If the story of Noah really happened how can we have (and need) genetic variation?

[Abbadon]

I ran a poll a few months back and noticed about a 70%+ rate of people who believe in the literal truth of Noah’s ark.

I was hoping that some of the people who believe so would take a few minutes of their time to watch this video.

youtube.com/watch?v=rIlWKp44T50

And respond with an explanation of how you reconcile this known fact of inbreeding and genetic variation. If your answer is faith, god did it or magic, I completely understand your position and don’t worry about justifying yourself, it’s all good. But really is there another answer?

Love to find out…

 

[pyropam]

If the original texts are read, the word that was transcribed as “world” really means “Land”. Thus, the area where Noah was located was flooded, and more probably not the entire world.

Scientist have proven that that area of the world was flooded during that time period. They have found complete “fish” fossils on the tops of mountains. However, areas like North and South America were not flooded during that time period.

Remember, science cannot prove the bible wrong.

 

[Jim_Baur]

What is the literal meaning of the flood?

I know that there is a literal meaning.

I do not know if the account is in its literal meaning?

The CCC teaches that the Holy Bible speaks in symbolic language some of the time.

I ponder if the account of Naoh is not one of those times?

The symbolic language must be moved into the literal.

Some easy examples are the some of the Psalms. Also, the parables of Jesus.

I do not know if the Ark of Noah is already in the literal–Is it?

 

[idiopathogen]

A lack of genetic variation would only continue over time with generations of full-sib matings as has been done with research mice. Without continuing full-sib matings, genetic variation naturally occurs.

Changes in environment and an increasing population would naturally cause increased genetic variation and genetic drift, because there is an interaction between the environment and genes, and siblings tend to separate.

This has been described by scientists for a long while, and is particularly important when it comes to studying and recovering endangered species.

The important thing to realize is that the Bible, while not contradicted by science, was written by men inspired by the Spirit of God for your conscience, not to merely satisfy your curiousity.

By the creation we learn the manifold wisdom and power of God. At the cross, we learn the heart of God. What does science teach for our heart and conscience? Nothing.

 

[Abbadon]

A lack of genetic variation would only continue over time with generations of full-sib matings as has been done with research mice. Without continuing full-sib matings, genetic variation naturally occurs.

Changes in environment and an increasing population would naturally cause increased genetic variation and genetic drift, because there is an interaction between the environment and genes, and siblings tend to separate.

This has been described by scientists for a long while, and is particularly important when it comes to studying and recovering endangered species.

Then why has such not occurred with the cheetah? Would it be possible to get a link or a reference i have access to science journals through my uni so I can look it up that way if that helps.

Any holy text or spiritual guide to be used as a philosophy or living you own life is fine. I totally understand that, it is just when the bible and other holy texts are taken on as historical fact. Like the world being created in 7 days 6000 years ago, or Noahs ark happening just as written.

The important thing to realize is that the Bible, while not contradicted by science, was written by men inspired by the Spirit of God for your conscience, not to merely satisfy your curiosity.

I’m not sure about that, the whole adam and eve story as well as noahs ark has been debunked. And as for the jews ever bieng in egypt well last I heard there has never really been any evidence of such (beside of course writings in holy books). But of course as time goes on and our understanding grows, bit’s of holy texts that no longer match up with the evidence become allegory (is that the right word?).

By the creation we learn the manifold wisdom and power of God. At the cross, we learn the heart of God. What does science teach for our heart and conscience? Nothing.

I’m not sure what you mean by the first two lines. But no of course not science is only really concerned with the truth of the reality in which we live. What does the evidence tell us.

Questions of morality, questions of god, these are not things that science looks to answer. I personally think that these are personal answers that each individgual can answer for themselves.

I mean sure anthrapology can look at the formation of morality, studying the brain can show us many things. But it cannot tell us what is right and what is wrong, we must determine that for our selves as we have managed to figure out for much of history…

 

[inthecloud]

I thought that was at CARM not in Catholic Answers.

The Noah story is based on a real flood that happens once in several thousand of years that makes the area in Irak between the Tigris and Euphates a interior sea. There are similar versions of Noah story in the Sumerian and Babilonian cosmologies. And archological remains of several huge floods in the region.
The Church does not teach that the Noah story is literally true but is based in a real story that might have been exagerated by several generations of oral history. The moral teaching of the story are the things that really matter most.

