I'm a confused atheist

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Hello everyone and Merry Christmas.
I feel the need to share my experiences from the last few days with you.

Previously, usemelord wrote:
I, too, am thrilled out of my mind for Pi314 and Erethorn.
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While I know you mean good, I still can’t help thinking that you wouldn’t be so trilled if you knew what I’m going through right now. In short, I’m an emotional wreck.

The Christmas Mass was incredible. I was suprised to see that it was in Latin. To say it was beautiful would be an understatement. Halfway through the Mass I was crying. When the congregation lined up to receive the Eucharist, I fell on my knees and asked Jesus to be born in my heart as well as in the world.

But ever since that night, my faith seems to be rapidly disolving.
Whether I’m in Church, or praying, all the atheist arguments keep piling up in my head. I feel literally torn between what I used to believe and what I was starting to believe, between the hope for truth and a horrible fear that the Truth is nothing but an illusion, and a destructive one at that.

Today, after Mass, I was praying to God, Jesus Christ and the Blessed Virgin. I feel honesty is extremely important, so I said to them something like: *“My faith is fading. I don’t know if you and the whole story is true anymore. I feel I might simply cease to believe. Perhaps my faith will come back one day”. *

And then it dawned on me that, if the whole story IS true, than leaving God like that would certainly make Him, and His Son, and the Blessed Virgin, suffer greatly.

And if I decided to act on my lack of faith now, and somewhere down the line I would have to come back, it would be the worst possible experience to have to explain Them why I left now. If I ever had to come back and hear, in my heart or perhaps even face to face, the Blessed Mother asking “Why did you leave me and my Son, after knowing Him, how could you hurt us that way ?” then I would simply die of shame and grief, and I would go to Hell, on my own accord, so that I would never have to face Them again.

And once I came to that conclusion, I begged the Lord not to let me go, to hold me by force if necessary, to embrace me or to chain me so that I would not be able to deny Him, ever.

And it still didn’t feel like it was enough, and the doubts were still there, and my feelings turned to anger, and I addressed Them again, this time in a sort of defiance: “*and if by any chance you people are not real, then I will hold on to you as if you were real, and I will make you real, or at least do everything in my power for it to be so, because I need you to be real, and the world in which my son will grow up and live needs you to be real, and if ever there was a product of human imagination that deserves to become real it is You, and Your teachings and Your story.”
*
So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier.
 
*So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier. *

Jesus is not pain and anger.

I think there is a battle going on for your soul. Good always wins.

I believe the prayer of an athiest is heard above all else. Dont let evil even think it has a chance of succeeding.
 
Erethorn said:
Hello everyone and Merry Christmas.
I feel the need to share my experiences from the last few days with you.

Previously, usemelord wrote:

While I know you mean good, I still can’t help thinking that you wouldn’t be so trilled if you knew what I’m going through right now. In short, I’m an emotional wreck.

The Christmas Mass was incredible. I was suprised to see that it was in Latin. To say it was beautiful would be an understatement. Halfway through the Mass I was crying. When the congregation lined up to receive the Eucharist, I fell on my knees and asked Jesus to be born in my heart as well as in the world.

But ever since that night, my faith seems to be rapidly disolving.
Whether I’m in Church, or praying, all the atheist arguments keep piling up in my head. I feel literally torn between what I used to believe and what I was starting to believe, between the hope for truth and a horrible fear that the Truth is nothing but an illusion, and a destructive one at that.

Today, after Mass, I was praying to God, Jesus Christ and the Blessed Virgin. I feel honesty is extremely important, so I said to them something like: *“My faith is fading. I don’t know if you and the whole story is true anymore. I feel I might simply cease to believe. Perhaps my faith will come back one day”. *

And then it dawned on me that, if the whole story IS true, than leaving God like that would certainly make Him, and His Son, and the Blessed Virgin, suffer greatly.

And if I decided to act on my lack of faith now, and somewhere down the line I would have to come back, it would be the worst possible experience to have to explain Them why I left now. If I ever had to come back and hear, in my heart or perhaps even face to face, the Blessed Mother asking “Why did you leave me and my Son, after knowing Him, how could you hurt us that way ?” then I would simply die of shame and grief, and I would go to Hell, on my own accord, so that I would never have to face Them again.

And once I came to that conclusion, I begged the Lord not to let me go, to hold me by force if necessary, to embrace me or to chain me so that I would not be able to deny Him, ever.

