J
Jimmy_B
Guest
You are still my brother in Christ
If you are a “Protestant” or a Non-Catholic Christian, would you please share with us Catholics a summary of what it is that you actually believe?
- Status
S
Syele
Guest
hmm what I believe compared to Catholics beliefs?Thank You
Ok I’ll try, here are a few in no particular order.
My beliefs – Catholic Beliefs
- Scripture is inerrant and infallible and should be taken as God’s Word ahead of (but not excluding) any other source including tradition. – Both Scripture and Tradition must be accepted and honored with equal sentiments of devotion and reverence. (CCC 82)
- Mortal sin is a sin in which one turns completely away from God. This can be done in a moment of decision that is never repented of or gradually over time by continuing to commit sins unrepentantly. To commit a mortal sin is to renounce ones faith in and love for God completely. Those who never place faith and love for God in the first place also fall in this category. All sins are a grave matter as they put distance between us and God, when one is gradually distanced from God by their “small sins”, they my not realize what is happening therefore it **might not be with “deliberate consent” **though they do know they are sinning. I do believe God has mercy on those who did not have knowledge that what they are doing is sin.-- For a *sin *to be mortal, three conditions must together be met: "Mortal sin is sin whose object is grave matter and which is also committed with full knowledge and deliberate consent. (CCC 1857) Grave matter is specified by the Ten Commandments, corresponding to the answer of Jesus to the rich young man: "Do not kill, Do not commit adultery, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Do not defraud, Honor your father and your mother."132 The gravity of sins is more or less great: murder is graver than theft. One must also take into account who is wronged: violence against parents is in itself graver than violence against a stranger. (CCC1858)
- True Faith in God will lead to good works. Our salvation is based on our true faith placed completely in God and the grace of God. The works themselves do not count towards our salvation, but always result from true faith, given time. Good works we do on earth will be rewarded in Heaven.-- I do not know where in the CCC the teaching is that Salvation is by Faith AND works, but I feel fairly certain it is the teaching of the Catholic Church.
- ALL people have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. Jesus is the only exception to this ONLY because He is also fully God. – The Fathers of the Eastern tradition call the Mother of God “the All-Holy” (Panagia), and celebrate her as “free from any stain of sin, as though fashioned by the Holy Spirit and formed as a new creature”.138 By the grace of God Mary remained free of every personal sin her whole life long. (CCC 493)
- Any statement of fact can be determined to be inerrant based on comparison of it to other statements of fact, as Scripture is already known to be inerrant, it is a good measure to test such statements. All people however, are prone to error and should not be trusted blindly. All they say should also be checked for accuracy. – “The Roman Pontiff, head of the college of bishops, enjoys this infallibility in virtue of his office, when, as supreme pastor and teacher of all the faithful - who confirms his brethren in the faith he proclaims by a definitive act a doctrine pertaining to faith or morals. . . . The infallibility promised to the Church is also present in the body of bishops when, together with Peter’s successor, they exercise the supreme Magisterium,” above all in an Ecumenical Council.418 When the Church through its supreme Magisterium proposes a doctrine "for belief as being divinely revealed,"419 and as the teaching of Christ, the definitions "must be adhered to with the obedience of faith."420 This infallibility extends as far as the deposit of divine Revelation itself.421 (CCC 891)
[/quote]
Z
Zooey
Guest
F
flameburns623
Guest
Feel free to browse the Web for the Book of Common Prayer. Once located, take a gander at the Articles of Religion, near the back of the boo. Better yet, here they are:
cresourcei.org/creed39.html
Reasonably good summary of my own beliefs. I’m sure I could quibble over how some of them are understood through the prism of Catholicism or whatever but there you are.
M
mathematician
Guest
The Nicene Creed.
The Incarnation.
The Ressurection.
With respect to the Bible a nice formulation I like is not, “The Bible is God’s word” (black & white text), but “The Bible speaks God’s word”. (living Spirit).
But of course, when Aanglicans say, “One Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church,” they would add, “Which unfortunately doesn’t exist at the moment” (at least as an institution).
The Incarnation.
The Ressurection.
