If men and women could do both

[PetersKeys]

Chill Winston??

What if we had our reproductive organs on our foreheads? Would it then be alright to mate in public?? This is fun. I’m starting my novel…Whatever…

LoL. That just gave me a picture in my mind I do not want, lol

 

[PetersKeys]

There are people born with both sets of external organs every year. They are called hermorphadites (sp). Could a pair of them impregnate one another? Certain creatures of lower phyla then human can and do this sort of thing. It just isn’t how God set up humans to be. If he had made us like the above there would be no such thing as homosexuality so how could it be a sin?

original sin. Humans have the stain. Thats why there is defects. Its because of Adam, not God.

 

[pathia]

What you are suggesting is simply not possible for many reasons, most biological.

People who have an ambiguous gender as a result of abnormal development are “intersexed”. They often suffer from serious emotional problems, but are still of a specific gender.

Hermaphrodites are caused by chromosomal abnormalities. Such people are always sterile and often suffer from developmental and/or cognitive deficits.

Hermaphrodite is outdated, intersexed is the word that applies to all of these cases. Those of us who are intersexed push for the word because hermaphrodite is OFFENSIVE. Period. It draws from pagan religions of fertility deities with both genders, when in fact almost all of us are sterile.

There is no definitional difference between hermaphrodite and intersex in medical terms. One is considered outdated and offensive, that is the only difference between the two.

 

[BlaineTog]

I think some of you perhaps don’t understand what “science fiction” is. In this case especially, it’s taking a strange, possibly contradictory and impossible notion that could nevertheless shed light on an issue from a different angle, and pretending it’s possible.

Though actually, Goth_Catholic, this is a “speculative fiction” story instead of science fiction, since your protagonist is a freak of nature, so to speak, and science doesn’t really come into it, but that’s a minor point. I think that since the man would be able to fulfill the unitive aspect of sex, it would be licit for him to have sex with men, though keep in mind that calling him a “man” is strictly speaking inaccurate. It’s a tricky question, though, since while gender is more than your sex organs, it is tied to the sex organs to a certain extent, so presumably someone with a fully-working set of both types (more or less) would have a similarly duo-dimensional soul as well.

In any case, I don’t think there’s any harm in exploring the concept in fiction. Even if it wouldn’t be ok after all, it’s just a story, and it could be rather interesting all the same.

 

[hasikelee]

Hermaphrodite is outdated, intersexed is the word that applies to all of these cases. Those of us who are intersexed push for the word because hermaphrodite is OFFENSIVE. Period. It draws from pagan religions of fertility deities with both genders, when in fact almost all of us are sterile.

There is no definitional difference between hermaphrodite and intersex in medical terms. One is considered outdated and offensive, that is the only difference between the two.

Pathia, I agree. Even the sound of Hermaphrodite brings connotations, whereas intersexed seems more medical/scientific in nature.

One thing I wonder about is if there are terms used for medical purposes to further define specific cases, as not all organs of both sexes are present for everyone.

To the OP: that is a very interesting plot for a fictional story. Can you explain more? Do you mean for the story to be about the man discovering himself and seeing how he fits into the world, or a scientific thriller of sorts?

 

[Deo_Volente]

Grace & Peace!

I’m frankly surprised and disappointed by the tremendous amount of bile and vitriol produced by an innocuous question related to a piece of admittedly imaginative fiction. Wow.

Goth_Catholic, I think you’ve asked a couple questions here–the first relates to the general, “if men and women could each get pregnant…” Answering this question for the purposes of your story would involve more questions–if they shared similar biology, would gender distinctions need to be made? If they didn’t share the same biology, what distinguishes the male from the female?

Your second question is: if a self-identified gay male discovered that somehow he is able to become pregnant, would a man impregnating him qualify as homosexual sex? It’s an interesting question when you consider, for instance, the emotional predicament of pre-op male to female trans-sexuals–do they feel they’re having homosexual sex with male partners? Do their partners share the same feelings? Do they even identify as gay? Your story offers you the tantalizing ability to really explore concepts of the masculine and the feminine.