And it still didn’t feel like it was enough, and the doubts were still there, and my feelings turned to anger, and I addressed Them again, this time in a sort of defiance: “*and if by any chance you people are not real, then I will hold on to you as if you were real, and I will make you real, or at least do everything in my power for it to be so, because I need you to be real, and the world in which my son will grow up and live needs you to be real, and if ever there was a product of human imagination that deserves to become real it is You, and Your teachings and Your story.”
*
So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier.
Click to expand...
Faith is a scary thing in a way-because part of it has to come from our side-the part that says “yes”. But “no” may be less of an option than you might be tempted to think. In any case the struggle is there-it’s there for all of us and for the moment the “other side” is given a bit more access in you now to intensify that struggle and test the triumph God has apparently won in your heart. But this, too, will more than likely pass.

Anyway, sometimes we need to be in the depths of despair before we’re motivated to pray; those times are, in fact, a test to see if we’ll call out to God. And when we do, He answers, although we may not even be capable of thinking there’s any reason for hope at the time-and the answer often surprises when it becomes obvious a bit later. We can pray for faith, like the father of the sick child who said, **“Lord, I believe; help my unbelief!” **. I really like that one. Anyway, I’ll pray for you, too.
 
Erethorn, don’t be disheartened about the emotional roller coaster you’re experiencing right now. It’s normal since you are going from one extreme to another spiritually speaking; from a total absence of spirituality to a search for the connection to your Creator with whom you haven’t yet had a relationship. Just let things happen and don’t try to over-analyze the situation. Of course, atheism was easier; it doesn’t take a genius to deny the existence of God because it requires nothing OF you. That is, you have nothing vested. On the other hand, all God asks OF you is your obedience and love. Now that doesn’t sound too difficult, does it?
 
Erethorn said:
Hello everyone and Merry Christmas.
I feel the need to share my experiences from the last few days with you.

Previously, usemelord wrote:

While I know you mean good, I still can’t help thinking that you wouldn’t be so trilled if you knew what I’m going through right now. In short, I’m an emotional wreck.

The Christmas Mass was incredible. I was suprised to see that it was in Latin. To say it was beautiful would be an understatement. Halfway through the Mass I was crying. When the congregation lined up to receive the Eucharist, I fell on my knees and asked Jesus to be born in my heart as well as in the world.

But ever since that night, my faith seems to be rapidly disolving.
Whether I’m in Church, or praying, all the atheist arguments keep piling up in my head. I feel literally torn between what I used to believe and what I was starting to believe, between the hope for truth and a horrible fear that the Truth is nothing but an illusion, and a destructive one at that.

Today, after Mass, I was praying to God, Jesus Christ and the Blessed Virgin. I feel honesty is extremely important, so I said to them something like: *“My faith is fading. I don’t know if you and the whole story is true anymore. I feel I might simply cease to believe. Perhaps my faith will come back one day”. *

And then it dawned on me that, if the whole story IS true, than leaving God like that would certainly make Him, and His Son, and the Blessed Virgin, suffer greatly.

And if I decided to act on my lack of faith now, and somewhere down the line I would have to come back, it would be the worst possible experience to have to explain Them why I left now. If I ever had to come back and hear, in my heart or perhaps even face to face, the Blessed Mother asking “Why did you leave me and my Son, after knowing Him, how could you hurt us that way ?” then I would simply die of shame and grief, and I would go to Hell, on my own accord, so that I would never have to face Them again.

And once I came to that conclusion, I begged the Lord not to let me go, to hold me by force if necessary, to embrace me or to chain me so that I would not be able to deny Him, ever.

And it still didn’t feel like it was enough, and the doubts were still there, and my feelings turned to anger, and I addressed Them again, this time in a sort of defiance: “*and if by any chance you people are not real, then I will hold on to you as if you were real, and I will make you real, or at least do everything in my power for it to be so, because I need you to be real, and the world in which my son will grow up and live needs you to be real, and if ever there was a product of human imagination that deserves to become real it is You, and Your teachings and Your story.”
*
So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier.
Click to expand...
Hi,

We all go through these emotions and experiences. I think one thing that can be said in truth is and I hold to this truth when I am having doubts or problems or questions, as I really am now also, if you are missing the presence of God, which is what this seems like by what you are saying, then you had to experience Him at Christmas Mass. If you never have an experience of something, how is all truth can you explain to yourself that you miss it. If I never experienced skydiving, how can I miss it. When these dark moments come, as they will, this is what I return to. I know if I have never experienced God’s love and presence, then I could never truly miss what I have not experienced. I hope this thought will help you to know that God is there, but the feeling is not there or as strong. Feeling can be misleading. I had lots of problems with this myself. But I know that once your truly experience God and He allows you to know His presence that truth will never fail that He is truly there with you although the feelings may be withdrawn. I can have a candy bar for a child and not give it to him, but it doesn’t mean that I don’t possess the candy bar, I just chose not to let him have it at that particular moment in time. I hope this will help you.
 