With respect to the Bible a nice formulation I like is not, “The Bible is God’s word” (black & white text), but “The Bible speaks God’s word”. (living Spirit).
But of course, when Aanglicans say, “One Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church,” they would add, “Which unfortunately doesn’t exist at the moment” (at least as an institution).
C
Claudius
Guest
I really don’t see how that is possible. For some, the entire Mass is sung, and beautifully I might add. The daily office is sung by many through the week and by most on Sunday.
M
mathematician
Guest
On another site somebody asked the difference between Catholicism and Anglicanism. It was a Catholic who replied, and one of the differences was, “the Anglicans have got the best hymns.”
M
mozart-250
Guest
Oh this looks interesting
I have some questions on the Baptism for the remission of sins part.
In a non-denominational church the pastor is the top of the hierarchy.
The 60s and 70s edition of the Late Great Planet Earth said that Jesus would come one generation after the founding of the state of Israel and that a Biblical Generation was 40 years. I understand that the revised edition of this masterpiece had a change in heart.
However, that seems to have been it for me.
I have heard convincing testimonies of the miraculous and have no doubts that is still occurs.
Does that count.
Oh the Apostle’s creed works for me. The Nicene too if you interpret Catholic as universal which it meant in the beginning.
I have some questions on the Baptism for the remission of sins part.
You have my sympathy. Keeping tabs of the 7,346,123 denominations that you say we have is certainly a daunting task.
Oh that is quite simple. Think of organizational hierarchy. In a denominational church, your pastor is under the umbrella of a central organization. He must ascribe to the fundamental beliefs of this central organization.
In a non-denominational church the pastor is the top of the hierarchy.
If only you knew what I knew…
No. But I do have a book that says the world is going to end in 1988.
The 60s and 70s edition of the Late Great Planet Earth said that Jesus would come one generation after the founding of the state of Israel and that a Biblical Generation was 40 years. I understand that the revised edition of this masterpiece had a change in heart.
You have not heard my “I was abducted by aliens” story. I had a project manager of mine believing this.
I talked with Him this morning, I don’t claim to be a prophet.
Well somewhere in my library I have an old book by David Wilkinson called “The Vision” where he claimed to see the future. I should go back and check out how accurate it was. I hope it was more so than my 60s Late Great Planet Earth.
Actually that is an interesting question I read a debate on. I have my doubts but I dunno.
Well I can I suppose. But they don’t speak back to me.
My mom can witness to the fact that when I was 4-5 I prayed for my cat that had distemper (which is fatal in cats). My cat was healed.
However, that seems to have been it for me.
I have heard convincing testimonies of the miraculous and have no doubts that is still occurs.
No more than it teaches about the other 7-8 churches in my community which is next to nothing. In a few sermons I heard my pastor reference St. Theresa and St. Patrick in positive lights.
Does that count.
B
Burning4Christ
Guest
I go to an Assemblies of God Church, a pentacostal denomination. The spesifics of the Pentacostals (the emphasis on the baptism of the holy spirit and the speaking of tounges,both corpororate and private prayer laungage, and the over all charismatic evangelical nature of the worship and of the sermons make the Pentacostal’s and the AOG’s diffrent. There are also subties on the Oneness Pentacostal theology that I understand little and what I do understand I cannot explain very well.
As far as what we teach about catholism, we have a general empathy and love for all persons who know and love Jesus Christ, and the Father. Spesifically with catholism I heard it explained that (and please I do not mean to incite hatred or anger, nor to I mean any offense by this) catholics can be devoted followers of Christ and many are, but with the inheriant ritualism and the well organized heirarchy, even if the Roman Catholic Church doesent teach such things as papal worship or absoluty papal infalibility or worship of the church rather than God, we see from personal experience that it happends. We see that some catholics tend to take some of the doctrines of the Roman Catholic Church to an extreme that even the church would not outright condon. This tends to get in the way of loving and knowing Jesus, his Father and His holy spirit. I must say though that to an extent this can be said of any church. Again this was not meant in offense and I apolgies for any offense taken.
