Ignatian Epistles- all forgeries?

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MiriamPhilomena

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Greetings!
To put a long story short, a friend and I got into a little scuffle over church history. I’m not very knowledgeable in this regard, so I was a little overwhelmed when she sent me a few links:

http://www.bible.ca/history-ignatius-forgeries-250AD.htm
http://historical-jesus.info/ignatius.html

When I copy-pasted the quote where Ignatius speaks of the Eucharist, she sent me these in reply. I realize the first website is an anti-catholic website, but the second is from a site I’ve never heard of before. Could anyone help me formulate a rebuttal for her?

Many thanks!
 
Oh, my bad. I’m speaking of Ignatius of Antioch, not Ignatius of Loyala. I should have clarified.
 
The only question about St. Ig of Antioch’s letters is whether you are using the short version (everybody scholarly says they are authentic) or the long version (probably another early Christian adding his thoughts to his copy of St. Ig).

The short version is plenty eloquent about the Eucharist being Christ, and not a symbol. So your friend is wrong.
 
There are 16 total extant Ignatian Epistles. 7 are authentic, and 9 pseudo-Ignatian written between the 3rd - 6th centuries.

I suspect the Epistle which you are speaking of is one of his genuine Epistles, but without a citation it’s impossible for me to verify that.

His 7 genuine Epistles:

The Letter to the Ephesians,
The Letter to the Magnesians,
The Letter to the Trallians,
The Letter to the Romans,
The Letter to the Philadelphians,
The Letter to the Smyrnaeans,
The Letter to Polycarp, Bishop of Smyrna.

The 9 pseudo-Ignatian’s:

Epistle to the Tarsians;
Epistle to the Antiochians;
Epistle to Hero, a Deacon of Antioch;
Epistle to the Philippians;
The Epistle of Maria the Proselyte to Ignatius;
Epistle to Mary at Neapolis, Zarbus;
First Epistle to St. John;
Second Epistle to St. John;
The Epistle of Ignatius to the Virgin Mary.

I think this is probably what you’re quoting:

“Take note of those who hold heterodox opinions on the grace of Jesus Christ which has come to us, and see how contrary their opinions are to the mind of God … They abstain from the Eucharist and from prayer because they do not confess that the Eucharist is the flesh of our Savior Jesus Christ, flesh which suffered for our sins and which that Father, in his goodness, raised up again. They who deny the gift of God are perishing in their disputes.” — Letter to the Smyrnaeans 6:2–7:1.

Which is definitely a genuine Ignatian text, and NOT an interpolation or pseudepigraphic forgery.
 
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Yes, that is the quote I’ve posted, but she argues that all texts regardless are forgeries. From what I understand the authenticity of these texts are crucial, as in Ignatius we observe the beginnings of the Development of Doctrine. Newmann wrote a whole essay on this subject based on his writings.

I suppose it doesn’t matter much, however, there are always other church fathers to go off, I guess.
 
Inform her your quote is from an epistle not in dispute, perhaps if the thread could get a good source for that it’d help.

Of course it may be an issue with will.
 
MiriamPhilomena said:
Yes, that is the quote I’ve posted, but she argues that all texts regardless are forgeries.
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No scholar would agree with her.

If all the Ignatian texts are forgeries, then the New Testament itself is no more trustworthy.
 
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