Erethorn said:
Hello everyone and Merry Christmas.
I feel the need to share my experiences from the last few days with you.

Previously, usemelord wrote:

While I know you mean good, I still can’t help thinking that you wouldn’t be so trilled if you knew what I’m going through right now. In short, I’m an emotional wreck.

The Christmas Mass was incredible. I was suprised to see that it was in Latin. To say it was beautiful would be an understatement. Halfway through the Mass I was crying. When the congregation lined up to receive the Eucharist, I fell on my knees and asked Jesus to be born in my heart as well as in the world.

But ever since that night, my faith seems to be rapidly disolving.
Whether I’m in Church, or praying, all the atheist arguments keep piling up in my head. I feel literally torn between what I used to believe and what I was starting to believe, between the hope for truth and a horrible fear that the Truth is nothing but an illusion, and a destructive one at that.

Today, after Mass, I was praying to God, Jesus Christ and the Blessed Virgin. I feel honesty is extremely important, so I said to them something like: *“My faith is fading. I don’t know if you and the whole story is true anymore. I feel I might simply cease to believe. Perhaps my faith will come back one day”. *

And then it dawned on me that, if the whole story IS true, than leaving God like that would certainly make Him, and His Son, and the Blessed Virgin, suffer greatly.

And if I decided to act on my lack of faith now, and somewhere down the line I would have to come back, it would be the worst possible experience to have to explain Them why I left now. If I ever had to come back and hear, in my heart or perhaps even face to face, the Blessed Mother asking “Why did you leave me and my Son, after knowing Him, how could you hurt us that way ?” then I would simply die of shame and grief, and I would go to Hell, on my own accord, so that I would never have to face Them again.

And once I came to that conclusion, I begged the Lord not to let me go, to hold me by force if necessary, to embrace me or to chain me so that I would not be able to deny Him, ever.

And it still didn’t feel like it was enough, and the doubts were still there, and my feelings turned to anger, and I addressed Them again, this time in a sort of defiance: “*and if by any chance you people are not real, then I will hold on to you as if you were real, and I will make you real, or at least do everything in my power for it to be so, because I need you to be real, and the world in which my son will grow up and live needs you to be real, and if ever there was a product of human imagination that deserves to become real it is You, and Your teachings and Your story.”
*
So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier.
Click to expand...
Greetings and well-met! I am a former atheist, Erethorn, and the Lord conquered my heart much the way you describe he is doing to you. Your post gives me chills–in a good way, because I know those prayers you have said: I’ve prayed them myself. Sometimes it feels as if your faith is nothing but suffering, and pain, and fear. It’s not always easy, it’s not always clear cut. Sometimes it’s just this knowing that He is there, but beyond that, it’s all that I know. Sometimes everything is dark, and the knowing is all that I have. And later on, when my mind clears from whatever is causing me torment in my faith, I think “Well, of course it’s logical to believe in God, because of A,B,C, and X, Y, Z.”

And don’t be afraid of doubt. Don’t be afraid to ask questions–especially of God. He can take it. He’ll answer them. The doubt makes you ask the questions that end up strengthening your faith. It makes you grow.

Your prayer has already been answered with a resounding “YES.” Maybe you need someone to tell you that. 🤷 Please don’t take offense to that, because sometimes we all need someone to affirm something in us. That is why a Church, a community of believers. We need each other.
 
What a beautiful string. I feel like a song:

The LORD is miraculous in all His ways.
His love is unending.
There are so few words we can use these days
To resolve the messages He’s sending

One thing I know is true my brother
Our God is love of which we are cloned
And through love we know one another
So by our neighbor we are known

Not a sacrifice or an offering, He ask
But a humble heart instead
Listen to Him, the truth, and that task
That is spinning around in your head

Will be the voice of you Maker
And you, held high as human made
By the blood of the one forsaken,
Will know why such a price was paid

The people we are made is for Glory
Of the one who delivers peace
So do not ask who you are
To fulfill for Him our life’s story
Began with a shining star
That brought kings on their knees from the East

Our callings in life can be strong, they should be. Go with it. Poor Saul was the biggest hypocrite of them all, I would think, and look at the zeal he took up his ministry! Yes, one touch from the LORD can do great things. Nothing is impossible for God. And what is it you truly fear? With God on your side, who should you fear? Is there anyone that say anything to you or about you that will take you away from the love you are feeling inside for God? I would say not. Persecutions and people saying bad things about you, all for the name of Christ is a blessing and leads to ultimate happiness! Do not fear the future if you put your trust in the Lord, that is a sure thing!
Psalm 95:7-8
7 for he is our God
and we are the people of his pasture,
the flock under his care.
Today, if you hear his voice,
8 do not harden your hearts

We are all called for a purpose, yours has just touched me and so your ministry has begun. Continue it with the lamp at your feet. Whether you look to your left or your right, you will hear that voice behind you saying, “Walk this way” and know that it is the voice of the LORD.

