If you're not miserable, you're doing it wrong?

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I hear that all the time. Why should I have to make all the effort? Isn’t He the all-powerful and all-loving?

I suggest you answer this in private (if you were planning on answering), it’s not fair to the OP to sabotage her post
 
Curious11 said:
I hear that all the time. Why should I have to make all the effort? Isn’t He the all-powerful and all-loving?
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He gave up His only son to suffer and die for us. Is that not proof of His love for us? And in the face of His sacrifice for us are we to begrudge a few minutes prayer as too much effort on our part?
 
Brendan_64 said:
It isn’t like going to the gym and working out in order to gain something.
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I disagree with this. I gain a deeper relationship with God. I also gain insights about all kinds of things, such as how to approach issues and ptoblems in my life. And we grow in love.

I talk to my husband about a lot of personal things, and by doing so I gain a better relationship with him, a better understanding of him and me, insights about our relationship and how to solve problems, we grow in love.

These are gains. Positives on the bottom line. I don’t know how it is helpful to say we don’t get benefits or don’t do these things to get benefits. If we are not seeking the benefit for ourselves, we’re seeking it to benefit the other person (spouse or God) in the relationship, or to benefit third parties (our other family members like parents or kids, the community, the world, souls in Purgatory etc).

As a businessperson, I do things that benefit me or others. It would be dumb to do harmful things. If something isn’t benefiting me or others i want it to benefit, or the benefits aren’t readily apparent, then I either need to look deeper to see if I’m missing something, hang in there and keep plugging away (in Catholic terms this would in its most extreme application be hanging in there waiting for heavenly reward) or change my approach.

This is a model that works for me. Somebody else who’s not into business models can make up their own if it helps. All I know is, I pray regularly, I feel better, it helps. I get other benefits too that I don’t discuss here.
 
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There is a lot of merit in what you say and I agree we do benefit, but when we do things for our spouse for example is our aim to benefit ourselves, or do we do it out of love for the other person? When we go to the gym we are putting in the effort with an aim to benefit ourselves.
 
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One could argue that staying healthy benefits more people than just ourself.
We’re less of a burden on our families, more able to play with our kids, go on outings with our spouse, more energy generally.
We’re more alert and efficient at work, fewer sick days, less cost to the insurance program and society for our health care.

If you were just working out to show off big muscles at the beach and be admired, that would be like hypocrites who pray on street corners. But getting healthy generally has wide benefits, as does getting spiritually healthy generally.
 
I joined a gym once, my motivation was to keep fit and develop muscle. I left after a few months as the tedium of going through boring routines was too much for me.
 
I have heard there are three levels of sanctification, regularly mortal sinning, less so, and bettering small imperfections.
 
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/14254a.htm

Spiritual dryness can be caused by our sins, tiredness etc. It can be manifested as being bored in prayer, not feeling consolation etc. But dryness can also come without person doing anything wrong, if a person is faithful to prayer, meditation, avoiding sin and doesn’t sin mortally, but still feels dryness. When such desolations last for a longer time period, we call them dark nights or passive purgations. You can read about it on the link I’ve put above. Dark night of senses is a period of spiritual growth which God permits in order to purify soul the more. It happens after a soul has been faithful for a certain period of time in prayer, mortification and avoiding willful venial sins.
Therefore, dryness is common in spiritual growth, but before dark night of senses (3rd mension in St Teresa’s Interior Castle) or in the beginnings of spiritual growth there may be a longer period of consolations.
Spiritual desolation is not the same as depression.
 
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@Tis_Bearself , this seems to be very confusing for you and others as well, judging by the comments. Looking back at your original post, I started getting confused too, and then I realized something.

God is not confused, ever. So you don’t know about desolation or dryness or how these things might or might not apply to you, but God does! He knows what’s going on, and what you need, and what you don’t need, and whether or not you would benefit from understanding anything. So maybe what he’s asking you to do is give your un-knowing to him, and just let him do the knowing.

All you have to know is that He’s taking care of you and He never makes a mistake. I hope you can get some peace from that.
 
🤣 On the other hand - maybe Job just needed opioids. Talk about a debbie downer. Ditto Ecclesiastes and some of those wacko depressing Psalmists. Good God, what was the issue there.
 
Asking the question about doing something wrong on the basis of feelings is a pit. The right rule of reason relies on faith - “we walk by faith and not by sight” (2 Cor 5:7).
A blogger wrote:
“Blessed are the pure of heart for they shall see God.” St. Augustine explains that “the eyes by which God is seen are within the heart.” As if he is speaking to our age he admonishes, “how foolish then are those who try to find God through the use of their bodily eyes!” We must walk by faith not by sight. The purification of our hearts is the true end of our love which will allow us to see God clearly. The brightness of the true light will not be able to be seen by the unclean sight: and that which is joy to minds that are clean, will be a punishment to those that are tarnished. St. Augustine explains, “A simple heart is a heart that is pure; and, just as the light which surrounds us cannot be seen except through eyes that are clear, so neither is God seen unless that through which He can be seen is pure."

St. Bonaventure taught that the soul takes things in through the senses. God in his measure draws us away from things that can be seen and felt (like food), to develop a love of the unseen. By misery, the Lord pricks the conscience and/or the senses to make a soul more simple. To love only the unseen, and to be edified by the sight of a poor neighbor - for sake of grasping the unseen as it is seen.

Pope Francis speaks much on joy. And this so true to the very simple soul who finds joy in everything, because it was tested and made more simple by interior victory. Simple in that all that she loves is the unseen God in all that is presented to her.

“But my just man liveth by faith; but if he withdraw himself, he shall not please my soul.” (Heb 10:38)
“Our moral life has its source in faith in God who reveals his love to us. St. Paul speaks of the “obedience of faith” as our first obligation. He shows that “ignorance of God” is the principle and explanation of all moral deviations. Our duty toward God is to believe in him and to bear witness to him.” (CCC 2087)
 
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Golly, you struck a chord. Many years ago I moved with my young family to the place my DH was from. Not many Catholics around at all. Out in the woods, not many people around either… I was happy but something was missing. (My safety net of a family probably.) I wasn’t really strong in the faith because I let DH take the lead and he wasn’t strong at all. I think the Lord led me to the desert so I could see what I was missing… It wasn’t very long, and after a LOT of prayers we had our marriage blessed in the Catholic church. Since that time of the desert my faith has grown. God does have a plan for each of us. I know he’s still working with me and my family.
 
I was just reading in William Barry and William Connolly “The Practice of Spiritual Direction”:

“When we are expressing attitudes that are real and deep within us and relevant to our lives, prayer will be alive and engaging.”

In other words dryness can be cause by us not wanting to be open with God or not wanting to hear what God might be telling us.

What do you think?
 
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I haven’t read that book, but I agree with what you wrote, i.e. that dryness can be caused by our unwillingness to cooperate with God. There can be multiple causes of dryness, natural (like tiredness, sickness), our sins, and sometimes supernatural causes (when God wants to purify us and withdraws His consolations, that is dark night).
 
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