If there is life elsewhere, in another universe

[StrawberryJam]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

 

[Tuno]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

We tend, being anthropomorphic creatures and narrow minded ones at that, to believe that “life” means forms. It includes forms, the higher forms generally incorporating and transcending the lower, especially in the modes of awareness available. Most humans seem to use one, and that, poorly. But at the quantum level one can’t tell what’s “alive” and what’s not. In fact LIFE is the pressure of the ALLNESS of God fulfilling itself as the self observed manifestation of Universe(s) or Creation as experience.

There is a reason that there is a crucifixion story, a very good one, but it is not congruent with the exoteric interpretation of the Church, which imho is off base with it. This goes as well for the story of The Light Bearer and the alleged Fall. Ask yourself: “Where do I perceive the crucifixion? Where is it for me?” It might be a useful koan for you.

 

[ProVobis]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

Possible. Maybe this has been done a few million years ago somewhere in another universe or galaxy and it would take us or other universes another few million years to find out for sure. Very good question, though.

 

[inocente]

Did you see the beam on the Chilean president’s face after the first miner was rescued today? Hopefully all the others will also get out, and then the spirit of the trapped miners, the faith of their families and the professionalism and hard work of the rescue team will have pulled off what can only be called a miracle, something to get emotional about.

Jesus is God, but suppose he was just a guy. He still died for us, not for any mere ideal, and just like any other brave soldier that’s also something to get emotional about. “Greater love has no one than this, that he lay down his life for his friends.”- John 15:13 NIV.

Aliens would have alien emotions if they had emotions at all, and God would work differently. But if instead the OP is talking about all the possible alternate realities involving humans, there must be one where Jesus never walks, where everyone is an atheist or a Taoist.

Maybe they don’t need rescuing (sorry, couldn’t resist).

 

[Tuno]

Maybe they don’t need rescuing (sorry, couldn’t resist).

Now THAT is one of the most useful things anyone has ever said on here. Ever.

 

[mindlight]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

We are already aware of other life forms in this universe than ourselves, animals and God. The Bible describes the existence and even names some angels for instance. These heavenly citizens appear to be smarter, more powerful and to operate in more dimensions than we are currently capable.

But Jesus did not die for angels. If they sin it seems that is it and they are doomed for all eternity. Redemption is as far as I know a gift given only to human beings.

Also the existence of life off world is at the moment pure speculation as the off world places we have explored are utterly devoid of life.

I wonder how much speculation about aliens actually has to do with the theory of evolution/ubiogenesis and the view that life can spontaneously arise from primeval soups. Given that noone has ever repeated the experiment maybe there is more to it than that!!! As far as the scriptures say we do not know any more than we have been told.

It may seem reasonable to say God is creative , creation is enormous so maybe God… but it remains pure speculation.

 

[abucs]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

I would say no.

Accepting the multiple Universe theory though we could say a Deity might have ‘worked out’ the ressurrection/sacrificial death event was the most advantageous way to work in the World while still granting free choice to his creatures. Although this of course could also be worked out through intellect and knowledge of human (or other) nature.

P.S. I also have queries to the “God must be consistent” comment.

Could we say God is not consistent in that Jesus died after countless humans had already died and not heard of Him - where’s the consistency for those people. Could we say God is not consistent in that He appeared to Moses/Saint Paul but not to me?

 

[TheRealJuliane]

How does everyone think about life on other planets, in other solar systems, etc.? When I see videos showing how big the universe really is, put into perspective, our little world seems so tiny, and yet God loves each of us as individuals. He hasn’t told us about any other worlds, but everyone I talk to about this says, “Well of COURSE there is life somewhere else in the universe!!” But I just don’t see it - wouldn’t he tell us about it if there were?

Maybe the universe is heaven and that is why it is expanding, to make room for all the souls that are joining up and meeting Jesus face to face.

I just can’t see God making other life forms and not telling us about it.

 

[abucs]

I could go either way about life on other planets. I wouldn’t share the idea that God would definately tell us about them if they were there, nor do i think we can use statistcs to know whether there is life in other Solar Systems.

One problem is that if there is life in other Solar Systems, they are so far away that i don’t see how we can foreseeably know they are there and communicate effectively with them.

I would like for there to be other life though and to communicate with them, but i just don’t see how it can be possible over such large distances.

 

[StrawberryJam]

We are already aware of other life forms in this universe than ourselves, animals and God. The Bible describes the existence and even names some angels for instance. These heavenly citizens appear to be smarter, more powerful and to operate in more dimensions than we are currently capable.

But Jesus did not die for angels. If they sin it seems that is it and they are doomed for all eternity. Redemption is as far as I know a gift given only to human beings.

Also the existence of life off world is at the moment pure speculation as the off world places we have explored are utterly devoid of life.

I wonder how much speculation about aliens actually has to do with the theory of evolution/ubiogenesis and the view that life can spontaneously arise from primeval soups. Given that noone has ever repeated the experiment maybe there is more to it than that!!! As far as the scriptures say we do not know any more than we have been told.