Peace, love, and enthusiasm to you all.

In Jesus Christ’s Holy name, mighty to save, I pray for everyone.

Christian Love
 
I wish to thank everyone who has posted, you have been of great help.

However, problems still arise for me, and, at times, from completely unexpected sources.

I’ve said before that, ironically, the post of an atheist has served to strengthen my faith.
Now i find my self in a position where, again - ironically - the posts of Christians serve to weaken it.

Let me explain. I’m not talking about the ones who post here, on this thread and this forum. I’m talking about another forum, an Eastern Orthodox forum in my country (Romania).

I happened there almost by chance, and I immediately felt a whole lot of outright hostility towards Catholicism. I’m talking about a subforum dedicated to the Roman Catholic Church, which was inundated with threads attacking the Catholic Church.

A Catholic would start a thread, dealing with, let’s say, the Blessed Virgin, and some Orthodox posters would immediately start attacking the OP, calling him/her a heretic, worse than an atheist, calling the Pope the antichrist and so on.

And now comes the interesting part, where the intolerance and bigotry of some Orthodox people posting on a Romanian forum interferes with my new found Catholic faith.

I can clearly and objectively see the bigotry, the wrongness of attitudes like “we are the only ones that have the truth, you papist heretics are worse than heathens”. It makes me sad and mad at the same time.

BUT, at the same time, it makes me wonder: *"What if Catholics are in fact the same ? What if I’m seeing the whole matter through a pair of, let’s say, Catholic coloured glasses that makes me blind to Catholic intolerance but keeps the intolerance of others in plain sight ?

What if the Orthodox, or Protestant, or Muslim, feel the same bigotry and intolerance directed toward them, when they come into contact with Catholics ?"*

I know I don’t FEEL like that. I feel and I think that this forum, other Catholic forums, catholic people and the Catholic Church in general are much more tolerant towards people (if not necessarily towards their sins and wrong ideas) than the kind of narrow minded people I mentioned earlier. But there’s this little demon (figuratively speaking) in my mind that keeps asking “what if that’s true, what if you’ve become just as intolerant and you fail to see it objectively ?! What if their all the same, Catholics, Jehova’s witnesses, Eastern Orthodox and so on ?”

I don’t know if the above makes much sense, but thanks for reading anyway. I also prayed about it and it seemed to help.

God bless.
 
Erethorn said:
I wish to thank everyone who has posted, you have been of great help.

However, problems still arise for me, and, at times, from completely unexpected sources.

I’ve said before that, ironically, the post of an atheist has served to strengthen my faith.
Now i find my self in a position where, again - ironically - the posts of Christians serve to weaken it.

Let me explain. I’m not talking about the ones who post here, on this thread and this forum. I’m talking about another forum, an Eastern Orthodox forum in my country (Romania).

I happened there almost by chance, and I immediately felt a whole lot of outright hostility towards Catholicism. I’m talking about a subforum dedicated to the Roman Catholic Church, which was inundated with threads attacking the Catholic Church.

A Catholic would start a thread, dealing with, let’s say, the Blessed Virgin, and some Orthodox posters would immediately start attacking the OP, calling him/her a heretic, worse than an atheist, calling the Pope the antichrist and so on.

And now comes the interesting part, where the intolerance and bigotry of some Orthodox people posting on a Romanian forum interferes with my new found Catholic faith.

I can clearly and objectively see the bigotry, the wrongness of attitudes like “we are the only ones that have the truth, you papist heretics are worse than heathens”. It makes me sad and mad at the same time.

BUT, at the same time, it makes me wonder: *"What if Catholics are in fact the same ? What if I’m seeing the whole matter through a pair of, let’s say, Catholic coloured glasses that makes me blind to Catholic intolerance but keeps the intolerance of others in plain sight ?

What if the Orthodox, or Protestant, or Muslim, feel the same bigotry and intolerance directed toward them, when they come into contact with Catholics ?"*

I know I don’t FEEL like that. I feel and I think that this forum, other Catholic forums, catholic people and the Catholic Church in general are much more tolerant towards people (if not necessarily towards their sins and wrong ideas) than the kind of narrow minded people I mentioned earlier. But there’s this little demon (figuratively speaking) in my mind that keeps asking “what if that’s true, what if you’ve become just as intolerant and you fail to see it objectively ?! What if their all the same, Catholics, Jehova’s witnesses, Eastern Orthodox and so on ?”