I would also like to point out the simlilarities between Pentacostal/Charismatic/Evangelical Christians and Catholic Christians. I know that we all believe in the Basic Tenants of The Apostles Creed and The Nicene Creed. God the Father, Jesus his Son who was sent to save us, who died on the cross and rose again, the Holy spirit being a personal part of the trinity, that kind of thing. We all beleive that we are sinners and in need of Gods Grace and Salvation. Theres one peticular similiarty within Evangelical/Charismatic/Pentacostal Churchs and The Roman Catholic’s, That is the awarness and the combating of spiritual forces that we cannot always see with our human eyes. Although we may disagree on how to fight them, we know that they are there and need to be fought. Many Protestant Churchs fail to see this and therefore loose a part of the picture. I have personally encounter Demons in my room and have, through the power of the Holy Spirit and through the Blood of Jesus, They were driven out of my room. I do not boast about this, infact It was a terrifing experience that I wish on nobody, but I know, just like the Roman Catholics know, that Spiritual forces exsist and are active in this world, Ephsians 6:12 “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places”
I hope this helps you and your quest for understanding. May the peace of God that surpasses all human understanding keep your heart and mind in the knowldge and love of God, the father the son and the Holy Spirit, both now and forever
~Brendan M, A servant of Christ
P
ponyman
Guest
Hi Jimmy:
I am a Catholic Christian but my wife is not. She belongs to a church called the Church of Christ - not to be confused with the United Church of Christ. Just as you seem to be having a difficult time understanding what it is exactly that most of the Protestant churches espouse as their belief structure, many Protestants seem to have the same problem with understanding exactly why WE Catholics believe what we do. For instance, my wife is a theological literalist, so she requires a “Thus saeth the Lord” before she will believe something that is not spelled out in the Gospel. In example, she does not understand why we ask the Blessed Mother for help, or why we believe in Transubtantion or even why we use wine - she is convinence that Jesus used only grape juice; or more paticularly how we get away with refering to our priests as “father” when the Bible says to call no man father. More particularly she does not believe in such things as infant baptism or many of the other Rites of the Catholic Church. In fact, she does not even believe that we are Christian and are a made up, man made religion. These things are difficult to explain to her from the prospective of a Catholic and I have given up trying because I can not do it adequately. I wish that I had the talent or the wisdom to accomplish this since deep down I think that she would agree with most of the opinions of the Catholic Church if she really understood them. If you have any advice please let me know.
But more to your point, it seems that there are in reality many differences between what WE Catholics believe and what the various Protestants believe. Most do not believe in Transubstantiation at all, in short they do not accept the miracle that turns the bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ during the Eucharist. They do not believe in asking the Blessed Mother or the Saints to intervene in their lives, they do not believe in Confession, infant baptism and most of the other Rites which WE take for granted as providing a grace to help us through our worldly life.
Many, like my dear wife, are literalists - if the Bible does not say it you don’t do it, or vice versa. My wife does not even accept that the Catholic Church, both Roman and Orthodox, was the first Christian church and believes that Jesus founded the church to which she belongs and that in Jesus time that Christians were neither Catholics or otherwise but were merely “Christians”. While this is true to an extent, I have tried repeatedly to tell her that the word Catholic simply means the Universal Church and that it was founded by Christ who sent Peter and Paul, as well as the other Apostles, out to found His church in His name. She will not accept this.
The problem with understanding the beliefs of many of our prostestant breathern is that their belief structure is often as varied as the number of churches. Particularly those outside of the main-stream of protestant denominations are free to interpret scripture as they chose. I even met a baptist minister once who proclaimed that his church was founded by John the Baptist. I thought that was very odd indeed. It seems that the only commonality between the various protestant beliefs is the Holy Bible, and even with this the interpretations vary.
While WE as Catholics may disagree from time to time regarding our own doctrine and dogma, we are indeed lucky to share the blessing of a commonality of belief structure.