 

[Abbadon]

If the original texts are read, the word that was transcribed as “world” really means “Land”. Thus, the area where Noah was located was flooded, and more probably not the entire world.

Scientist have proven that that area of the world was flooded during that time period. They have found complete “fish” fossils on the tops of mountains. However, areas like North and South America were not flooded during that time period.

Remember, science cannot prove the bible wrong.

Of course that is a reasonable way of looking at it. Actually I thought it was a local Sumerian king called Zeusutra, not Noah. Now there is geological and archelogical evidence to support that. There are also 6 other flood stories in the local region, which makes sense.

However, areas like North and South America were not flooded during that time period.

Of course and also areas like the rest of the world.

Remember, science cannot prove the bible wrong.

Now this statement is said later on to. I find this interesting, because in science it is not the duty of someone else to prove something wrong. It is the responsibility of the person making the hypothesis to prove their statement true and then survive peer review.

You can’t disprove the pink unicorn or the blue faeries can you?

If you are concerned with the philosophy of the bible, there is no proving wrong or right there. All there is is deciding if that is a good guide or not.

But if you move on to factual statements of history and of reality, then these facts can be tested. Often statements are made without any evidence but the word of the holy text it’s self. For example Mohamed rising to heaven, or Jesus turning water into wine. Now we will never really no if these events happened or not. But how the world was created and if there was a world wide flood… we can know the truth of these things…

I don’t think it is right to look for the evidence that supports your certain idea, but more look at what does the evidence say…

 

[Abbadon]

What is the literal meaning of the flood?

I know that there is a literal meaning.

I do not know if the account is in its literal meaning?

The CCC teaches that the Holy Bible speaks in symbolic language some of the time.

I ponder if the account of Naoh is not one of those times?

The symbolic language must be moved into the literal.

Some easy examples are the some of the Psalms. Also, the parables of Jesus.

I do not know if the Ark of Noah is already in the literal–Is it?

I obviously do not take any of the bible as literal, but as historical stories of the time I find it fascinating. What i like the most is how cain and able represent the struggle between the agriculturists and the herders. But i would never take any of it to be a actual historical truth unless of course there is evidence to support the tale, then of course we know it was true…

 

[Abbadon]

What is the literal meaning of the flood?

I know that there is a literal meaning.

I do not know if the account is in its literal meaning?

The CCC teaches that the Holy Bible speaks in symbolic language some of the time.

I ponder if the account of Naoh is not one of those times?

The symbolic language must be moved into the literal.

Some easy examples are the some of the Psalms. Also, the parables of Jesus.

I do not know if the Ark of Noah is already in the literal–Is it?

I obviously do not take any of the bible as literal, but as historical stories of the time I find it fascinating. What i like the most is how cain and able represent the struggle between the agriculturists and the herders. But i would never take any of it to be a actual historical truth unless of course there is evidence to support the tale, then of course we know it was true… untill then i will remain agnostic on the issue…

 

[Abbadon]

I thought that was at CARM not in Catholic Answers.

The Noah story is based on a real flood that happens once in several thousand of years that makes the area in Irak between the Tigris and Euphates a interior sea. There are similar versions of Noah story in the Sumerian and Babilonian cosmologies. And archological remains of several huge floods in the region.
The Church does not teach that the Noah story is literally true but is based in a real story that might have been exagerated by several generations of oral history. The moral teaching of the story are the things that really matter most.

Of course and that again is a completely reasonable way of looking at it.

what is CARM?
Did the church once teach it was true?
And how does the church decide what is literal and what is not?

I can’t believe i haven’t asked that last one before, I have never sought the answer to that question, nychance you could just tell me please and save me time researching I have alot of NWN2 to cathch up on…

 

[inthecloud]

CARM is a Christian Answers Reseach. A fundamentalist literalist ANTICATHOLIC group.
While the Church did teach a literalist Genesis the literality never was fully a matter of faith. There were always degrees of speculation.
Modern science makes a literal Genesis imposible no matter what the fundies say and some left behind Catholic Traditionalists that seem to have missed the lattest 6 Popes teachings.