If the Church went underground would your priest know he could include you?

[Elf01]

My current priest has been in the parish for two months and, due to Covid restrictions I have not been able to attend Mass.

Short answer, no. Long answer the staff and other priest know me, so, if he went to them, he might know.

 

[QuillWriter]

I should hope he would, yes. We’re in a small parish, and he knows me and my kids, and that we attend regularly. My oldest was an altar server pre-pandemic, too.

 

[MrsAngelala]

Unfortunately, somebody talked to the press and the Archbishop shut all the “underground Masses” down.

We went underground last time, by “open secret” to an email list that only included people the office knew at first thought and could easily name as regulars. It was one of that group who tattled to the Bishop. Of course we’ll never know who, but that was was pretty hard.

To answer the OP – yes, I would be on that list. Our pastor knows every single face. Plus, my family is blessed to be involved in parish life… but I live in the next state over, so if the “underground” is due to another round of COVID closures and they close borders this time, I’m still stuck. Father says not to bother with the ifs at this point though: things are going to start moving fast enough that we won’t be able to keep up if we try to plan for everything that isn’t going to happen.

 

[HeDa]

People would bring baskets and pick berries and muchrooms before or after the Liturgies. Gather wood for fires as well as branches with leaves to be able to feed their animals in winter when the snow covered the ground. There is a process for making coal from trees that takes days. Hunting animals and fishing in rivers and lakes. “Working in the forest” is very natural in farming areas and an easy disguise.

 

[Socrates92]

Tis_Bearself:

I would hope he would include everybody who’s at daily Mass regularly, so that would include me, yes.

I managed to find the “underground” Mass for a week during COVID shutdown. Unfortunately, somebody talked to the press and the Archbishop shut all the “underground Masses” down.

Thank God.

So, I guess for you, the answer to the thread question would be “no”?

 

[blackforest]

Unless you’ve never been to a single public place since April, you may not have room to talk here.

 

[NevermoreLenore]

I do get what they’re saying though…both of them. I’m in a weird situation wherein I have cancer but am stable-ish and I have a daughter with a terribly dangerous brain tumour, so exposure is terrifying. But I have other kids who are losing their minds being stuck in one house with the same people for nine months straight.

I actually think this is an odd topic, because nothing (and everything) is universal–one poster above says their priest knows every face. As a person attending a parish of over a thousand families, who has a (seemingly random) rotating team of priests saying Mass, recognising a face is no indicator or lack thereof of the faithfulness of one person. A parish in the heart of Denver or Chicago may have thousands quietly attending Mass. The greatest Christians I’ve personally known are rarely noticed.

If the Church being ‘forced underground’ because of persecution, we should absolutely fight, defy orders, and meet together even under penalty of death. But that isn’t the situation here. The Church is not being singled out with sanctions against gathering–every gathering of any nature is being temporarily halted for the good of all. No one (I’m in the US and talking in generalities) is going house to house, confiscating bibles and articles of faith. The Church here is being affected by the closures, but the sanctions are global, not specific to the Church or in order to prevent Christians from gathering.

 

[FrankFletcher]

FrankFletcher:

Tis_Bearself:

I would hope he would include everybody who’s at daily Mass regularly, so that would include me, yes.

I managed to find the “underground” Mass for a week during COVID shutdown. Unfortunately, somebody talked to the press and the Archbishop shut all the “underground Masses” down.

Thank God.

So, I guess for you, the answer to the thread question would be “no”?

I almost don’t know where to begin. First, during this pandemic, the Church hasn’t gone “underground.” Second, if some parishes are publicly saying Masses in violation of a community law, they should be held responsible. Third, I still have no idea what the OP is referring to when posing this question.

 

[FrankFletcher]

Unless you’ve never been to a single public place since April, you may not have room to talk here.

Masses in my area are open to the public again. If you reread the thread, you’ll note that I was responding to someone who was attending Mass “secretly” until the priest was reported to the diocese for celebrating Mass with others present when the state explicitly barred this kind of gathering.

 

[Socrates92]

the Church hasn’t gone “underground.”

strange…

saying Masses in violation of a community law,

is the definition of going underground, and we were just discussing that happening.

they should be held responsible.