As a child I attended many churches within my area. As a child, I was even baptised in both the Catholic Church and the United Church of Christ. I have, in my life, worshiped in Baptist, Luthern, German Reformed, Methodist and many other churches, including Jewish Synogoge but I have never felt as complete in any of those as I feel when I go to Mass because it is in the Eurcharist that the real difference between the faiths is found. Protestants, it seem, simply do not accept in any way that Christ is physically present during Communion, and therein to me lies the difference in what WE as Catholics believe and what our protestant breathern believe.
If you can help me out in explaining things to my dear wife please let me know.
I am a Catholic Christian but my wife is not. She belongs to a church called the Church of Christ - not to be confused with the United Church of Christ. Just as you seem to be having a difficult time understanding what it is exactly that most of the Protestant churches espouse as their belief structure, many Protestants seem to have the same problem with understanding exactly why WE Catholics believe what we do. For instance, my wife is a theological literalist, so she requires a “Thus saeth the Lord” before she will believe something that is not spelled out in the Gospel. In example, she does not understand why we ask the Blessed Mother for help, or why we believe in Transubtantion or even why we use wine - she is convinence that Jesus used only grape juice; or more paticularly how we get away with refering to our priests as “father” when the Bible says to call no man father. More particularly she does not believe in such things as infant baptism or many of the other Rites of the Catholic Church. In fact, she does not even believe that we are Christian and are a made up, man made religion. These things are difficult to explain to her from the prospective of a Catholic and I have given up trying because I can not do it adequately. I wish that I had the talent or the wisdom to accomplish this since deep down I think that she would agree with most of the opinions of the Catholic Church if she really understood them. If you have any advice please let me know.
But more to your point, it seems that there are in reality many differences between what WE Catholics believe and what the various Protestants believe. Most do not believe in Transubstantiation at all, in short they do not accept the miracle that turns the bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ during the Eucharist. They do not believe in asking the Blessed Mother or the Saints to intervene in their lives, they do not believe in Confession, infant baptism and most of the other Rites which WE take for granted as providing a grace to help us through our worldly life.
Many, like my dear wife, are literalists - if the Bible does not say it you don’t do it, or vice versa. My wife does not even accept that the Catholic Church, both Roman and Orthodox, was the first Christian church and believes that Jesus founded the church to which she belongs and that in Jesus time that Christians were neither Catholics or otherwise but were merely “Christians”. While this is true to an extent, I have tried repeatedly to tell her that the word Catholic simply means the Universal Church and that it was founded by Christ who sent Peter and Paul, as well as the other Apostles, out to found His church in His name. She will not accept this.
The problem with understanding the beliefs of many of our prostestant breathern is that their belief structure is often as varied as the number of churches. Particularly those outside of the main-stream of protestant denominations are free to interpret scripture as they chose. I even met a baptist minister once who proclaimed that his church was founded by John the Baptist. I thought that was very odd indeed. It seems that the only commonality between the various protestant beliefs is the Holy Bible, and even with this the interpretations vary.
While WE as Catholics may disagree from time to time regarding our own doctrine and dogma, we are indeed lucky to share the blessing of a commonality of belief structure.
As a child I attended many churches within my area. As a child, I was even baptised in both the Catholic Church and the United Church of Christ. I have, in my life, worshiped in Baptist, Luthern, German Reformed, Methodist and many other churches, including Jewish Synogoge but I have never felt as complete in any of those as I feel when I go to Mass because it is in the Eurcharist that the real difference between the faiths is found. Protestants, it seem, simply do not accept in any way that Christ is physically present during Communion, and therein to me lies the difference in what WE as Catholics believe and what our protestant breathern believe.
If you can help me out in explaining things to my dear wife please let me know.
W
wynd
Guest
I believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible. And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the only-begotten, begotten of the Father before all ages; Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, not made, of one essence with the Father, by whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven, and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary, and became man; and was crucified also for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried; and the third day He rose again according to the Scriptures; and ascended into heaven and sits at the right hand of the Father. And He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead; and of His kingdom there shall be no end. And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of life, Who proceeds from the Father, Who with the Father and the Son together is worshipped and glorified, Who spoke by the prophets. In one holy catholic and apostolic Church. I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins. I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the world to come.