I don’t know if the above makes much sense, but thanks for reading anyway. I also prayed about it and it seemed to help.

God bless.
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You need to continue to pray and also study. We can ask, “what if?” about anything that purports to be the truth but that doesn’t mean there is no truth-and we must trust that God will continue to lead us into it as we continue to ask with an open heart.

Whenever I was challenged by a particular system of belief, I studied their material, rather than avoid it. With truth we have nothing to fear, we never need be concerned that the “other side” might be right because, if they are, then we’ll agree with them and will only benefit by it. Trust God, not man, and do your part-pray and study-and He’ll get you there.
 
Erethorn, I appreciate your dilemma and hear you loud and clear. I’ve been a Christian all my life (65 yrs.) and came into the Catholic Church nearly five years ago. I can honestly say that when I was a non-Catholic Christian, I had a boatload of doubts about Catholicism and was, like you have described of others you’ve encountered, intolerant of Catholics. However, after coming into the Catholic faith, I am happy to report that most all of the Catholics I know are completely tolerant and welcoming of other faiths, especially Christians, of course. I attend an ecumenical Christian men’s group every Wednesday morning and there are men from all different kinds of Christian churches—Bible church, Baptist church, community church, etc. and we all get along quite nicely because we share common interests which, of course, is our undying love of God and devotion to Christ. Also, I have to mention that in October I went on a trip to Turkey and Greece with a Bible study group of about forty people. Our guide in Turkey was a Muslim lady for the six days we were in Turkey. She was an absolutely fabulous guide and everyone in our group fell in love with her, and she with us. If you think about it, Jesus would be very sad, indeed, of intolerance. In fact, it is very unChristian to not be tolerant of the faith of others. We are all called to grow the Kingdom which cannot be accomplished without being welcoming of everyone with whom we are in contact daily. I hope these words helped even a little bit.
 
I have been full blown Catholic for 2 years… before that I just didnt care… not an athiest… just didnt care.

My Grandma was a Methodist and a true Christian in every sense of the word. She loved Jesus and when she died her bible was full of people she was praying for.
My aunt was a penticostal (spell) a very odd christian sect but she would have given the shirt off her back and she was, in my opinion, everything Jesus would be proud of seeing in us. My grandfather was a Catholic, a good and faithful Catholic who loved God and his Catholic church.

I always imagine Jesus patting them on the back when they died and saying "good job’.

My ex father in law is a non denominational minister and the biggest hypocrite I have ever met in my life. A mean and hateful person inside and out. He hates Catholics and never misses an opoortunity to bash a Catholic.

It all depends on the person, I believe.
 
Erethorn,

thank you for being so open with us! What you are facing is so normal. I’ve been through it too. Don’t be discouraged!! It’s always difficult to go through changes like these. Even when I was already a Christian but coming to Catholicism, it was very trying, emotionally. But just think…if God is real, so is the devil. And if the devil is real, he would do anything to keep us from God and from faith… especially if you’re just finding your faith! Remember that he can’t interfere with our free will, no matter how much temptation we face. Faith in the end is a choice. I’ve chosen to believe in Jesus and I’m not letting go no matter how much I’m going through.

I want to tell you about something that once happened to me. This was around a year ago… I was already a Christian and on my way to Catholicism. I considered my faith in God to be strong. When I first started believing, I wasn’t entirely sure… but as I gained experience with God, and knowing Him, His existence became like a fact to me, it was so obvious. But I wasn’t at all prepared for this trial I went through. I suddenly started feeling this horrible doubts about God. VERY strong doubts. They can out of nowhere! It was so difficult to hold on. I actually prayed the same thing - i kept on repeating to God, “don’t let go of me” - because I didn’t know how to keep believing. Everything in me was going against my faith… I believed through choice alone. I’ll never forget that hour.

Then, I went upstairs to my room, fell on my knees, and started begging God to help me. I opened a book I have - “Divine Mercy In My Soul” by St Faustina - and my eyes fell upon this sentence: (Jesus speaking to her in a vision) "Sooner would heaven and earth turn into nothingness than would My Mercy not embrace a trusting soul."

And right when I read those words, something amazing happened. Not only did ALL my doubts went away, as if they never even happened, but I was filled with this incredible joy. I felt so close to God and like He was healing me from everything I just went through.

I can’t explain this experience. I tried SO hard to stop doubting, and nothing helped, but God took it away in a second! But He only took it away after an hour. Not right away. I believe that God allows us to go through such times to make our faith grow. (if we don’t let go of it). What can be stronger than faith that’s not dependent on any feelings, but on choice alone? Nothing can break that faith. I believe the devil is attacking you but God can use these trials to help you grow. Yes being an atheist is easier, and as Christians we get attacked in more obvious ways. When I was an agnostic, I didn’t care about God, or sin, for that matter…and wasn’t repentant for anything. I see now I was headed towards hell. The devil had no reason to tempt me - I was already his. Now I belong to Christ, and these old ways don’t work on me anymore. So the attacks are worse. Some of the Saints were even physically attacked by the enemy.

but - God is stronger! He triumphed over all sin, all doubt, the enemy, darkness, and death - on the Cross.