Answers my question that you would not be trustable if the Church did have to underground on a larger scale.

 

[FrankFletcher]

I’m not appreciating your tone, friend. Shutdowns due to COVID weren’t a matter of finding out which Catholics were “trustworthy.” Again: the Church did not go “underground” when public Masses had to be temporarily suspended.

Americans are such children in this area — we’ve never been deprived of Mass as often as we like. If we had any experience living as the unprivileged do in other areas of the world, we might be able to handle a temporary absence from the Mass without resorting to calling it “going underground” or looking for ways to skirt public health restrictions.

 

[Socrates92]

I’m not appreciating your tone, friend.

As is your prerogative.

Shutdowns due to COVID weren’t a matter of finding out which Catholics were “trustworthy.”

I disagree.

Americans are such children in this area — we’ve never been deprived of Mass as often as we like. If we had any experience living as the unprivileged do in other areas of the world, we might be able to handle a temporary absence from the Mass without resorting to calling it “going underground” or looking for ways to skirt public health restrictions.

I’m not sure what you’re getting at. What are we supposed to call it? It’s simply a descriptive term.

 

[FrankFletcher]

FrankFletcher:

Shutdowns due to COVID weren’t a matter of finding out which Catholics were “trustworthy.”

I disagree.

What a horribly uncharitable take on your fellow Catholics.

 

[on_the_hill]

No. He wouldn’t.

He’s new to the parish and I haven’t been there since Covid.
He doesn’t know me from a lump of coal.

Aside from the fact that, up until the covid dispensation, I probably missed about half a dozen Sunday Masses over the course of my entire lifetime of 53 years, I doubt any priest would know me well enough to remember my name.

 

[Socrates92]

Socrates92:

FrankFletcher:

Shutdowns due to COVID weren’t a matter of finding out which Catholics were “trustworthy.”

I disagree.

What a horribly uncharitable take on your fellow Catholics.

Not particularly. It’s more a matter of prudence. Anyone who would cheer a Church being shut down and Sacraments being denied for a such a trifling reason is simply not someone I’d want guarding my back if things get really ugly. Any talk about whether it’s “charitable” or “not charitable” to think that way is just silly rhetoric.

 

[FrankFletcher]

A global pandemic is a “trifling reason.” Interesting.

 

[Socrates92]

A global pandemic is a “trifling reason.” Interesting.

This one certainly is, since it kills practically no one.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

What a horribly uncharitable take on your fellow Catholics.

Actually, I found your initial response to be “horribly uncharitable”. Pot, meet kettle.
I also agree with Socrates regarding indication of trustworthiness.

 

[FrankFletcher]

FrankFletcher:

What a horribly uncharitable take on your fellow Catholics.

Actually, I found your initial response to be “horribly uncharitable”. Pot, meet kettle.
I also agree with Socrates regarding indication of trustworthiness.

I’m not really surprised – you were attending Masses that shouldn’t have been open to the public, so criticism of such a choice must seem uncharitable.

What is concerning, though, is your belief that if Catholics weren’t willing to endanger others by meeting for Mass in secret, they shouldn’t be seen as “trustworthy” when, for example, something actually significant happens, like the faith being publicly outlawed. That isn’t just “my feeling are hurt” uncharitable – it’s “I’m unfairly generalizing about others’ commitment to the faith” uncharitable.

 

[JanR]

As I see the discrimination and persecution against religious worshipping during this pandemic, while other enterprises are allowed which are much more likely to spread the virus, I can’t help think there is a larger conspiracy among some in power to abolish religious freedom in this country, altogether. Against the First Amendment, of course, but our Constitution has been meaningless to them for quite some time. Even those who have sworn to uphold it were just mouthing the words so they could get sworn into office, with no real intention of upholding the Constitution, at all.

I can imagine the Church eventually being forced underground under those circumstances, and I fear its exile may become permanent.

We are drawing closer and closer to becoming a totalitarian dictatorship, borne of corruption and greed for power. If we lose the Senate in the run-off in Georgia, we might as well kiss our freedoms goodbye. We’ll be there.