C
Curious
Guest
Like others have posted, everything I believe can be summed up in the Nicene and/or Apostles’ creed. With respect to Catholic beliefs?
Curious
- Confession to priest? Maybe - I’ve seen scripture to substantiate it that no fellow Protestant has ever been explain (nor I have I been able to explain) to my satisfaction.
- Transub? Possible
- Mary = mother of God? yes
- Mary = sinless? Hm…don’t know about that one.
- Catholic church the original church Jesus founded? Possible
- Praying to Mary and/or saints? Not sure about that one either
Curious
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Hello ponyman and welcome to CAF.Hi Jimmy:
I am a Catholic Christian but my wife is not. She belongs to a church called the Church of Christ - not to be confused with the United Church of Christ. Just as you seem to be having a difficult time understanding what it is exactly that most of the Protestant churches espouse as their belief structure, many Protestants seem to have the same problem with understanding exactly why WE Catholics believe what we do. For instance, my wife is a theological literalist, so she requires a “Thus saeth the Lord” before she will believe something that is not spelled out in the Gospel. In example, she does not understand why we ask the Blessed Mother for help, or why we believe in Transubtantion or even why we use wine - she is convinence that Jesus used only grape juice; or more paticularly how we get away with refering to our priests as “father” when the Bible says to call no man father. More particularly she does not believe in such things as infant baptism or many of the other Rites of the Catholic Church. In fact, she does not even believe that we are Christian and are a made up, man made religion. These things are difficult to explain to her from the prospective of a Catholic and I have given up trying because I can not do it adequately. I wish that I had the talent or the wisdom to accomplish this since deep down I think that she would agree with most of the opinions of the Catholic Church if she really understood them. If you have any advice please let me know.
But more to your point, it seems that there are in reality many differences between what WE Catholics believe and what the various Protestants believe. Most do not believe in Transubstantiation at all, in short they do not accept the miracle that turns the bread and wine into the body and blood of Christ during the Eucharist. They do not believe in asking the Blessed Mother or the Saints to intervene in their lives, they do not believe in Confession, infant baptism and most of the other Rites which WE take for granted as providing a grace to help us through our worldly life.
Many, like my dear wife, are literalists - if the Bible does not say it you don’t do it, or vice versa. My wife does not even accept that the Catholic Church, both Roman and Orthodox, was the first Christian church and believes that Jesus founded the church to which she belongs and that in Jesus time that Christians were neither Catholics or otherwise but were merely “Christians”. While this is true to an extent, I have tried repeatedly to tell her that the word Catholic simply means the Universal Church and that it was founded by Christ who sent Peter and Paul, as well as the other Apostles, out to found His church in His name. She will not accept this.
The problem with understanding the beliefs of many of our prostestant breathern is that their belief structure is often as varied as the number of churches. Particularly those outside of the main-stream of protestant denominations are free to interpret scripture as they chose. I even met a baptist minister once who proclaimed that his church was founded by John the Baptist. I thought that was very odd indeed. It seems that the only commonality between the various protestant beliefs is the Holy Bible, and even with this the interpretations vary.
While WE as Catholics may disagree from time to time regarding our own doctrine and dogma, we are indeed lucky to share the blessing of a commonality of belief structure.
As a child I attended many churches within my area. As a child, I was even baptised in both the Catholic Church and the United Church of Christ. I have, in my life, worshiped in Baptist, Luthern, German Reformed, Methodist and many other churches, including Jewish Synogoge but I have never felt as complete in any of those as I feel when I go to Mass because it is in the Eurcharist that the real difference between the faiths is found. Protestants, it seem, simply do not accept in any way that Christ is physically present during Communion, and therein to me lies the difference in what WE as Catholics believe and what our protestant breathern believe.
If you can help me out in explaining things to my dear wife please let me know.
I enjoyed reading your post and especially liked your quote -
"I have never felt as complete in any of those as I feel when I go to Mass".
I will be looking forward to reading more of your posts in the future.