What you’re going through is normal, but it won’t last forever. Just keep on going and this trial will end, and faith will be more of a joy. (actually, a great joy. I wouldn’t now trade it for anything.)

It’s strange cause sometimes it almost feels like we’re being carried through these experiences… we can’t always control them. It seems so obvious to me that God has called you to Himself. Now He’s refining you, and making you ready. It was tough for me too, and it was also difficult converting to Catholicism. When it actually happened though, He gave so much consolation and peace.

Maybe it would help you to read Paul’s letters 🙂

“Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will— to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves.”
Ephesians 1:3

God bless!
 
Monica4316 said:
Then, I went upstairs to my room, fell on my knees, and started begging God to help me. I opened a book I have - “Divine Mercy In My Soul” by St Faustina - and my eyes fell upon this sentence: (Jesus speaking to her in a vision) "Sooner would heaven and earth turn into nothingness than would My Mercy not embrace a trusting soul."
Click to expand...
Beautiful !!! Thank you for sharing it.
Divine Mercy in my Soul should be read by everyone.
 
Erethorn said:
I wish to thank everyone who has posted, you have been of great help.

However, problems still arise for me, and, at times, from completely unexpected sources.

I’ve said before that, ironically, the post of an atheist has served to strengthen my faith.
Now i find my self in a position where, again - ironically - the posts of Christians serve to weaken it.

Let me explain. I’m not talking about the ones who post here, on this thread and this forum. I’m talking about another forum, an Eastern Orthodox forum in my country (Romania).

I happened there almost by chance, and I immediately felt a whole lot of outright hostility towards Catholicism. I’m talking about a subforum dedicated to the Roman Catholic Church, which was inundated with threads attacking the Catholic Church.

A Catholic would start a thread, dealing with, let’s say, the Blessed Virgin, and some Orthodox posters would immediately start attacking the OP, calling him/her a heretic, worse than an atheist, calling the Pope the antichrist and so on.

And now comes the interesting part, where the intolerance and bigotry of some Orthodox people posting on a Romanian forum interferes with my new found Catholic faith.

I can clearly and objectively see the bigotry, the wrongness of attitudes like “we are the only ones that have the truth, you papist heretics are worse than heathens”. It makes me sad and mad at the same time.

BUT, at the same time, it makes me wonder: *"What if Catholics are in fact the same ? What if I’m seeing the whole matter through a pair of, let’s say, Catholic coloured glasses that makes me blind to Catholic intolerance but keeps the intolerance of others in plain sight ?

What if the Orthodox, or Protestant, or Muslim, feel the same bigotry and intolerance directed toward them, when they come into contact with Catholics ?"*

I know I don’t FEEL like that. I feel and I think that this forum, other Catholic forums, catholic people and the Catholic Church in general are much more tolerant towards people (if not necessarily towards their sins and wrong ideas) than the kind of narrow minded people I mentioned earlier. But there’s this little demon (figuratively speaking) in my mind that keeps asking “what if that’s true, what if you’ve become just as intolerant and you fail to see it objectively ?! What if their all the same, Catholics, Jehova’s witnesses, Eastern Orthodox and so on ?”

I don’t know if the above makes much sense, but thanks for reading anyway. I also prayed about it and it seemed to help.

God bless.
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Hi,

I kind of know what you’re going through here… I was baptized Eastern Orthodox as a child, and then became Protestant… when I finally found my home in the Catholic Church, I faced opposition from both Orthodox and Protestants. This really confused me and was difficult to deal with emotionally. But there were many Orthodox and Protestants who were understanding 🙂

here’s how I see it now. There are people like this in every church, there are also wonderful kind people in every church. We’re all at different levels and some are more naturally loving then others…what matters in Christianity is how much we grow from where we are. In addition, there are people in every church who don’t follow Christ’s teaching to love our neighbour and come across as angry, mean, rude, etc… this is unfortunate, but that’s how it is, because simply being a Christian doesn’t make us Saints. We should cooperate with His grace, as He transforms us. Only then will we grow. If people around us are saying hurtful things, as Christians we should be patient with them, remember our own sins, and pray for each other. I’ve struggled with being a loving person - it’s always a struggle, when it’s hard to love - and I’d be very sad if this affected someone’s faith in God. Try to look at the best examples of Christianity because they’re the ones who practiced what it actually teaches. These are of course, Christ, Mary, the Saints… 🙂

also keep in mind there are many good Christians out there. I’ve met many Catholics since my conversion, and almost all of them are kind patient people. Don’t get discouraged 🙂 there are also many great Orthodox and Protestants as well. God’s grace reaches us all. I believe the Catholic Church is true, but there’s truth in other churches too because of their link with Christ, and we’re all brothers and sisters in Him.