It may seem reasonable to say God is creative , creation is enormous so maybe God… but it remains pure speculation.

Did kids in Germany ever see Nova? I guess not.

 

[illmatic]

Must Jesus be crucifyed in all of them, if God exists and must be consistant?
If there are multiple universes, Is God having Jesus go in the flesh to die for all life in it? One by one?

No. We are told only of the Human fall, therefore it could be that other beings have not fell. If there is no fall, there is no need for Christ as second Adam coming to us.

 

[mindlight]

Did kids in Germany ever see Nova? I guess not.

One can be very familiar with science and still very sceptical about things that scientists are really not qualified to talk about e.g. the remote regions of the universe and the distant past and the story of our origins.

 

[tonyrey]

It is not necessary for Jesus to be crucified in every possible universe for one simple reason:
He can choose to liberate us from evil in any way He chooses. All that is necessary is for Him to express His infinite love in a way that can be understood. As far as we can tell, the best way of doing this is to become incarnate - as He has done on this planet - and act as a role model which will vary according to the circumstances.

He will be rejected because His teaching is always a threat to those who are in power and exploit others. He will probably be put to death like many of the noblest men and women in history but He may be condemned to life imprisonment instead. No one can expose evil and denounce hypocrisy without incurring hatred. What is certain is that Jesus will suffer wherever He appears: that is the price of love - and the greater the love the greater the suffering. He will always sacrifice Himself for others because He is the Way, the Truth and the Life…

 

[tonyrey]

Could we say God is not consistent in that Jesus died after countless humans had already died and not heard of Him - where’s the consistency for those people. Could we say God is not consistent in that He appeared to Moses/Saint Paul but not to me?

No! What matters most is not that people have heard of Him but that He has died for us and liberated us with His love.

Countless humans have died and not heard of Him both before and since He lived on earth. He chose to be born when the time was ripe for His teaching to be understood and spread by His followers throughout the Roman Empire. It is inevitable there are many who have not heard of Him because the world is an immense place! It is a miracle that the moral teaching of a Jewish carpenter in an obscure province is now accepted by all civilised persons and one third of the total world population have become Christians. Those who have not heard of Him are not at a disadvantage because no one is penalised for invincible ignorance…

 

[abucs]

Hi tonyrey,

could you explain how you see the metaphysical change that happened when Jesus died.

I am having trouble thinking about this on metaphysical terms and tend to think about it more on personal terms.

thanks.

 

[StrawberryJam]

One can be very familiar with science and still very sceptical about things that scientists are really not qualified to talk about e.g. the remote regions of the universe and the distant past and the story of our origins.

Would theologians be more helpful in understanding these matters?

 

[tonyrey]

Hi tonyrey,

could you explain how you see the metaphysical change that happened when Jesus died.

I am having trouble thinking about this on metaphysical terms and tend to think about it more on personal terms.

thanks.

For theists - and Christians in particular - personal terms are metaphysical terms! Persons are real entities rather just legal conventions. What happens to us personally is an objective fact which is far more significant than physical events.

We are affected by the Death and Resurrection of Jesus because He uplifted us by being uplifted on the Cross and glorified as a result of His love. He not only showed us the way to heaven but He is the Way. If we identify ourselves with Him as He identified Himself with us we share His life in heaven - not only when we die but now on earth. That is why so many men and women have been capable of astonishing feats of courage and endurance in the face of evil and injustice. Love is the greatest power there is and it can transform us even if we are unaware it exists. It only remains for us to love others as He loves us for when we love others we are united to Him and nothing can ever separate us…

 

[mindlight]

Would theologians be more helpful in understanding these matters?

Regarding the account of the creation of the universe yes I believe good theology can probably tell us more than bad science.

 

[Tuno]

Regarding the account of the creation of the universe yes I believe good theology can probably tell us more than bad science.

Say you are visiting here from another planet. Which of the 14 creation stories common in the world you to go with, and on what basis? What Universally acceptable criteria would one use?

 

[StrawberryJam]

For theists - and Christians in particular - personal terms are metaphysical terms! Persons are real entities rather just legal conventions. **What happens to us personally is an objective fact **which is far more significant than **physical events.**We are affected by the Death and Resurrection of Jesus because He uplifted us by being uplifted on the Cross and glorified as a result of His love. He not only showed us the way to heaven but He is the Way. If we identify ourselves with Him as He identified Himself with us we share His life in heaven - not only when we die but now on earth. That is why so many men and women have been capable of astonishing feats of courage and endurance in the face of evil and injustice. Love is the greatest power there is and it can transform us even if we are unaware it exists. It only remains for us to love others as He loves us for when we love others we are united to Him and nothing can ever separate us…

Sorry for asking this, but you have confused me here.
What happens to “us” personally could be non personal in nature. And simply a result of natural causes. I don’t even how what you mean by “what happens to us”