If the Burka is banned in France, shouldn't Nun's outfits be banned?

[tcm22]

No. Explain it to me please one more time. Are we talking about the burqa or the abaya? Appears to be 2 completely different things to me and tell me what particular region are you talking about?

They are different garments that both serve the same purpose, to conceal a woman from public view.

 

[Sarabande]

Didn’t it used to be illegal to wear clericals (a Catholic priest garb) on the streets in France? Is it still so? If it is, or if it used to be, then it is very much in keeping with the history of the country to ban a burka. Nothing odd there at all.

During the French Revolution, it became illegal for anyone of the Church to wear their clericals or habit. It also became illegal for religious communities to live and worship together. It totally went against what they thought was the spirit of Enlightenment. They wanted to get rid of religion because they felt it favored the aristocracy and the wealthy. Some would argue that the French Revolution did much to almost destroy Catholicism in France.

Many religious were imprisoned and basically martyred for their faith. Their deaths actually helped bring an end to Robespierre’s Reign of Terror because the French people found how horrific it was to start murdering simple, religious people who had nothing to do with what was going on politically. One of the most popular works which brought to light the plight of these religious was Poulenc’s opera “The Dialogues of the Carmelites”. It was based on the true story of a community of Carmelites called the Martyrs of Compiegne (they were beatified in 1906) who were guillotined because they went against the law and still met for prayer. I can say it was one of the most moving operas I ever performed in and even people who wouldn’t necessarily like modern opera were totally taken with the story. Here is some information about the actual nuns:

ourgardenofcarmel.org/martyrs.html

Anyway, in a way this banning of the burka brought to my mind what happened in their not so distant past. Of course, these Muslim women won’t be guillotined, but restricting their freedom to wear a head covering or burka does remind me how they restricted the religious from wearing their habits and clericals. It definitely isn’t a new thing to them.

I was in France just a few years ago and I saw many sisters still in full habit over there in a few of the churches we visited. One such place was at Sacre Coeur. Many of the sisters there were also young women, which seems to be a rare thing over in the States.

 

[Pug]

ourgardenofcarmel.org/martyrs.html

Anyway, in a way this banning of the burka brought to my mind what happened in their not so distant past. Of course, these Muslim women won’t be guillotined, but restricting their freedom to wear a head covering or burka does remind me how they restricted the religious from wearing their habits and clericals. It definitely isn’t a new thing to them.

I was in France just a few years ago and I saw many sisters still in full habit over there in a few of the churches we visited. One such place was at Sacre Coeur. Many of the sisters there were also young women, which seems to be a rare thing over in the States.

Thanks, Sarabande. I’m glad to hear sisters can wear their habit now over there. What a wonderful witness we have in our religious, especially the martyrs whom you mention. I’d never heard of that group of sixteen nuns. I hope religious will retain the freedom to wear the habit of their order.

 

[royal_archer]

I somehow get the impression we are talking about 2 different things…the burqa I am referring to is on this link images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6a/Burqa_ill_artlibre_jnl.png&imgrefurl=http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Burqa_ill_artlibre_jnl.png&usg=__4pp-Lfbo-1g0yDaX6Wzq15tcZNo=&h=748&w=508&sz=121&hl=en&start=19&tbnid=oEjfxICz9kkIdM:&tbnh=141&tbnw=96&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dburqa%26gbv%3D2%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG Which I am just taking a shot in the dark here is probable the choice of extremists such as the Taliban and Bin Laden supporters…
That being said, it may be argued that perhaps I should wear a bag over my head, and bring another in case the first one falls off. But given the choice…the burqa or the bullet…I’d take the bullet.

I wasn’t talking about anyone being forced to wear one, but wearing one voluntarily

 

[fellicia]

In most of Western society people make judgements and much of communication occurs via facial expressions, bodily movements and obviously speech. To hide these ways of jusdgment and communication how would you know if you have upset someone or if someone needs your help, communication via language is a large barrier between many muslims and many other people. so smiling, crying etc is our main way of communication and judgment.

When I talk about judgment I mean the type where an individual needs to make a judgment on whether they are in danger or not. Society has taught us to be weiry of those where we can not see their face. For instance in many stores and shops individuals may not enter with anything that covers their face: cap, hat, helmet, baraclava. This is for safety, therefore I agree with the banning of the full covering of the face whether for religious reasons or not. As for the reason the french government are giving I do not agree with preventing an individual from showing their religion as long as it does not endanger others. The thing is the person behind the ‘mask’ could be a male rapist and unless we are weiry of this we may be putting ourselves in alot of danger (Bare in mind I am a young female).

Fellicia x x x

 

[fellicia]

However the Nun’s outfit and many other muslim attire does not cover the full face and therefore is not in the same catagory as above.

 

[budgie2]

Here’s some spiritual music.
youtube.com/watch?v=aEvTOdqqVD4

 

[system]

A nun wears a “habit” and their face is not covered. So to compare an nun’s “habit” to a berka is absurd.

In addition, nuns are not forced to wear anything; it is their choice.

A berka is just a symbol of servitude to men.