I had a thought, maybe you’d like this book by CS Lewis 🙂 especially the last few chapters.
philosophyforlife.com/mctoc.htm

God bless!
 
Pi314 said:
Wow! Lots of responses. Thanks to everyone. I’m not sure what to say.
This whole thing is confusing me, and I don’t need confusion right now.
I’m trying to just come to terms with God existing, which is difficult after so many years of thinking otherwise. I mean, why would I feel this way now, but not before?
I’m a science major, I’m supposed to think logically and not believe what can’t be observed. But I’m finding it harder to not see God in science, as backwards as that sounds.
It’s been a year since I guess I started believing in God, and it’s frustrating to not talk to anyone about it, not even be able to go to church because I’m so worried how other people would react. They’d consider it a bad thing, just like I would have a while back. But it doesn’t feel like I’m being sucked into something stupid, it feels right.
Sorry if I ramble when I type, I’m pretty tired.

Question - what is meant by cafeteria Catholic?
I’m definitely going to check out that blog too 🙂
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Hi Pi,
I think some people here suggested some good reading. Might I add to your already long reading list? 🙂 C.S. Lewis Mere Christianity and, if you have an ipod, there’s a priest here who’s talks are put on Ave maria radio. his name is father john riccardo and you can download his podcasts. Also you might want to read Francis Collins’ book * The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief

I very much recognize the place you’re in right now. I was an atheist and now I’m a Catholic. Going from a card carrying member of NOW, president of the atheist club at my university to adoration of the blessed sacrament…well, let’s just say that such a change can leave some people in shock.
BUT…i should add this. In this change I’ve had, there have been a couple of surprises, namely that I wasn’t as alone as I thought I was.
A friend of mine moved back into town after being away for a couple of years. Before he had moved away, we would go to the gay bars together, usually on stripper night. He called me his ‘litmus test’. If one of the dancers hit on me, clearly, they weren’t gay. If they didn’t, then that meant he would ask them to go home with him, and by home, I mean to the backseat of his Toyota Corolla. 🤷 So, he comes back to town and is showing me his new digs and right over his desk is an enormous picture of Jesus. It’s like HUGE. I remember that revered place. It used to be a picture of Godzilla. So, I motioned towards it and said ‘That’s new’ and he said ‘Oh yeah, uh, I’m a devout christian now. I attend church every week, go to bible study, live chastely. I know, I know, a little shocking’ and I was like ‘SHUT UP!! I’m a freaking Catholic!’ and we jumped around the room and squealed in very much the same way we did when we had gotten tickets to the Pet Shop Boys.
So, here he was scared to say anything to me for fear of being judged, and I was doing the same thing, and heere we had even more levels to connect on than we ever did before. Fancy that. Same thing happened with another friend of mine. We used to be bra burning feminists. Now we both do work with our local pregnancy counseling centers. She said what I was thinking ‘After the birth of my kid, I just could no longer believe that any developing embryo WASN’T a person.’ Again, she was afraid to say anything to me and I was afraid to say anything to her.
If I may make a suggestion…you might not want to mention any of this to your friends until you’ve explored these ideas more fully.
Listen, you’ve rejected God for a long time now, you owe it to yourself to fully understand exactly what it is that you’re rejecting, right? I mean, that’s your right. Study up on Christianity, know what it’s about. You’ll be surprised to say the least. And, as far as your friends go, you’d be surprised that they can forgive even this - even this the most heinous of things, which is, at least it was to my atheist friends, was to be one of those ‘blind sheep’ following christianity. They would have accepted ANYTHING I did, except that. 🤷 But you might be surprised, as I was, taht they were more forgiving than I thought they woudl be.
Also, when you happen to slip in ‘So I was at church and this lady said blah blah blah’ or whatever it is that happened…they get used to it. PM me if you’d like, okay? And God bless you on your journey, where ever it takes you. 🙂
 
What a tireless subject. You know, it really is what is in our hearts that matter the most. Of course, I am a Catholic and everyone tends to be a little theocentric. Catholics are the best! right? Well, yeah, I think that this is the true Church established by Christ, but you know, I read something the other day…and it made me think:

It was a story about a jew who always made fun of Catholics (or Christians in general). Never missed a chance to tell a joke about the “goys.” One day, a rabbi overheard him telling jokes and went over to him. He said, “Do you know why catholics tap the salt shaker on the side while we tap it on the bottom?” The younger jew smiled, anticipating a good laugh at the expense of the Catholics. “Why?” he asked. The rabbi simply answered, “to get the salt out.”