Peace
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Hi Curious,
I don’t know if you can answer this… but, isn’t there other “Protestant” denominations" who believe in their own version of "Confession? Maybe in some of the earlier “Protestant” religions, thank you…
Peace
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Hi mozart,Oh this looks interesting
Oh the Apostle’s creed works for me. The Nicene too if you interpret Catholic as universal which it meant in the beginning.
I have some questions on the Baptism for the remission of sins part.
You have my sympathy. Keeping tabs of the 7,346,123 denominations that you say we have is certainly a daunting task.
Oh that is quite simple. Think of organizational hierarchy. In a denominational church, your pastor is under the umbrella of a central organization. He must ascribe to the fundamental beliefs of this central organization.
In a non-denominational church the pastor is the top of the hierarchy.
If only you knew what I knew…
No. But I do have a book that says the world is going to end in 1988.
The 60s and 70s edition of the Late Great Planet Earth said that Jesus would come one generation after the founding of the state of Israel and that a Biblical Generation was 40 years. I understand that the revised edition of this masterpiece had a change in heart.
You have not heard my “I was abducted by aliens” story. I had a project manager of mine believing this.
I talked with Him this morning, I don’t claim to be a prophet.
Well somewhere in my library I have an old book by David Wilkinson called “The Vision” where he claimed to see the future. I should go back and check out how accurate it was. I hope it was more so than my 60s Late Great Planet Earth.
Actually that is an interesting question I read a debate on. I have my doubts but I dunno.
Well I can I suppose. But they don’t speak back to me.
My mom can witness to the fact that when I was 4-5 I prayed for my cat that had distemper (which is fatal in cats). My cat was healed.
However, that seems to have been it for me.
I have heard convincing testimonies of the miraculous and have no doubts that is still occurs.
No more than it teaches about the other 7-8 churches in my community which is next to nothing. In a few sermons I heard my pastor reference St. Theresa and St. Patrick in positive lights.
Does that count.
I haven’t looked at this thread in a while and when I came across this post of yours… it cracked me up…
Is there really…exactly … 7,346,123 different Christian denomination now? I thought it was 7,346,122.
Peace
C
Curious
Guest
Hey Jimmy,Peace
You’re right - I don’t know much about that. I thought that maybe a couple of the “high” Protestant churches do confession…maybe Anglicans and/or Lutheran? I could be wrong.
My background is “low” church - non-denom, charismatic stuff. The only confession I know anything about is Catholic.
Curious
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Are there any Anglicans or Lutherans here that can explain Anglican or Lutheran “Confession”? Thanks
P
ponyman
Guest
Thaks for writing back Jimmy. I hope that your journey is going well.
I would ask that everyone remember my dear mother in prayer as she very sick and will probably be passing in the very near future. She has been living on borrowed time for a long while and God has provided for her but now the moment is approaching when she will meet God. We will all come to this moment and I pray that she will have a peaceful passing and a joyous eternity in Heaven. Please keep her in your prayers.
Thanks,
Ponyman
I would ask that everyone remember my dear mother in prayer as she very sick and will probably be passing in the very near future. She has been living on borrowed time for a long while and God has provided for her but now the moment is approaching when she will meet God. We will all come to this moment and I pray that she will have a peaceful passing and a joyous eternity in Heaven. Please keep her in your prayers.
Thanks,
Ponyman
E
emeraldcoast
Guest
Here is a quick outline of my Episcopal Faith.Are there any Anglicans or Lutherans here that can explain Anglican or Lutheran “Confession”? Thanks
episcopalchurch.org/visitors_10898_ENG_HTM.htm
Here is link to an Episcopal Priest, Father Matthew, explaining our Confession or Rite of Reconciliation .
youtube.com/watch?v=pbWH1yILLII
God Bless!
J
Jimmy_B
Guest
Hello, emeraldcoast and welcome to CAF.
I watched the video and I found it interesting. It was pretty much what I thought it was…a lot of similarities’ to Catholic Confession”. I didn’t know though, that the Episcopal “Confession” was called, “Reconciliation and the Penitent”, I hope I got that right. The Catholic Church calls “Confession”, “Penance and Reconciliation”.
With your background, you are going to make a Great Roman Catholic.
Peace
- Status