the ritual. Until the ritual is completed, you have no covenant.
Our meager offerings of bread and wine, and our donations to the Church, are offered in union with Christ’s one sacrifice, so that it is joined to His sacrifice. You’ll see a similar notion in Colossian 1:24, where Paul speaks of his sufferings making up what is lacking in Christ’s sacrifice. It doesn’t mean that His sacrifice wasn’t sufficient, it means it lacks our participation with His sacrifice.