I struggle with the rules, regulations, some dogmas…I believe in them, pray for strength in my faith…search for God always, remembering where He found me not so long ago (agnostic) and never wanting to go back there; and, now, I am starting to realize that it is the heart where our Kingdom, His Kingdom, resides. Let all others say what they want, do what they want, seek who they seek, but treat all the way you would be treated. Listen with you heart and not your mind. Be open, like a child, and own nothing: no thoughts, no possesions, no upper hand on God…nothing…we are all His children.

I am confident that NO religion, including the Catholic Church (who admits it in the catechist) can describe God in speech, written language , or in any other symbology. Our divine revelation through creation, the word of God in the scripture, and faith in salvation Jesus Christ, the incarnate word of God, is all we need to carry on, no matter what our cross may be. Carry on! Struggles are met with joy! Especially struggles of our faith. Stay strong! Bless you.

Bless you all!
 
Erethorn said:
H
But ever since that night, my faith seems to be rapidly disolving.
Whether I’m in Church, or praying, all the atheist arguments keep piling up in my head. I feel literally torn between what I used to believe and what I was starting to believe, between the hope for truth and a horrible fear that the Truth is nothing but an illusion, and a destructive one at that.

Today, after Mass, I was praying to God, Jesus Christ and the Blessed Virgin. I feel honesty is extremely important, so I said to them something like: *“My faith is fading. I don’t know if you and the whole story is true anymore. I feel I might simply cease to believe. Perhaps my faith will come back one day”. *

And then it dawned on me that, if the whole story IS true, than leaving God like that would certainly make Him, and His Son, and the Blessed Virgin, suffer greatly.

And if I decided to act on my lack of faith now, and somewhere down the line I would have to come back, it would be the worst possible experience to have to explain Them why I left now. If I ever had to come back and hear, in my heart or perhaps even face to face, the Blessed Mother asking “Why did you leave me and my Son, after knowing Him, how could you hurt us that way ?” then I would simply die of shame and grief, and I would go to Hell, on my own accord, so that I would never have to face Them again.

And once I came to that conclusion, I begged the Lord not to let me go, to hold me by force if necessary, to embrace me or to chain me so that I would not be able to deny Him, ever.

…

So that’s where I stand now, not at all peaceful or happy. If Jesus does exist, and if He did hear my prayer on the Christmas night, then His presence in my heart takes, for the time being, the shape of doubt and fear and pain and anger.

Atheism was easier.
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Your post sounds very familiar … it reminds me of me, about a year ago. And at certain times since then. This is your first test, you have to fight through it. Faith is not an emotion, it is a choice. I always hated the idea of blind faith and I still think reason is very important and can be applied to spiritual matters, but at times when our reason is clouded and all we can do is remember the times when it all seemed so reasonable, then, we need to pray and trust blindly, even if we feel like it might rip us into shreds to do so. It can be very hard.
“What people don’t understand about religion is how much it costs. They think it is a big electric blanket, when in fact it is the cross.” -Flannery O’Connor
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Merry Christmas, Erethorn. Welcome to the battle. 😉
 
rwillenborg said:
Also you might want to read Francis Collins’ book * The Language of God: A Scientist Presents Evidence for Belief
)
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Funny you tied Mere Christianity together with Collins’

A quote from a review written by Catholic physicist Steven M. Barr:

It was in medical school that his (Collin’s) atheism suffered a blow: “I found the relationships * developed with sick and dying patients almost overwhelming.” The strength and solace so many of them derived from faith profoundly impressed him and left him thinking that “if faith was a psychological crutch . . . it must be a very powerful one.”

His “most awkward moment” came when an older woman, suffering from a severe and untreatable heart problem, asked him what he believed. “I felt my face flush as I stammered out the words ’I’m not really sure.’” Suddenly it was brought home to him that he had dismissed religion without ever really considering-or even knowing-the arguments in its favor. How could someone who prided himself on his scientific rationality do that? He was deeply shaken and felt impelled to carry out an honest and unprejudiced examination of religion.

Attempts to read the sacred scriptures of various world religions left him baffled, however, so he sought out a local Methodist minister and asked him point-blank “whether faith made any logical sense.” The minister took a book down from his shelf and handed it to him. It was C.S. Lewis’ Mere Christianity."

The complete review here:

payingattentiontothesky.com/book-review-the-language-of-god-by-francis-s-collins/

dj*
 
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