Perhaps, though, trying to find an answer to whether or not the acts in question are homosexual is less interesting than doing the following: figure out how your main character feels about the situation. Figure out how their sexual partner feels about the situation. Figure out how the people around them feel about the situation. And then right the tension of all of these conflicting viewpoints and passionately held positions and opinions. Do any of these positions/opinions change through the course of the story and the unfolding of the conflict/action? Why or why not? You may not answer your original question, but as Checkov once wrote, and I paraphrase, “my job is not to provide answers–my job is to state the question correctly.”

Good luck on your story!

Under the Mercy,
Mark

Deo Gratias!

 

[pathia]

Pathia, I agree. Even the sound of Hermaphrodite brings connotations, whereas intersexed seems more medical/scientific in nature.

One thing I wonder about is if there are terms used for medical purposes to further define specific cases, as not all organs of both sexes are present for everyone.

I don’t know of any other medical term used outside of the even more recent ‘Disorders of sex development’ which is what some doctors have started to use instead of intersex, but most intersex people don’t like that term as it is too…clinical.

There are no further refined definitions, just specific medical conditions. Many many many things can cause intersex, the next step down in defining it is whatever underlying condition caused the intersexism.

Myself, I am a mosaic, that is to say I have XX, XY and XXY chromosomes in my body. Depending on where you examine, I have different ones.

 

[Dale_M]

I’m frankly surprised and disappointed by the tremendous amount of bile and vitriol produced by an innocuous question related to a piece of admittedly imaginative fiction. Wow.

Yes, I agree. Its simply astounding that people are not able to set fact aside and consider a fictional world.

The situation which Goth_Catholic has proposed is very much within the realm of science fiction. I understand that this genre doesn’t appeal to everyone, but I don’t understand the need to ruin her thread with strong statements of dislike.

Honestly, if someone doesn’t like the topic, move on to a thread you do enjoy!

 

[Deo_Volente]

Grace & Peace!

The situation which Goth_Catholic has proposed is very much within the realm of science fiction.

Absolutely! And you just reminded me of one of the greatest (arguably!) works of science fiction–Ursula K. LeGuin’s “The Left Hand of Darkness” which features an alien humanoid race whose members change sex (like frogs and other amphibians) every few years or so–eventually causing no small amount of angst to the human hero of the novel. A very good read!

Under the Mercy,
Mark

Deo Gratias!

 

[hasikelee]

I don’t know of any other medical term used outside of the even more recent ‘Disorders of sex development’ which is what some doctors have started to use instead of intersex, but most intersex people don’t like that term as it is too…clinical.

There are no further refined definitions, just specific medical conditions. Many many many things can cause intersex, the next step down in defining it is whatever underlying condition caused the intersexism.

Myself, I am a mosaic, that is to say I have XX, XY and XXY chromosomes in my body. Depending on where you examine, I have different ones.

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut, Pathia. I hope you don’t mind my saying that it is fascinating to think you can examine in different places and get different results!

 

[pathia]

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut, Pathia. I hope you don’t mind my saying that it is fascinating to think you can examine in different places and get different results!

It was quite a surprise to me I must admit, though it did explain MUCH. We didn’t realize this until late HS/college, everyone just figured I was gay.

 

[deb1]

Yes, I agree. Its simply astounding that people are not able to set fact aside and consider a fictional world.

The situation which Goth_Catholic has proposed is very much within the realm of science fiction. I understand that this genre doesn’t appeal to everyone, but I don’t understand the need to ruin her thread with strong statements of dislike.

Honestly, if someone doesn’t like the topic, move on to a thread you do enjoy!

I think that some people on this thread might be unfamiliar with scifiction/fantasy type novels. Personally, I think that this is intresting topic for a short story. Keep up the writing, Goth Catholic.